<p>Her S is a rising Sr at a good public school on Chicago’s north shore. UW gpa of 3.5 (mostly due to lack of interest in non-math classes), school does not rank, hardest math and science courses, and hard english. On cross country, does some sort of car building contest, but no other ECs to speak of. Is a URM. </p>
<p>Here’s the hitch - took ACT and got a 36 on the math, but only a 28 composite.</p>
<p>S is very, um, “chill” about the whole college thing and won’t be pinned down about any particular type, size, or location of college other than the fact that he does not want to attend U of I Urbana Champaign. The only thing he wants is an engineering program and thinks that Purdue, despite never having been there, is the place for him.</p>
<p>So here are the questions.</p>
<li><p>Does the 36 along with the URM put him in a whole different college pool? Like MIT for a super reach?</p></li>
<li><p>Should he take the ACT again and try for a higher composite?</p></li>
<li><p>Will the lack of ECs hurt?</p></li>
</ol>
<p>Any advice for my friend would be most helpful!</p>
<p>The 36 ACT Math with a 3.5 in HS classes (due to the <em>math</em> classes) makes his college application a little uneven. If nothing else, it screams "I don't care". That seems to match your description of the young man as "chill". </p>
<p>Maybe the whole college application hoop jumping is a slightly artificial way to match talented kids to colleges - but it is the one that is in place and in some ways justifiably (esp for highly competitive places) often weeds out those who just aren't making the effort.</p>
<p>1) Yes and no. If the student can put together a compelling application, with good recommendations and some really stellar essays, then some more competitive places may be interested. However, I think MIT is probably super-duper reach.</p>
<p>2) If he has the gumption, why not? It isn't that expensive. Taking it again (esp if he studies his weak areas) will only help if he can raise the score.</p>
<p>3) Yes. Yes. Yes. Again - screams "I don't care"</p>
<p>Advice: Have him look into solid state schools (not necessarily the flagship). He will probably do just fine. If he wants an elite type education, he may have to apply himself at whatever college he gets himself into and THEN transfer or go to grad school at an elite place.</p>
<p>Question: Why are those around this student so concerned about elite schools (like MIT) when his personality and where he is in life is pointing in another direction? 99% of college students go to everyday normal/good schools and do just fine. The elite schools are for... well... the motivated and driven student. This student doesn't match that profile, so why toss him into the deep end of the pool when he isn't ready to swim?</p>
<p>OP - I read your post differently. What I read was "36 on ACT math subpart, 3.5 GPA with all A's in math and science, and a mix of some A's and mostly B's in non-math/non-science subjects." Is this correct?</p>
<p>Oops, I think NewHope33 is correct. Too late for me to go back and edit my first post. Sorry!</p>
<p>1) I still think MIT is a super-duper reach, mostly because they have a very low admit rate (about 12%) and their average composite ACT is 31 - 34. It is not out of reach, just a big reach.</p>
<p>2) Yes. Try to retake it.</p>
<p>3) Lack of ECs still screams "I don't care". I don't know enough about MIT in terms of how they weight ECs, but most colleges seem to use ECs to figure out how well of a rounded student they'd be accepting. The student is competing with OTHER students who have his type of profile in ACT and school PLUS they have impressive ECs. Generally, it is better to have a few ECs that the student is passionate about than many filler ECs. Perhaps he can parlay his hobby into something very compelling - at this late stage, that is probably his best bet. Hit it with a great essay...</p>
<p>The general advice I gave still holds - look for a range of schools, including local state schools. Like everyone these days, need to apply to safeties, matches and reaches.</p>
<p>Question remains the same - why is a friend of the parent looking - and not the student himself? Still seems to be a mismatch between his level of interest in colleges vs those around him on his behalf!</p>
<p>Annika - I never thought about the whole "deep end of the pool" thing... it's a very valid concern. I plan to cut and paste this for the parent.</p>
<p>The reason that I'm asking for the parent is that I'm obsessed with CC and the parent is kind of overwhelmed so I offered to ask for any suggestions of schools or advice form the CCers</p>
<p>Most people (not those on this site) attend a school they did not visit before applying. For whatever reason, your friend says he knows Purdue is for him. He should apply to Purdue as soon as they open applications; he may hear back early and not have to apply anywhere else (the ultimate in chill.) If he doesn't hear back before the deadline to apply to other schools, he should apply to a few more state schools with solid engineering departments (like Iowa State). State school tend to be numbers driven i.e. they don't really care much about ECs, and the vast majority of U.S. engineers attended state schools, providing a large network of alums who are likely in a position to hire recent grads. I think your friend is smart and knows what he's doing.</p>
<p>Is there a reason the student doesn't want to go to the local flagship? It seems to me that students applying to college, by virtue of their age, tend to make decisions based on irrational ideas (so do adults, but we at least have a bit more experience that helps us temper these decisions). What is the student's main objection? Is it valid? (Btw - saying "it is too close to home" is not a valid objection... it is an irrational one for someone who isn't acting very motivated overall...).</p>
<p>Is there a way to get him hooked into the culture of the local college? An overnight stay in the dorms? Meeting with a math professor on campus? Sitting in on a couple of classes? All these can often be arranged in order to better help a student decide. </p>
<p>If the family lives on Chicago's north shore, UIUC and Purdue (West Lafayette, IN) would be about the same distance away for S. Granted with UIUC there would be in-state tuition, if that's a factor. As dntw8up stated, state schools don't usually care a great deal about EC's. Although, friend's S doesn't have a laundry list of the EC's, the one (car building) that he has is relevant to his desired major. It's obvious that math is his strength, again something relevant to his desired major. From where I sit, (just someone putting in her 2 cents worth) I think he would get in to Purdue if his GPA stays at or above the current level.</p>
<p>OK, I'm back. (Sorry, long evening of work.)</p>
<p>I think there will be many, many schools that would be interested in a young man with exceptional math test scores and math/science GPA --- URM or not. I think annika has adequately laid out The Devil's Advocate case, and it's important to know what your friend's S will be up against should he apply to MIT or other "reach" schools. That doesn't mean "don't apply." Rather, as annika points out, it means "make the application as strong as it can be" and "make sure the young man also applies to academic and financial safeties, in case he isn't accepted to his reach school(s)."</p>
<p>One thing that hasn't been mentioned is the importance of prep for the science portion of the ACT. Even my test-hating D2 improved her science sub-score significantly with just a little preparation. The OP doesn't say what the English and Science subscores were, but they must have been pretty ordinary to dilute out that 36 math. Prospects for raising the English subscore? I don't know. But prospects for improving the science subscore are excellent IMHO.</p>