<p>elizabeth makes some sense, perhaps a little more than luci and much more than zxc</p>
<p>i never had a curfew. i did realize that my parents would worry or begin to ask questions if i came home too late. so sometimes i wouldn't come home until 2 but if i knew that i was going to be out till 4 or 6, then id come home between 11 and 12 and then go back out once the parents went to bed. i never got into any trouble. i did do a bit of drinking in those days but by the time i got to college the mystique was gone and while most of my classmates were drinking 3+ nights a week, i was drinking once if at all.
it really just depends on how you've raised your kid thus far. if you are confident, drop the rules. if you aren't, try and maintain some order but know that this can backfire.
i did like those posts about turning your kid into a pumpkin if they aren't home by midnight. the times have changed folks. i completely understand and agree with weekday limits but on the weekends, let them be young while they still can.</p>
<p>I don't see anything drivelly about lucifer's post, or otherwise deserving a condescending response. Valid point: Parents that are overly restrictive risk having kids "run wild" in college not knowing how to handle new freedoms. Another valid point: Even beyond how easy it is to sneak out, we parents don't necessarily know what our kids are doing even when they tell us. Yes, cell phones are wonderful, but I don't really know where my kid is when he calls me on his cell phone. I have found at times parents are totally delusional about what their own kids are doing. I have caught my own wife saying things like, "Fortunately, our kids don't drink" at which point I will give her an incredulous look and say, "You really have no idea what our kids are doing when they go out." We have been lucky with our boys. They are good kids and have stayed out of trouble. But I never get smug about other kids that may have gotten caught or taken a wrong turn. I know how easy it is to suddenly find yourself in that situation. </p>
<p>My parents must have thought I went to 3 parties a week every week because I always told them I was going to a party, even if I ended up with my buddies in an alley with a 6 pack. I guess that was a party of sorts.</p>
<p>A clarification: a midnight/1-ish curfew isn't ridiculous (I was more referring to a few parents I knew who implemented 10/11 PM curfews on weekends), though it is far from ideal. Curfews, by their nature, are not effective (as I said). Will kids sneak out every night? No. Will they sneak out whenever they have a good reason to (i.e. a huge party, etc.)? Yes. Further, all it takes is one kid with loose parents for every control effort to fall apart - whether that kid drives to pick up another kid who snuck out or whether that kid has sleepovers (which are probably the most common way of getting around curfew/etc. issues) and then goes out with all the friends who are sleeping over.</p>
<p>I will say that the cell phone idea is at least a reasonaby effective method of ensuring safety - if your kid can talk on the cell phone in a reasonably coherent manner, you know they aren't dangerously drunk/high/etc. (as long as they aren't driving) and that they aren't dead in a ditch. Turning off your cell phone (so it goes straight to voice mail; use the landline for emergencies) and having your kid check in with quick, basic messages at various points throghout the night is probably the most effective method of ensuring safety - it is minimally intrusive, ensures that they aren't dead/etc, and requires little/no effort on the parents part. </p>
<p>I will conclude by saying that I learned as much from going to parties during high school as I did taking classes in high school (and I'm not some HS dropout; I took 14 AP classes (12 5's, 1 4, 1 3) and got into an Ivy) - you learn a tremendous amount about people, about reading situations (i.e. what is dangerous, what is joking, etc) and about life in general. Kids who go through high school living in controlled, supervised environments may be prepared academically for college/life, but I don't believe they are prepared for college in terms of life and social skills.</p>
<p>The reason I set the 10PM/Midnight curfew was because of the 30 mins. away situation. I realize that it is easy to extend a curfew (and my initial wording to her was "can be extended with sufficient explanation"), but not so easy to reign it in. Obviously homecoming, prom and shows/events that don't end until late would warrant an extension. However, I really don't want her running around in the midnight to 2AM hours just to be "out". And I agree with zxc that it may be partly for my benefit: I'm one of those "early to bed, early to rise" folks, otherwise known as alter cockers or "old farts". I do worry if I wake up at 1AM and she's not home and won't get back to sleep until she does. When she's a year older and in college, it will be "out of sight, out of mind" somewhat. Her track record is pretty good and she wil be going to a school where hardly any driving would be required. </p>
<p>Additional comments are welcome. This is certainly an ongoing process for us and I know her younger sister is watching and taking notes. ;)</p>
<p>Curfews are a tricky situation. Mine is midnight, but my parents are not strict at all about it. For example, last night I had a cast party to go to and they let me stay out until 1:30ish. Out of courtesy, I tell my parents where I am. If I didn't, they would probably ask.... howver, if I did not tell them the truth, there would be no suspicion either (not that I've ever done that!). It's an issue of respect between kids and parents I think. I do think that the legal curfews that have been mentioned in the thread are a good idea.... maybe NY should do something like that.</p>
<p>We trust our children but while in HS we wait up for them. The rule was weeknights you didn't go out except for school projects or work and weekends were midnight because we were too tired to stay up later. Exceptions were made fairly easily. We got some whining but nothing to significant since most of their friends had curfews that were similar or slightly later. College hasn't resulted in any dramtic behavior shifts. Yes drinking occurs but in moderation and of course they have shifted to the vampire hours that an all 18-22 yo population considers normal but they generally seem to get to bed between 1-2 even on weekends. Their awat messages shift from "around" to "bed" at that point. The reason for the curfew was not about trust so much as a compromise so we could all comfortably share our home as well as to insure that they got enough sleep. They often had to get up fairly early for work, practices and games.</p>
<p>SRMom, What a great response. Your approach to the curfew sounds similar to ours. 10PM during the week and midnight on weekends. There have been exceptions for good reasons with guarantees of phone calls, supervision, etc. Last night was a classic example. S went to a supervised Christmas party and the agreement before he left was that he would be home before midnight. At 11:30 we got the call that one of his friends got stuck in the mud and he was going to wait untill the tow truck got there and he would be "a little late." He ended up having to drive some other friends home which resulted in another phone call that he "would be a little later." W and I were both up and waiting in our bath robes at 1:20 when he came in. We weren't angry at all, just relieved as the weather was horrible outside, hard cold rain for hours. We told him that we thought he made the right decisions, but would have liked a more realistic update on the estimated time of arrival.</p>
<p>We waited up for S1. We TRY to wait up for S2. H makes it, I usually don't. I used to have him wake us and give me the kiss/breath test but I was too foggy to check the clock. I had no memory of it the next day. He just finished his junior year and his curfew went up to 1 am after a year of fairly responsible behavior.</p>
<p>In all cases, I prefer he drive his own car even if it is slightly past the curfew time. That car keeps him sober. I don't have to count on so and so to get him home. Plus, as the parties lose their novelty, he can leave whenever he gets bored--which is fairly quickly these days. He's taken a special course and is now ready to take a special driver's test that will allow him to drive past midnight.</p>
<p>I grimace when they tell me they are hanging out with kids I'm not crazy about but I don't do more than that. For the most part, they both have great friends and I praise them to bits for that. They have to learn to get out of sticky situations, sketchy parties, as one poster wrote. However, they are not allowed to spend the night at girlfriend's house (the norm here) and they are not allowed to go to all the farm parties they are invited to.</p>
<p>Curfew or trust depends on the kid. S2 is his own man. I thought S1 would be his own man but, in fact, he has the peer pressure resistance of a puppy; ie zed to none. This happens to be the exact opposite of what I thought would happen as they were growing up as S2 is the loud crazy one and S1 is on the quiet side.</p>
<p>Still, even S1 has learned his own limitations and become his own man. Kind of a slow process from mother's perspective but he's nearly through it at 19 1/2. For that, I am grateful.</p>
<p>I'm with soozie on this one, never say never.</p>
<p>No curfew at our house, but we run a tight ship exactly like soozievt's. My D is a 16 year old senior among 18 year olds, but the most responsible of the bunch. Cell phone is always charged and always on and she must always respond. And she does. Usually she calls us when she is leaving on her way home and we chat all the way home til she gets in the driveway.</p>
<p>I think age and household structure are other factors that need to be considered. Single parent here, so there really isn't an us vs. them authority structure. Much easier to emphasize shared responsibilities with the kids and set some democratic standards about common courtesy and staying in touch. </p>
<p>Both my kids have spring birthdays and are at the typical age for their grade - meaning they were 14 before they entered high school, & turn 18 during their senior years. There really can be a world of difference between 16 and 17 or 18, as well as a world of difference between one kid and another. So the standards we set can partly reflect whether that kid is the among the oldest of their peer group or the youngest, esp. when being the oldest also means the one with the driver's license and vehicle. </p>
<p>So basically, its a bigger question than simply looking at what other parents do - it depends on the kid, on the kid's level of experience, and on the family structure. I'm sure rules would be different, for example, if I had younger children at home, or if I had a job that required me to get up very early every morning.</p>
<p>I never had a strict curfew on weekends - I had to call home by 11 to tell my folks where I was and when I thought I'd be home. (Weeknights I rarely went out except to study, so it didn't apply.) I knew that my mother couldn't sleep well until I got home, so I tried not to push it too far. I was usually home by 1. I will ask the same things of my d (who's now a junior and cannot legally drive herself yet) as my parents asked of me. (And to know when she comes home, I intend to sleep in her bed!)</p>
<p>There's one more safety issue on the flip side of strict curfews that no one's mentioned. I can't count the number of articles in the newspaper, describing teenage crashes around midnight, with excessive speed involved. More often than not, the driver explained that he/she had been speeding because he/she or one of the passengers were "trying to make curfew." For that reason alone, I won't enforce a strict curfew on my d. (This applies again only to weekends. School days, there's little going out anyway.)</p>
<p>No strict curfews, but it was understood that everyone was home by 10 pm on weekdays and midnight on weekends. The few times that something went over on weekends, were negotiable. No teenager has any business being out "consoling friends" at 1:30am - JMHO. That would not have been a negotiable reason to be out past midnight.</p>
<p>I agree that graduated freedom is an important part of preventing "freshmen gone wild" syndrome, but I still believe that 16 and 17 (maybe even 18) year old children have no business being out driving at 1:30, 2, 3am, except under very unusual circumstances - you should have heard what went on with the coming home on prom night, and that was from a supervised party at another parent's house. The issue to me is not so much what time or how strict the curfew than it is what they are doing. I guess I'm old-fashioned, but hanging out can be finished by midnight (again a movie, like the midnight opening of Star Wars, etc, a speical concert, prom - with its own set of problems- all those are special events, not general typical Sat night). If they can just routinely go out with friends to Waffle House at 2am in high school - what new freedom will they get in college???
Then again we aren't a family of night owls, I have some good friends whose entire family are late risers, I've never understood how they get to work and school, the normal family conscious time is about 11am</p>
<p>We have 4 Ds and none has ever had a curfew.</p>
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<p>Same story in my parents' house, and I'm grateful. The issue was what my sisters and I were doing, and with whom, not what time it was. We had to tell mom where we were going and the phone number there. Then call with a new plan and new phone number if we went somewhere else. Easy as pie. They could always check on me if they needed to.</p>
<p>In my experience, the kids with the strict weekend curfews were often raising the most hell. Their parents thought that if the kids were home at a decent hour, then the parents didn't have to worry about anything else. So those kids were smoking weed, having unprotected sex, etc. and home by midnight. Meanwhile, if I was with a fellow nerd friend reading Cosmo and painting our toenails in her bedroom, we're safe whether it's 9 p.m. or 3 a.m., so why should my parents care?</p>
<p>Not that its an issue for my no-curfew daughter, but there have been many a 2:00 a.m. phone call around here that fit the friend-consoling category ... and I wouldn't put it past her to make a house call. I know that she was very distraught last year when a very close friend was suicidal. D was always the one that others would come to -- she once gave up socializing at her her own birthday slumber party to stay up all night consoling one very unhappy guest. </p>
<p>I for one would be quite happy that the reason for my daughter's late arrival -- or late departure, for that matter -- was to help a friend in need.</p>
<p>Quiltguru, not to criticize, but you might want to read some of the literature about cell phone use and driving -- apparently there are studies that show that hands free phones don't solve the problem, which is as likely to be distraction from engaging in conversation as juggling with the phone itself. (Same reason why people feel teens shouldn't be carrying other teens as passengers -- too much chatter, not enough attention to the road).</p>
<p>I mean, I would agree that hands-free is better than hands-on.... but its really safest if the conversation is kept to a minimum.</p>
<p>Again - I don't mean to criticize, as my daughter also is one who frequently calls home for directions when she is on the road. I'd rather have my daughter calling me than driving aimlessly at night in an unfamiliar and possibly very unsafe area -- and pulling over in an unfamiliar area late at night might not be the safest option either. So iron-clad rules tend not to work so well, despite our best intentions. I just am suggesting that on-road conversation should be kept to a minimum, for necessary communications only... for all of us.</p>
<p>Just wanted to ring in once more on this... In reality we never had a strict curfew, but I wanted some input on who and where kids were. Just as you might expect of a very close friend or spouse. some of the posts 21/22/23 at the to of the page are humorous. Some parents and kids assert that more control means wilder kids in college... is this doucmented in some way? show me the data... I believe earlier in this thread some data on late night accidents were given, thats data .... You can choose or not curfews, control etc ... but its nice to back up important claims with some sort of data ... In reality it depends on you, your kid, how they have shown responsibility, etc etc .. not one answer</p>
<p>Back to the OP -- senior curfew ... while I do disagree with some of the assertions , I do believe the senior year is one to expand whatever contols you have, and expand them as the year goes along. ..that is my opinion, based on experience with one child .. and I suppose thats not data based either</p>