Senior parents: Help for parents of juniors

Parents Forum
1

<p>As we are winding down with our seniors, junior parents are now beginning the college search in earnest. I thought it might be helpful to list some of the things that we would have done differently. My list:</p>

<li> Start on the scholarship search earlier. We have already missed many deadlines.<br></li>
<li> Have your child apply to a safety school, but your state university may not be the best choice. The admission fee for our state school was the highest I paid and after four months our son still has not heard. Kids who applied two months after him have already recieved their acceptances. At this point, it won’t matter because he has much better choices and we see that they are not the most organized place. There are many small schools out there that will be thrilled to accept your child. My son applied to one school and received an acceptance two days after he sent in the application (before they received all of his materials). He has been regularly receiving letters from various individuals at the school. They have made him feel wanted and even for a high-achieving student, that certainly helped ease the stress of the process. </li>
<li> Read the small print. There are “scams” out there. My son received an application from a local school that promised a decision within two weeks. The admission fee was stiff and missing from the original letter was the fact that a $250 nonrefundable deposit was due immediately to secure his place.<br></li>
<li> Don’t be surprised if after driving a couple of hours, your child takes one look at the campus and says he doesn’t like it. I found my son pretty much made up his mind within a minute of getting out of the car. His first choice school is one where he pretty much felt comfortable from the start. There is a great book (hopefully someone will remember the name - something like “Take my child please”) which is a very humorous look at the college application process.<br></li>
</ol>

<p>Looking back now, the year was not as bad as I thought it would be. Even without hearing from his regular decision schools, he has some great choices. I just took out all of the books yesterday to start this anew with my daughter and hopefully we as a family learned something from our first time through.</p>

2

<p>You do not need to pay anyone to do a financial aid/scholarship "search". You can easily find scholarship information on fastweb.com </p>

<p>Read all the fine print on the financial aid process on each college's website. Make a chart of what is due/when it is due.</p>

<p>Start gathering the information you need to do taxes in the fall. Look at the info needed for FAFSA and Profile and prepare yourself. It's a pain, like doing taxes, but can be completed by most people.</p>

<p>Apply to at least one EA/ED/Rolling decision school. Having an early acceptance (whether or not you intend to attend) will ease a lot of tension.</p>

<p>In a perfect world, your child will listen to the wisdom of parents and start working on applications as soon as they are available so as to avoid crunch time. HAH! Prepare yourself for your student putting applications off til the last minute. It's an introspective process, and many just don't feel up to seeing their lives condensed to a few pieces of paper or bragging about what they've done or seeing just how little they've accomplished compared to Michael or Brittany who have straight As and been elected president to everything. Also, it would appear that college deadlines have a slight bit of flexibilty to them.</p>

<p>And everybody's favorite piece of advice: LOVE THY SAFETY!</p>

3

<ol>
<li><p>Be cautious about ED. Several of S1's friends were unhappy with their ED decision and I'm not sure we ended up with the right school, even though S1 seems happy largely due to prestige factor. Those deferred ED felt let down. Seems like whole school applied ED somewhere.</p></li>
<li><p>I would have toured more schools. S wasn't interested in seeing any schools, so we only toured two--applied and accepted at both. With S2, we will insist on more tours. S1 and S2 both have pretty set preconceived notions about what they want. Think tours would help them to test those assumptions.</p></li>
<li><p>Should have taken the SAT II subject test immediately after the relevent class. S1 took those late and had forgotten a lot of his chemistry. </p></li>
<li><p>Should have signed up for Kaplan and taken SAT I earlier and more frequently. Felt like there was a lot on the line with the October test; conflicted with a soccer tournament, etc.</p></li>
<li><p>Be better prepared for teacher recommendations. We were very disappointed in teacher who wrote bland letter as if he barely knew S; gave letter to S and never mailed in (S finally sent). This is a teacher who had given him an A in class and coached him in chess club, yet never even mentioned the EC! S thought they were good friends. I assume they are and teacher just wasn't good at writing or something (AP Prob/Stat).</p></li>
</ol>

<p>All's well that ends well, but very stressful process overall. Much worse than I thought it would be.</p>

4

<p>I'll add these items...</p>

<ol>
<li><p>Check the DEADLINES for both applications and finaid. Do NOT miss deadlines for either. We were surprised that for some EA schools, the Profile deadline was in November. And agreed with above post...keep your tax info handy for when you need to do the finaid forms.</p></li>
<li><p>Check with your hs guidance office on THEIR deadlines. For example, our school says they need two weeks to process their part (transcripts, recommendations, etc). Don't get caught short here.</p></li>
<li><p>If you even think you might apply to a college, have your high school send the transcripts and recommendations EARLY in the senior year (like October). Then you can make up your mind later about applying. We did NOT do this and DD missed one deadline because she didn't allow adequate time.</p></li>
<li><p>Consider giving prospective recommendation writers your hs profile before your junior year ends...thus allowing them to write your recommendation NOT in the rush of writing all the others in the fall.</p></li>
<li><p>Look on the websites of your schools and the common ap for essay topics. Begin writing in the summer...add...delete...amend....etc. Give yourself lots of time. Then when the time comes to actually write your final essay, you will have some drafts to cut and paste into it.</p></li>
<li><p>Do anything you can do EARLY. Waiting until the last minute costs money and anxiety.</p></li>
<li><p>I agree...apply to at least one rolling school and/or one school EA (NOT ED) so that you'll have a decision before the winter holiday break.</p></li>
<li><p>Make sure you truly understand ED BEFORE you apply ED anywhere. You ARE obligated to withdraw other applications and attend if you are accepted. I know several students who did NOT understand this and are being caught short in the money category (school MET aid with more loans than they had anticipated...but the school DID meet their need).</p></li>
</ol>

<p>Try to enjoy this process. That's probably the hardest part!!</p>

5

<p>I agree with everything that was said above and, </p>

<p>1) I can't stress enough importance of the overnight visit. For almost a year, we (DD, DH and myself) felt confident that DD would end up at a certain school. It was #1 on her list. After her overnight there, she completely removed it from her list. </p>

<p>2) I had no idea how much we parents are involved in this process. Two years ago, my sister told me how busy my nephew's college application process was keeping her. I remember telling her I sure didn't plan for that to happen as DD's application process was her job. Well, let me just tell you ... there is a lot to be done by parents. While our senior kids are in the midst of full-steam-ahead senior years and the continued AP courses, exams and jobs, I don't know how on earth we could expect them to take on this process by themselves. I have learned much this year, and thank goodness I had the good folks here at CC to help me along! I told DD I would do whatever she needed me to do to help. I assisted in the research of schools, scholarships, etc. and acted as her post office courier on several occasions. The FAFSA form ... well, let's just say that's no picnic in the park, but a necessity. </p>

<ol>
<li><p>File, file, file. Keep up with those papers and keep them in an organized fashion. Senior parents here will attest to the enormous amounts of mail that will soon, if not already, flood your mailboxes. In the beginning, we hung on to everything. After a month or so, we sat down on the weekends and tossed the items from schools in which she knew she had no interest.</p></li>
<li><p>Research the schools thoroughly. Don't research only the schools you've heard of. Some of the gems we found were due to CC and reading about the "Colleges that Change Lives". If your child has a particular interest, research the schools that offer great classes or professors for that interest. Do keep in mind, though, these are only kids seventeen and eighteen years old. Of those who think they know what they want to do with their lives, many will probably change their minds ... and more than once. Don't pick a school based solely on their interest.</p></li>
<li><p>Be honest from the beginning. Talk about money. Talk about what is realistic in terms of cost. Encourage your child to apply for any and all scholarships possible. Don't give your child false hope about attending a costly school and in the end, tell them it won't be possible. Be realistic.</p></li>
</ol>

<p>The application process can be very stressful, but it can also be pleasant in that it gives us the opportunity to travel with our children and really discuss what they feel their future plans involve. When you start to feel stressed, just remember how they must feel. Good luck!</p>

6

<p>1) start essays early in summer.<br>
2) Unless student needs to show senior grades, apply to all rolling and EA schools on the list.
3) If student has STRONG prefernce for one school, and has held that belief, go ED if you don't need to compare finaid offers.
4) Ask teachers for recs in early Sept so you beat the rush. Be organized and make it easy for them by providing a summary sheet with schools, dates, form required, etc.</p>

7

<p>(1) Have the money talk now. Parents set realistic expectation about what you can or are willing to pay/ borrow for the education. </p>

<p>(2) Gather as much information as possible for your prospective schools. If your college has a common data set, read it as the FA section will tell you the following: % of students that applied for aid, % of students who had a financial need, the average loan, average scholarship, avg % of need met, and average amount of debt a student incurs.</p>

<p>(3) As parents put aside your differences and speak to your non-custodial parent regarding financial obligations/expectations for college. Don't leave your child in a postion where they are between a rock and a hard place having to negotiate between the 2 of you because it is a family decision.</p>

<p>(4) Read, read, read the FA policies for each school as many schools requests financial information from both parents (and some even stepparents) in order to determine aid. Find out how outside scholarships are applied to the aid package.</p>

<p>(6) Don't let your kid get hyped up on a $40,000+ college knowing that your are not going to help pay for it.</p>

<p>(7)If you need to compare packages, do not apply ED.</p>

<p>(8) While many of us think that having a "hand off approach"ay be better, do not let your student apply for a colelge ED and then tell you after the fact even if it means contacting your GC to make sure that they confirm with you about your child applying ED before processing the paperwork.</p>

<p>Determination of Need</p>

<p>Primary responsibility for meeting college costs rests with students and their parents, to the extent that they are able to pay. The difference between standard costs of education and the calculated family contribution is “demonstrated need.” </p>

<p>Two distinct formulas assess information reported in the aid application process. The traditional institutional methodology (IM), developed by
the College Board and refined annually by economists and aid administrators, determines the expected family share of costs. IM is the dominant standard among selective national colleges. </p>

<p>The federal methodology (FM) determines eligibility for federal aid. </p>

<p>Differences between the IM and FM models include:</p>

<p>**IM **collects information on estimated academic year family income, medical expenses, elementary and secondary school tuition and unusual circumstances. **FM **omits these questions.</p>

<p>IM **considers a fuller range of family asset information, while **FM ignores assets of siblings, all assets of certain families with less than $50,000 of income, and both home and family farm equity.</p>

<p>FM defines income as the “adjusted gross income” on federal tax returns, plus various categories of untaxed income. **IM **includes in total income any paper depreciation, business, rental or capital losses which artificially reduce adjusted gross income.</p>

<p>FM **does not assume a minimum student contribution to education; **IM expects the student, as primary beneficiary of the education, to devote some time each year to earning money to pay for education.</p>

<p>FM ignores the noncustodial parent in cases of divorce or separation; IM expects parents to help pay for education, regardless of current marital status.</p>

<p>FM **and **IM apply different percentages to adjust the parental contribution when multiple siblings are simultaneously enrolled in college, and IM considers only siblings enrolled in undergraduate programs.</p>

<p>The IM expected family share represents a best estimate of a family’s capacity (relative to other families) to absorb, over time, the costs of education. It is not an assessment of cash on hand, a value judgment about how much a family should be able to use current income, or a measure of liquidity. The final determinations of demonstrated need and awards rest with the University and are based upon a uniform and consistent treatment of family circumstances.</p>

<p>Except in the most extraordinary circumstances, Colleges classifies incoming students as dependent upon parents for institutional aid purposes, even though some students may meet the federal definition of “independence.”</p>

<p>Students enrolling as dependent students are considered dependent throughout their undergraduate years when need for institutional scholarships is determined.</p>

<p>For institutional aid purposes a student may not “declare” independence due to attainment of legal age, internal family arrangements, marriage or family disagreements</p>

8

<p>Remember that the SAT and the SAT subject tests CANNOT be taken on the same date, so plan way ahead. Students should take the SAT by March of the Junior year. And remember, this is a really LONG test- be sure your student takes a snack & Pepsi, etc, that they can throw back quickly during a break. Agree with posting above that the best time to take the SAT subject tests is right after the course is finished- June for regular classes, May for AP subjects. Then, if the student want to improve their scores, plan on second tests in Oct.- odds are they will score better, and the Oct test is given in time to send to EA/ ED schools.
Can't agree enough with the advice to start the essays EARLY! Particularly for chronic procrastinators, Dec break can be a miserable time for students who have put off writing their essays. Try to encourage Seniors to work on one essay a week, starting in Sept. The essay prompts for all colleges, as well as the common app. are available
by mid Sept, and the prompts for the common app don't change from year to year, so they can start to think about them even earlier.</p>

9

<p>My suggestion: Trade in procrastinating child for motivated one that will follow all these great parent pleasing suggestions. And make sure the motivated child has great grades and EC's to make it even better. </p>

<p>My son is the king of procrasinators and if I could have gotten him to do his essays in the summer, I sure would have, or once a week starting in September?? How many of us have told our kids how rolling admissions works just to see them put off and put off doing the applications until a boderline reach school becomes a big reach due to all the other kids that got those apps in? arrrgh. After going through this process twice, my discovery is that nagging only goes so far, what's important to me might not be important to my kids and I hope I can remember that for #3 in 5 years!</p>

10

<p>kathiep -- LOL! I just sent my Junior S off to day 2 of "the Xiggi method" of SAT studying. It was like pulling teeth -- the idea of studying gradually, starting 9 weeks in advance, is so foreign to him that we might as well be on different planets. But at least he's doing it, and as far as I'm concerned any advance practice is better than none (I have no delusions that he's sticking to the practice schedule).</p>

11

<p>More thoughts - Read, read, read! The library or the bookstore is filled with resources on the college process. There are books on every aspect from college selection, to college visits, interviews, essays and applications. Do not rely on your GC - they are often overworked and misinformed -even in some of the best school districts!</p>

<p>It's not too soon to think of making contacts with the colleges and the regional reps. Many schools take a high level of interest into account, whether that is from a visit, an interview, an information session, emails to regional reps with relevant questions etc. Check out the school's web page for dates and locations of the regional reps visits to your area and make a point of attending presentations and meeting the reps. Follow up with aforementioned email to the rep, additional questions and expression of interest. The regional rep is not only the one who markets the college to your area, but they are also the first readers of the apps from their areas and sit on the admissions committee! Also contact faculty or athletic coaches in areas of interest with questions. </p>

<p>I second the advice about nurturing the relationships with teachers who might be called on for recs. Ditto for planning ahead for those SATs and SAT IIs. Keep in mind that for most schools they will take the best results of a combination of sittings for the SAT. This means your scores can only improve if you retake - but more than 3 times is not well advised. For the very competitive schools, SAT IIs are pretty important - on par with the SAT I scores.</p>

<p>I agree with the other posters that essays are very important - don't start them at the last minute. Senior year is so busy for many of these kids with ECs, AP classes, SATs and SAT IIs etc., so getting a good head start over the summer, if possible is an excellent idea. I would strongly recommend the student get the essays done on time to be reviewed and revised many times - English teachers are often willing to help. Every info session we went to stressed that essays should be reviewed (not written!) by others and submitted with no errors. </p>

<p>Be familiar with the deadlines, written and unwritten of the schools. For example, many rolling admissions schools have published deadlines of, say Feb 1, but it is crucial to get those apps in first, even by September or early Oct. to have increased chances of acceptance. Each month that you delay reduces chances. Universtiy of Michigan, and other state schools are prime examples of this- some of S's friends who would have gotten in earlier were deferred, rejected or accepted to the satellite campuses because of late apps to rolling admissions schools. Many were caught unaware of this. </p>

<p>ECs should reflect your child's real passions and interests over time. Just keep in mind that 3 or 4 well developed activities generally are better than dropping in and out of dozens of unrelated clubs.</p>

<p>Lastly, and this goes without saying here, but CC forums were a goldmine of information. There are some schools that have more active forums than others, and if you read some of those, especially at peak times such as the months leading up to early decision apps and then again leading to RD apps, there is much info to be found that applies to those applying to other schools as well!</p>

12

<ol>
<li><p>Don't discuss your child's college list with everyone you know. Everyone and their uncle will have an opinion about your child's chances. Almost none of those opinions will be grounded in reality but almost all of them will make your stress level rise or fall like a run-away rollercoaster. And, late at night, when you find yourself lying awake convinced that your child is going to be rejected everywhere - and you almost certainly WILL find yourself in such a state at least once before it's all over - part of your dread will revolve around the EMBARRASSMENT of having to tell everyone you know that no, little Johnny didn't get into Yale, or no, little Betsy was rejected from Kenyon. Instead, when people ask where little Johnny or Betsy are applying, smile politely and say with a shrug, "Oh, he/she has five or six colleges that he/she's thinking about applying to. We'll have to wait until spring to know how it all turns out." And then change the subject. Advise your children to do the same.</p></li>
<li><p>Expect your child to change, and to change his/her mind, between the spring of junior year and the time applications need to be sent out in senior year. Try very hard to remember that, while this is relatively normal and common, it has very little to do with your efforts to make the college process as smooth as possible for your child, nor does it indicate that they are doomed to a lifetime of failure because they can't make up their minds.</p></li>
<li><p>Expect to feel angry, frustrated, scared, upset, and convinced that your child is somehow falling behind others around October/November of senior year. Try very hard to remember that, while this is relatively normal and common among college-concerned parents, these feelings almost always have absolutely NOTHING to do with your child's chances or ultimate college choices.</p></li>
<li><p>Expect your child to feel angry, frustrated, scared, upset, and convinced that YOU have somehow gone insane around October/November of senior year. Try very hard to remember that, while this is relatively normal and common among college-bound students, these feelings almost always have absolutely NOTHING to do with the relationship you will have with your child after they've received their acceptances and made their final decision.</p></li>
<li><p>Don't think - even for a moment - that just because you have done everything right in terms of college visits, college research, and college planning, that there won't be some surprises along the way. Expect them, greet them for what they are, and try very hard not to blow them out of proportion. This too shall pass.</p></li>
<li><p>Start stocking up on and planning pleasant diversions now --- good books to read, theater tickets, spa certificates, weekend getaways --- so that your child's application season does not become the only thing you have to focus on next year.</p></li>
<li><p>Remember to hug and love your child, even when you feel like scratching your eyeballs out because he/she doesn't <em>want</em> your input or <em>need</em> your help. Most kids do just fine, even if they do it all themselves.</p></li>
<li><p>Let your kids know that while you will do everything you can to help them with applications, that you will not offer assistance <em>unless</em> they specifically ask for it. Tell them you trust them, trust their ability to get into college, and trust that they will have great choices next spring...and then try very, very hard to believe it. :)</p></li>
</ol>

13

<p>One more tip: Don't waste time and energy trying to find some magical secret that will guarantee your child will get into his/her <em>dream</em> school. Sure, read a few books, consider the advice given here, do some in-depth research into the factors individual schools weigh. However, never forget that your child's chances are, in the end, something you <em>can't</em> fully control. There is NO magical secret that will guarantee admission anywhere or protect your child from possible disappointment. That, ultimately, may be the most bitter pill for some parents to swallow.</p>

14

<p>Yes, Caroly, your first point is excellent advice - everyone seems to have an opinion. If one more person tells me that my son's first choice school isn't good enough for him I will scream. He likes the school and if he is happy that is very important.</p>

15

<p>If one more person tells me that my son's first choice school isn't good enough for him I will scream. >></p>

<p>LOL! I hear you. I almost did scream when my daughter and I ran into one of her favorite middle school teachers and told him where she'd applied. He was quiet for a moment, then said, "Well, those sound like nice schools, but why aren't you applying to...." He then named about 8 schools that were the exact opposite of what she had decided she was looking for in a college and about half of them were schools she and I both knew would be extreme reaches for her. </p>

<p>It was after that encounter that my daughter started just saying the "I have five or six colleges..." line and I quickly followed her lead. Both our stress levels went down considerably after that.</p>

16

<p>2 mistakes that I made: </p>

<p>I would have had son apply to more than one instate school (in case of a financial emergency).</p>

<p>I should have had son get one letter of recommendation on file with guidance at end of junior year b/c many of his junior teachers were not there in September of senior year.</p>

17

<p>One more thing and this one is MY opinion and I know others will not agree. Don't apply to more than one ultra reach school. I'm not saying students shouldn't apply to a stretch school, but one of those is enough in my opinion. And likewise...make sure you have a safety on your list and remember that a safety is a school you will more than likely be accepted to AND that you want to attend. </p>

<p>And lastly...don't apply to schools that you would NOT attend even if accepted. If you truly hate the school don't apply.</p>

<p>I personally think that students should pick the schools they truly want to apply to and do a terrific job on those applications. I've read here about students applying to 12 or more schools. I find it difficult to believe that they can do a great job on that many applications (even with the common ap, there would still be supplements to do). And it gets expensive sending all those applications, the test scores to all those schools, etc.</p>

18

<p>For Eagle Scouts - Some of the big scholarships have Dec. 15 deadlines. We found out about them on Dec. 27, at son's ceremony. Here is a link for some others.
<a href="http://www.scouter.com/compass/Advancement/Eagle_Scout/Scholarships___Honors/%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.scouter.com/compass/Advancement/Eagle_Scout/Scholarships___Honors/&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

19

<p>When I look at the wonderful list of acceptances from all kinds of schools, I think this year's seniors and their parents did a wonderful job in the process.</p>

<p>I think many parents and students were very savvy in having a rolling admissions school under the belt because I think it took some of the pressure off of the rest of the process :)</p>

<p>After the applications are sent out do something to decompress and take your mind off of the process. Yes, march can be hellish and long while waiting for answers, plan things to help relieve some of the tension of waiting.</p>

20

<p>carolyn - I had to laugh when I read your advice to keep the "list" under wraps. I, too, gave that same advice to S, but it didn't end up working out that way! The kids who did this were basically made to feel badly about it, since almost everyone else was an open book. Kids talked behind others backs about how secretive and ridiculous they were being etc. etc. When S saw this happening at his school, he decided he didn't want the negative rep that went along with it and "disclosed." There were only a couple of kids who never said, and it turned out that everyone eventually found out about them anyway. Sad but true.</p>