HES (Harvard Extension School) already offers a Bachelor of Liberal Arts degree program and graduate degrees (not certificates) in areas ranging from Archaeology to Software Engineering.
My son took a couple of HES math classes in high school. The lecture quality was very high, similar to that of his current Harvard classes. If your goal is high quality education, HES has it covered.
There are different types of strong students. Some like being a big fish in a small pond and would be happy being the strongest student in a group, even if by a decent margin. Other strong students are motivated when surrounded by other similarly strong students and a demanding curriculum.
To use a sports analogy, donât you think that Steph Curry will play harder on an NBA team vs a neighborhood pickup game? Ane even aside from the money, which one do you think he enjoys more?
If schools âexpandedâ - then naturally their selectivity would get less.
Part of what they have is low supply, high demand. Itâs their business model.
In the end, a school is a business and will do what matters to stay funded and cash flow positive.
If expansion were to be mandated, it would come at the public levelâŠor through government âpersuasionâ via funding, etc.
Schools are expanding - hence all the free community college states are pushing.
But when you talk about elite - Rice, for example, is expanding. But if all expanded, they could water down their selectivity, etc. which in the end will hurt.
But again, they are only elite because we say they are. Itâs âbrandedâ into us.
Iâm sure the great folks at KU or OU or Nebraska think their programs are mighty fine and kids there can get a great education.
As someone else pointed out, kids that come from good areas, high middle class + upbringings, likely will do better in life - because thatâs what they know and theyâve had the tools and support to have a solid foundation. Other kids, theyâre less fortunate and donât have the same opportunities - whether family support or otherwise - to succeed in a demanding environment.
Who said they werenât qualified? On the contrary, my point is that the kid who earned a 2 on his AP calc test turned out to be more than capable of handling classwork at an âeliteâ institution. Nothing was âbaked inâ at all.
I have no problem with the anecdote that some students prefer elite school A over random school B. What I donât see is evidence that elite school A will make all students better than random school B. Thatâs the essence of this threadâŠclaiming Harvard is screwing people by letting so few in. Personally, Iâd choose Amherst or Williams everyday over Harvard for undergrad, but no one is beating the drum that they have to accept more students.
Whether it seems pretty clear to you or not, the research suggests otherwise. Weâre talking specifically about disadvantaged kids here. And your argument that elite schools admit high-functioning kids, therefore high-functioning kids donât need elite schools is tautological.
And as I said, passing an low-level introductory class at Harvard requires little more than a pulse because the standards are so low. Perhaps a third of all high school students could pass one of these classes. But barely passing doesnât mean you learn much or that you will be employable afterwards. Passing alone does not mean succeeding.
The elite colleges choose students that they think will succeed in the real world, which usually means that they are really great at something, if not multiple things. Harvard and Yale have an approach where itâs not necessary to be strong in all areas and it works for them. This allows them to admit the David Hoggs of the world who I guarantee was not admitted for his academic prowess, but for his potential impact on civic rights. He might get a few Cs but he will graduate.
Places like Columbia, UChicago, and MIT have a different model where they expect strong performance across a number of areas, and that approach works for them. Students like David Hogg best not apply there.
Well post it then. Nothing youâve linked thus far is compelling.
Steph Curry was lights-out playing for Davidson in the Southern conference as well.
And maybe you should ask Steph, but Eric Dickerson (who wasnât exactly bad in the NFL), when asked which he treasured most: Friday night Texas HS football, Saturdays at SMU, or Monday night football (and presumably other games) in the NFL, said it was Saturday games at SMU.
To build on @eyemghâs point: Did playing in the Southern conference at Davidson (instead of in the ACC at VaTech where Steph had wanted to go because that was where did dad went) impede his athletic career? I would argue ânoâ.
Thatâs because he was getting rewarded in other waysâŠthanks to the boosters and unsuspecting freshman who didnât know they were going to be made into sex workers.
Lol. I post a link to actual research, you post what is âpretty clear to meâ based on nothing, but Iâm the one who has nothing compelling to say. Got it. 
David Hogg led a movement that has changed the dialogue on gun control. As a teenager. These are exactly the sort of kids Harvard wants. Future leaders. Not kids who are no more than great test-takers. BTW, U. Chicago takes plenty of unqualified students. See Evita Duffy, who got in because sheâs the daughter of a former Congressman and Fox News contributor, not because she has strong performance in any area, much less a number of them, as proven by a series of embarrassing and ill-informed op-eds and articles. Iâll take David Hogg, thanks.
I read some of that paper, but not all 99 page. It struck me that there were no controls. @Data10 then when into more detail. Itâs very lacking and as a result canât claim what youâre claiming. It says high functioning students are high functioning students and more selective school get more of them. Thatâs all you can infer from that paper. It does not say teh schools they chose mane them that way. Donât take this personally, but my suspicion is, that like most people, you havenât been trained in how to vet research papers.
All âeliteâ schools take under qualified students. None of them take a lot. Think Harvard doesnât have any? How about Jared Kushner.
You didnât read the paper. Thatâs all I need to know.
Elite college turn away many applicants who are as qualified as those they accept. So, no.
I scanned it to determine itâs quality and whether or not it was worth the time to read the whole thing. I read enough to know it had no controls. What else do I need to know? I read the abstract and scanned methodology. Iâm fairly certain you didnât read the whole thing either. I read plenty enough to know that all they were discussing was correlation without the ability to discuss causation (other than the fact that they were already high achieving).
Itâs harder to sway someone who understands research, than someone whoâs just looking for things to affirm their already held beliefs.
You forgot about politicians.
Thanks for agreeing with me that David Hogg is an asset to Harvard. Harvardâs relaxed grading allows him to pass classes, but that same relaxed grading would allow perhaps a third of all high schoolers to pass introductory Harvard classes. In other words, just being able to graduate doesnât mean being an asset to the class.
Future politicians?