<p>Once you are at university the rules change and you no longer have that extra time in testing at most publics</p>
<p>Don't think that is true...</p>
<p>It's true at the UCs and the same standard applies for the MCAT.</p>
<p>In very simplified terms:</p>
<p>In HS a disability is defined based on a student being impaired in performing to THEIR POTENTIAL- so if your IQ is 150 and your "processing" is 120, you have a 30 point (is that 2 std deviations?) delay. This causes some disconnects when processing things you are reading; one ends up reading the same passage over and over; the net result is slow reading. Think of an average guy with an IQ 100, he would process at 70, defined as retarded, a big difference.</p>
<p>In the UCs and the MCAT you must perform substantially below ( I forget the precise educationese definition) average people without accomodations...so that 150 IQ would have to perform at a 70-80 IQ level to merit accomodations in the post HS environment; yet the only people with that huge a discrepency would likely be some one who is physically handicapped and unable to fill in the bubbles otherwise they would not likely be at Berkeley or UVA or Michigan. The population taking the MCAT and attending a top college would likely mostly be higher IQs and not performing sub-100 level, I would think.</p>
<p>I have one kid with an LD who is every bit as bright as her siblings: the SAT with extra time, she still did not finish it, but her score was statistically identical to her siblings who finished with plenty of time. Her extra time did not give her the ability to perform better than she should have, I don't think any extra time would have raised her siblings scores by any measurable amount, they did not run out of time. </p>
<p>At her top UC she will get lose .2-.4 GPA points in classes (B+ instead of A-, A- instead of A) where she runs out of time on exams. She can still get a 3.5+, but her GPA and MCAT scores will not be as high as she has the intellectual capacity to produce, as she is too slow in reading the passages- she does not have trouble doing things or understanding things, she just has to read & reread the passages; she does not think slowly, she just reads slowly.</p>
<p>Either she will do enough to overcome that and her outside life experiences will make her an acceptable candidate, or they won't. If she does not get in anywhere, she'll adapt and pursue other fields, but she would be an outstanding physician; she has the fascination, the curiousity, the interest, etc.</p>
<p>But then she is also not on this board talking about a rough first year and personal problems affecting her; she knew it would be difficult to adapt in timed testing at a large public and she is doing her best and not whinging ;)</p>
<p>I think the question should not be whether and how one can game the system to get accepted in Med School, rather once accepted, can you survive the tremendous workload?</p>
<p>I think BDM could speak to the med school % survival rate/year better..</p>
<p>BDM, Please advise.</p>
<p>Hi PG: always available, but not sure exactly what you're asking.</p>
<p>Hi BDM,</p>
<p>I was referring to drop out rate in med school for each year. I think it's highest in the first year and then drops down, right?</p>
<p>Hate to hijack my own thread, guys, but there are other threads where you can debate the legitimacy of learning disabilities. In fact, pretend that I didn't even mention this LD or any other "excuse"...what would be your response in that case? Thanks! I really do appreciate your input ^_^.</p>
<p>I would not recommend mentioning LDs in applicaitons as causing adjustment issues, though if it is real, it did cause you a need to adjust and you might find that learning the best strategies results in better GPA later.</p>
<p>On personal problems, well, that is one thing we all have- every kid could tell you something bad that happened to them; the thing they look for is how you dealt with the problems. Almost no one has a rosy easy life, sickness, death, stress, cars break down, things cost unexpected money, etc. How you deal with that and deal with classes is what shows maturity.</p>
<p>Sometimes just getting up and putting one foot in front of the other is all you can expect of yourself on a bad day. If you can weather the problems, still go to class, still prepare for exams, etc. then you are showing maturity. The reason "everyone" talks about the interference of personal problems as a freshman is because for the first time your parents are not there to run interference for you, you are forced to deal with school plus life and it is not easy to stay focused on some "dumb assignment" when there is something big happening, but that is how life works; adults would lose their job if they gave in and wallowed on all their bad days.</p>
<p>If you can take the stresses of frehsman year and figure out how to best deal with the needs of school and prove that by doing better, than you should be able to prove you are capable, right?</p>
<p>
[quote]
One-sentence answer: It is very difficult for any one thing to completely kill one's chances at medical school; what happens is that the rest of your application is held to a progressively higher standard.
[/quote]
. .</p>
<p>
[quote]
I was referring to drop out rate in med school for each year. I think it's highest in the first year and then drops down, right?
[/quote]
You know, I have to be honest -- the academic drop-out rate in medical school is pretty low -- almost zero. There are personal reasons (decide you don't want to do medicine), and I'm sure the academic rigor contributes to that, but even that's basically zero anyway. Forced expulsion from medical school is disciplinary, not academic. (And even that's basically zero, anyway.)</p>
<p>AAMC did a study on this and found the attrition rate of ORM's due to academic reasons to be around 0.6-0.9%, hence the old adage that the worst student in his medical school class is still a doctor.</p>
<p>ORM's only? Or non-URM's (whites included)?</p>
<p>As advised, just do the best (or better!) that you can do. I wouldn't sweat a couple of low grades. I got a D in chordate anatomy and a C in histology as an undergrad and was accepted to 5 of 6 meds schools.</p>
<p>Regarding academic dropouts, we lost one student due to low grades out of a class of about 180. He came back the following fall to repeat the second year. Once you are in, they try to keep you.</p>
<p>^Yeah, we've had a couple of those as well. But they still get the MD.</p>
<p>Honestly, I don't understand why so many people go on this board asking "If I get so and so in the next 3 years, will I still be accepted?" I don't really think that any of us in here can decide whether you'll get into med school. I mean you did poorly your freshman year, well then try harder next year. I did poorly my freshman year too, finished with a 3.1, and now I'm a junior and at a 3.5. To many med school applicants, 3.5 and above is "average" or "below-average", but I have my OWN standards and only time will tell what med schools you get into. Don't worry so much about how poorly you DID, but how you'll be able to improve. When I met with my pre-med advisor, he asked me "What do you think is the reason why you're a B student and not a B+ or an A student?" The first thing that came to mind was "well because my professors suck" but then after a talk with him, I realized it's because of my study habits, and I've tried to improve since. There are plenty of programs out there to improve your chances of getting into med school, it's just a matter of how much you really want that M.D.</p>
<p>Oh, and having a class ranked "second hardest in the nation" isn't really going to change anything. I go to Hopkins, probably notorious for its pre-med culture...but I'm not planning on using Hopkins as my reason for not doing better than say someone at a state university.</p>
<p>We see questions like "I had a bad freshman year, am I screwed? Should I give up now? Can I still get into med school?" all the time. Sure, you can still get into med school. You can also be kicked twice in the nuts by a donkey next year. The question is HOW will you improve? Yet, we haven't had one person come on here asking, "Is this a good plan to improve my grades?"</p>