Should I leave art school?

Paying for College
1

Right now I am at Moore College of Art , which is a super small, private art school. This past year was my first year so I want to decide now if I should transfer or not.

Currently: I have to take at least 13,000 out in tuition every year and I live at home and take the train every day. The train ride is an hour one way and costs me about $200 a month. My school is also very small so the class times are very limited so that plus the commute means I really have no time to work once I get home. I do work on weekends and I try to schedule classes so there is at least one weekday where I have no classes so I can work. I really do love art but this is so stressful and the thought of graduating with about 50,000$ in debt and no guarantee that I’ll be able to get a stable job is very scary. I’m doing very well in school, my gpa is 3.97, and I’m in an honors program but I still don’t know.

If I transfer I’ll be going to West Chester University, a state school that is about a ten minute drive from my house. The tuition is about 8,000 a year. Because it’s so close I’ll be able to work on days I have classes. The downside is I’ll probably have to go for another four years and I won’t be eligible for merit scholarships as a transfer. Also the state school doesn’t have the greatest reputation for art, but if I go I will probably get a science degree and either minor or possibly do a second degrees in art.

Part of me has also come to realize that I don’t necessarily need an art degree to be a successful artist and I feel like a should pursue a different degree just in case. But I also love the creative atmosphere of art school and how everyone here has the same passion. It has been unlike anything I’ve ever experienced before. I’m so torn though and I really hate this stress and uncertainty.

2

Who is co-signing those loans with you for Moore College of Art?

To be perfectly honest, you are taking on too much debt. You need to come up with a different plan. Go meet with the transfer admissions office at West Chester, and find out more about your options there.

3

Well I do have a plan, and that is to transfer. I’m just wondering if I should follow that plan or if it is worth it to stay in art school. I can never seem to find other art school graduates to talk to about their debt and how they’re managing it and making money and it’s very frustrating.

Also I don’t have any cosigners on my loans, all of my loans are federal loans that the school gave me.

4

Please explain exactly what the loans are that the school gave you. I’ve never heard of a student being able to take on that much debt without a parent or cosigner.

The usual recommendation is to borrow no more (in total) than you can reasonably expect to earn your first year out of school. For an art school graduate with very uncertain income expectations, $50,000 seems like much, much too much. Sorry. :frowning:

How is the rest of your tuition being paid? I looked it up, and Moore isn’t cheap. (It also looks pretty amazing, too!) Are you getting generous scholarships?

Before you give up on Moore entirely, I’d suggest a couple of things to try. First, go to the financial aid office and explain your dilemma. Ask if there are any additional scholarships you may be eligible for, or if there’s any way they can increase your aid.

Second, find out if you could get a job as an RA (residence assistant) in one of the dorms. That would save you having to commute every day, and you wouldn’t have to pay for housing.

Another thing to look into would be free housing somewhere closer to the school. Look at the suggestions posted [url=<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/discussion/comment/18297296/#Comment_18297296%5D%5Bb%5Dhere%5B/b%5D%5B/url”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/discussion/comment/18297296/#Comment_18297296]here[/url].

If all else fails, West Chester may be an affordable solution. $8,000/year is manageable even without merit scholarships. But you need to find out now if any of your credits would transfer - that’s important to know. If you’d have to go for four years . . . well, do the math: 3 x $13k isn’t a lot more than 4 x $8k.

Give us more detail on your financial situation - your cost of attendance at Moore, scholarships, grants, loans, and how much you’re earning from work during the school year and during the summers. Let’s see if we can help you figure this out. :slight_smile:

5

Well the loans I have out now are 6000 in direct unsubsidized Stanford loans, 3000 in a subsidized Stafford loan, and 4000 from a Perkins loan. And I got that because I did exactly what you suggested - I asked if there was anymore aid available for me. In addition to the extra loan money I got 4000 in extra scholarship money. I already have 18,000 in scholarships every year for four years, so plus the extra I had 22,000 in scholarships this year. So this year I didn’t pay for anything, it was all paid for in loans and scholarships. The thing is I don’t know if I’ll be able to get that extra scholarship money next year because it isn’t renewable, which means I would possibly have to take out more loans, and if they can’t give me the same amount of federal loans I would have to take out private loans which I absolutely do not want to do.

By the start I have next semester I should have about 4000 saved up. But the thing about West Chester is, even though the cost isnt incredibly cheaper, it’s much closer so I would be able to work more and pay less for commuting, plus I would be able to get a degree that would probably be more successful at getting me a job than an art degree.

The financial situation is a big deal and a big part of my decision but I don’t want to base my entire decision on what school will be cheaper. Art schools are some of the most expensive schools in the country and a lot of people are still attending them, and I feel like I’m getting a better deal than a lot of those people, but even then I’m not sure if it’s worth it.

6

Wow, those are large loans. They also exceed the limit for Stafford loans, unless your parents applied for and were denied a PLUS loan. Is that the case? And you should be eligible for up to $3,500 in subsidized loans, so why did Moore offer you $3k only? I could be mistaken, but I’d have expected to see $3,500 in subsidized Stafford, and $5,500 in unsubsidized.

The Perkins loan is subsidized, so that’s a good thing. (By the way, if you return to Moore and are able use your $4k in savings to replace loans, try to get them to reduce your unsubsidized Stafford loan first - that’s the one that’s costing you the most.)

I understand your concern about earning money during the school year, not to mention the cost of commuting. Explore the options I suggested. If you get a job as an RA, you’d be living at school, and could get another part-time job locally. If you can find a live-in position as a nanny or an assistant at a residential care facility, that would give you both local housing and some additional income.

You also need to go back to financial aid and find out what you’ll be offered next year. You should also ask the FA office if they have any ideas about local jobs that would include room/board. You never know - maybe they’ve had past students in similar situations and would have some suggestions.

As for jobs, I’m guessing that a degree from Moore would be the one most likely to get you a job in an art-related field. But speak with their career placement office and find out what your prospects would be. How many of their grad’s get art-related jobs directly out of school? And what do they get paid? Get as much info as you can before making a decision.

You’re right, you are getting an amazing deal at Moore . . . but amazing doesn’t necessarily mean affordable. :frowning:

7

Sorry I think you might be right, my subsidized and unsubsidized loans were the amounts you said, I was just estimating off the top of my head. My parents were denied the PLUS loan though. And I just found out that working as an RA at my school won’t pay for the entire cost of room and board, I’ll still have to pay about 25% of it, so I really don’t think that’s an option. I’lol try to find out more about those other things, but I think I am definitely leaning towards West Chester at this point. Thank you for your help!

8

Okay, 25% of $13,304 is a little over $3,326. If you get a part-time job nearby - say, 20 hrs/wk. - you should be able to earn at least $2,500 above that amount, even if you’re only making minimum wage. Add in the $1,800 that you’re paying right now for commuting, and perhaps a small part of your cost of food at home (?), and it adds up. And that’s school year earnings alone. Add in summer earnings and it could offset a significant chunk of your debt. Crunch the numbers and see what you come up with. It still won’t be as cheap as living at home and commuting to West Chester, but it may be manageable.

It sounds like you’re thinking this through, though. Don’t take on more than you can handle.

9

If I read the above post right, you would still be borrowing roughly 9000 (13,000-2500-1800). You would need to apply and get a RA job for all three years, hold a second job of 20 hours a week and pray that tuition doesn’t increase and that your grants and Perkin loans get renewed each year. I thought someone posted that the Perkins program was ending soon. If so, that will increase the interest cost. At the end, you owe 40,000 (13,000 + 3*10,000) plus interest. Honestly, this seems like a disaster waiting to happen.

Under the same plan (minus the RA job), the state school would cost roughly 2,000 (8000-3326-2500-transportation savings) using dodgersmom numbers. Total debt 21,000 (13000+4*2000) including the extra year. With the lower cost, you can afford to cut your hours if needed and still graduate with a reasonable debt load. You will also have a second major to give you more job options when you graduate.

10

The only art school graduate I know had parents who could afford to be full pay for her years at RISD. She graduated last spring, and is able to support herself by holding down two different part-time retail sales jobs while she takes occasional free-lance design gigs. If she had any debt at all, she wouldn’t be able to make payments on her current income.

11

The type of debt you are taking on is the most pernicious, unfair, unforgiving debt going. You can’t renegotiate, you can’t bundle them, nothing.

My SIL went to Art Centre in California. She waited tables full-time (at a high end restaurant, so v big tips) throughout, but 10 years out she was still teaching part-time in 3 different colleges to earn enough to pay down that debt (she would have loved to be teaching full time in one, but there were no ft jobs going).

Worse, when she finished Art Centre, between the work to get it done as fast as possible (she packed in the credits) and the working she was doing to pay for it, she was so burnt out that she had lost all interest in doing art herself. Only now (15+ years out), when she has been able to cut down to teaching in one university (still not a permanent job though), is she starting to do her own art again.

If art is your passion you will find a way to make it an important part of your life, but I think all the advice that you are getting here is saying the same thing: debt makes you a hostage to fortune.

12

@noname87 - In your calculation above, you neglected to include summer earnings, which could bring the annual loan amount down to about $6k, which is not excessive.

As for the OP’s prospects post-graduation, that’s something she needs to investigate at her school. They may have a very good track record at placing graduates in jobs, or they may not, but that’s something that, to a certain extent, is going to be specific to that school. It’s a very small and well-established school and may have very good connections with potential employers.

13

My niece went to a pricey name art school (parents paid for all of it) and now, 5 years later, she’s still not earning enough to support herself (she has to live at home and her parents still have to pay for most of her expenses).

I am sure that they regret paying all that money. If she had loans, there is no way she’d be able to pay them back and pay for any of her own expenses.

It doesnt’ sound like your parents can support you after college (and most parents don’t want to), so all this debt for an art degree is a very bad idea.