<p>My DD, a h.s. junior, took the SAT I for the first time in January and did fairly well: 760 CR, 660 M, 720 W. As far as she is concerned, she is done. She will also need to take SAT IIs this spring, and has argued that she should spend her limited time and energy on preparing for those. She is really busy, and I'm worried that she is burning out.</p>
<p>She is not shooting for the Ivy League, but some (not all) of the schools she's interested in are tough admits (Johns Hopkins, Emory, and Davidson). She wants to be pre-med and major in chemistry, history, or political science. Her current GPA is 3.7 at a competitive public magnet school in New Jersey. She has some interesting health-related ECs. </p>
<p>I'd like to see the Math score go up some, but I'm not sure it's worth pressuring her. Should I force her to retake or leave it alone?</p>
<p>It is probably worth having her take the SATs one more time. Most schools will take the highest score from each setting, and chances are that at least one score will improve. If she’s willing, it might be worth trying a few sessions with an SAT math tutor to bring up that score. Her current scores are excellent, and they are competitive for the schools you mention, but I think that a higher math score would be nice considering her interest in pre-med. </p>
<p>I understand how stressed she feels, but I don’t think it’s unreasonable to ask her to take the test one more time. You might want to show her the SAT middle 50% ranges for the schools that interest her. These are available on the collegeboard website for each school. That might help motivate her.</p>
<p>Math is probably the most critical score for STEM applicants. She might be able to stand on that test if she aces the Math II subject test. A self-selecting group takes that test, and the curve is generous, so something crazy like 88% score 800. Hmmm…here’s the chart: </p>
<p>Thanks for the responses. Davidson does not require but strongly recommends the SATII in Math (II) so she will definitely be taking that in June. She is not interested in being an engineering or math major. She has always tested higher on the verbal sections of standardized tests than on the math; however, she enjoys math as a school subject and has never struggled in it.</p>
<p>hahaha thank you for correcting my boo-boo in verbally expressing the significance of the 88%, ucbalumnus! Math is definitely not my strong point! Thankfully, I’m just the mom. My current senior is a STEM applicant and was relieved to score 800.</p>
<p>Take some pressure off and tell her to retake the SAT next fall- the first possible test date. That will take away pressure this spring and give her the summer to possibly review material to raise her scores. By August/September she may be more willing to retake the test as she gets into the swing of college applications.</p>
<p>The best time to take a subject test is soon after taking the course. If she takes Calculus next fall she will be away from the SAT material- my son didn’t study for the Math SAT II test because “we’re reviewing it in Calculus” (part of the fall getting started work) but he didn’t do as well as he could have. btw- he has taken several grad level math courses as an undergrad in college, so that’s ancient history for him. Also- we told him to retake that math subject test, for some reason he signed up for and retook the Dec SAT I- now has bragging rights to a perfect score, fwiw (nothing). More trivia- they use a top score of 990 for the Math GRE to overcome a low ceiling (getting an 800 on the quantitative GRE is routine for math grad student hopefuls).</p>
<p>New acronym for me- STEM. Tried looking it up and Google kept wanting to direct me to stem cell items. Finally succeeded- Science, Technology, Engineering and Mathematics. At first I thought it was state related- such as New Yorkers referring to the Regents exam and others HOPE scholarships. Really recent lingo- Obama era? Parents and son too far into science/removed from HS education et al to have noticed.</p>
<p>Leave the decision to your daughter, and don’t pester her on it. Since she plans to take the SAT II math, that score will speak for itself. She has plenty of time to decide on her own if she wants to retake.</p>
<p>Her SAT Math score of 660 is just a shade below the mid-point for Davidson (670), while her 760 CR places her easily in the top quartile (Davidson 75th percentile = 730). Her combined CR+M of 1420 puts her just under Davidson’s 75th percentile (1440). So I think she’s in pretty good shape there, but adding 20 or 30 points to the SAT Math score would make her an even stronger candidate.</p>
<p>At Johns Hopkins she’s bottom quartile in math (25th percentile = 670) and top quartile in CR (75th percentile = 730), a classic “unbalanced” candidate. Low second quartile CR+M (middle 50% = 1300-1500). I think it might make a difference to get that math score up at least into JHU’s third quartile. Still seems pretty reachy, but worth a shot.</p>
<p>Similar at Emory: she’s right at the 25th percentile in SAT Math (= 660), well into the top quartile in CR (75th percentile = 730), low second quartile combined CR + M (middle 50% = 1300-1480).</p>
<p>I agree with the suggestion to put off retaking the SAT until early in her senior year, so she doesn’t feel pressured. Sometimes a year’s additional maturity and academic work can add significantly to the point total. And SAT Math is an area where a little self-study and self-prep on timed practice tests can go a long way.</p>
<p>What Melissa54 and calmom said. Make sure she knows the pros/cons and let her decide. She’s got a competative score, so I don’t think you need to insist she does anything.</p>
<p>Another vote for next fall. (I’m guessing that if she’s not willing now, she may be then.) I think those scores are good enough that the colleges will take a good look at her application. But if she’s going to better them the chances are greater if she has a bit of time to grow and learn in between. And as the parent of a stressed-out jr., I think this spring is just the wrong time to push another thing. She did a great job the first time, let her enjoy it. By fall she’ll have a stronger sense of what she wants to do.</p>
<p>Show her where her scores fall for the schools she’s interested in. Also explain to her that a significant number of the lower scores may have been posted by hooked applicants, reducing the chances of an unhooked applicant with stats lower in the range for that school even further. (It sounds as if she is unhooked.)</p>
<p>It sounds to me as if an additional 30-40 points in the math section could make a difference for her at her reachier schools. If she says she’s done anyway, then she should make that decision with her eyes open. She can always retake in the fall, as others have pointed out.</p>
<p>Could she consider taking the ACT and see how she does? I agree with all who said that the math is a tad low for your comfort level (understandibly) and I believe the schools will superscore, so if the other scores go down a bit, it wont matter as long as she gets that math into the 700 range. Will she be applying for scholarships like Emory scholars? If so, she will need to bring up the scores. I struggled with this same question when my DS took the SAT in fall (beginning) of his junior year. He did really well, but he signed up to take it again spring (end) of his junior year to keep his options open. He took the SAT IIs in the spring (I totally agree- take them right after the end of the course) and ultimately decided not to retake the SAT, which he really only needed to tweak a bit for some scholarship competitions. He did just fine, but all of his scores were in the 700s. If merit $$ is an important part of this equation, have her retake.</p>
<p>Thanks for all the thoughtful responses. I will suggest to her that she retake the SAT I in the fall but leave it up to her. She is aware that admission to these schools is unlikely for her (yes, she is just another suburban white girl from New Jersey). Part of her reluctance to retake comes from defiance and fear of failure (i.e. if she doesn’t get in, she can tell herself that she didn’t really give it her all, so she doesn’t have to feel so bad). This self-defeating attitude is why I’m not sure I should just let her self-sabotage at this point of the process. She goes to school with kids who retake the SAT I 3 or 4 times. I would certainly never expect that.</p>
<p>I know she doesn’t want to do this, but FWIW you can still register (late) for the March 12 SAT–if she already prepped a lot, she could go ahead and retake right now. That’s what my D is going to do.</p>
<p>Suburban NJ girl is a plus at Davidson! If she does better she can OWN it rather than take the “he who expects nothing will never be disappointed” approach. Slightly higher math score will also perhaps mean a slightly higher merit $$ offer at Tulane too. If she can get her total SAT up in the 2220-2250 range, she’ll be golden.</p>
<p>She does NOT have a self-defeating attitude!!! I think that you (OP, the parent) have a misunderstanding of the role of SAT’s in the admission process. Your daughter’s GPA is much more important, and there is very little wiggle room in that. A 3.7 GPA is strong but – unless your d’s school is very unusual - does not put your d. at the very top of her class. </p>
<p>Colleges look at SAT scores to verify GPA’s, not to bolster them. That is, when they see a student with a 4.0 GPA from a high school they don’t know much about, a high SAT confirms that that the student is very capable, whereas a lower SAT might indicate that the school is weak or subject to grade inflation. The ad coms <em>know</em> that something is off if there is a misfit or mismatch between GPA & SAT score. Is your daughter even in the top 10% her graduating class with the 3.7 GPA? Does her SAT profile match her GPA distribution – that is, does she have A’s in her English classes and other classes involving a lot of reading, some B’s in math classes? If so-- a higher math SAT could raise questions in the mind of an ad com – she doesn’t want them thinking she’s a slacker. </p>
<p>I don’t see “self-sabotage” in your question – I see well-meaning parental sabotage. Of course you want the best for your daughter, but there is parental sabotage in devaluing a set of early scores that are excellent – you should be celebrating with your daughter, not sending the ego-deflating message that the scores aren’t good enough. And, as I hoped that I explained above, there is parental sabotage in misunderstanding the college selection process, directing attention toward test scores when your d. may be much better off focusing her attention at other elements of the process.</p>
<p>Your d. has made the intelligent observation at this point that her limited time is best spent focusing on the SAT II’s, not the SAT I. As a parent, do you really want to undermine that effort? Once those scores are in, together with the 2nd semester grades, the picture may changes somewhat.</p>