Smith College

Colleges and Universities A-Z Smith College
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<p>TD: Dude, cool it okay? 2200 is a lot of people, and studies have shown neither I nor your daughter probably know more than 100 people on any kind of a personal basis. There were also people I liked in Talbot. Your daughter doesn't know ALL the girls in Talbot. I and multiple of my friends who are a very diverse bunch had the experiences we did at Smith. Some of my friends are such friendly and outgoing people I can't imagine a soul saying they have a "chip on their shoulder." I think prospies need to visit and decide for themselves. I don't want to argue this with you, but unless your daughter claims to know everyone or even 1/10th of Smith (which if she is as studious as you say is unlikely), you have no right calling me a liar.</p>

<p>As a completely different, presumably isolated event: last year at Smith there was even a case of open-racism in one house, where two girls had been tormenting a muslim for two years, and an activist friend of mine helped lobby the admin until they would admit there was a problem. This was covered in the Sophian. These things happen at every school, some moreso than Smith, some less. That's just the way it is.</p>

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<p>I have no idea whether or not you're a liar or not. But your aggressively negative views run counter to substantial experience to the contrary, I'll certainly call you out on them and, no, I won't indulge you and "cool it." </p>

<p>In my daughter's search, she ran across several disagreements between sources. Some mattered to her, some didn't. Most she resolved by having extended dialogue with multiple sources and resolving in her mind one way or the other before visting. A couple of issues she did indeed confirm upon visiting. </p>

<p>For you to put your, ah, idiosyncratic opinions out there is perfectly fine. To put them out there and blithely conclude, "But visit for yourself", letting the opinions go unchallenged, is more than a little disingenuous.</p>

<p>Indeed, as I said in another thread: you're unhappy at Smith. We get it. But you're also smugly superior to and so condescending about your fellow students that I can't even imagine why you'd even consider staying. </p>

<p>There are a handful of colleges with extremely intense academic environments--U/Chicago, Swat, Reed, maybe St. Johns--and because Smith isn't one of those, you make a fatuous leap to asserting that the academic environment is like a good state school. </p>

<p>When you cite transfer rates to professional schools, you draw from the WSJ "study" about admissions to graduate/professional schools that used a one-year snapshot relying upon five schools <em>each</em> for medical, law, and business schools. Virtually everyone realizes how bogus this study was, though it did do its intended job, which is to sell newspapers.</p>

<p>You also play rhetorical false cards by suggesting that my D said your friends have chips on their shoulders. No...only you. She's read enough of your posts to get the picture: poor Ecape, stuck among intellectual hoi polloi at Smith, who should have been admitted elsewhere, yada yada yada. </p>

<p>Okay, you're unhappy, obsessive, and have a chip on your shoulder. And then you want to be treated with kid gloves. Nuts to that.</p>

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<p>Listen: since you feel the need to keep asking your daughter, obviously I am not the only obsessive debater on this board. Secondly, I don't know how I can be condescending to Smithies in general when I say I have made many excellent friends and met people smarter than me. I withdrew my comparison to state schools, b/c I admitted I didn't know for sure. I have stated quite clearly that Smith is not easy per say, just easier than my hs. Finally, I have not for a minute said that your daughter's experience CANNOT be what she says it is. I have simply made the point that there are many different experiences to be got from any place, based on who one has met there and what one is accustomed to. Therefore, I think it is best for prospies to visit, rather than go on a couple of other peoples' testimonies. Are you discouraging people from visiting? Or do you simply find it difficult to believe a hs could be harder than Smith, or that anyone could have had different experiences than your obviously extremely-bright daughter?</p>

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<p>TD...obviously this kid has no intentions other than to immerse herself in negative criticism of Smith and its sudent body.</p>

<p>{poor Ecape, stuck among intellectual hoi polloi at Smith, who should have been admitted elsewhere, yada yada yada. }</p>

<p>Bout says it all! Everytime this kid posts something new she contradicts herself. I say let her spew what she has to spew and get on with it. Best of luck, Ecape, on your (hopefully) leaving Smith and going on to bigger and better schools. We wish you the best!</p>

305

<p>BJM, you didn't even address my post.</p>

<p>Did I like the majority of people I met at Smith? Absolutely.
Was I inspired by many people I met at Smith? Yes.
Are there people I would consider flaky in existence at Smith? Yes.
Did I think I was the most academically focused student at Smith? Absolutely not, though I think I was ONE OF the harder-working people.
Do I think it's typical for students to have some complaints about Smith? Yes, as is the case for students at every college.
Do I think Smith students are generally as academically-focused as any in the nation? No, but what the average Smithie lacks in academic-focus to the average student at the most intense schools, she gains in what my father would call EQ (emotional quotient = personality). No one can have everything.
Would I ever discourage someone from going to Smith, if they had visited it and liked it? No, I have even defended Smith, and feel perfectly content to have gone there. Even a little proud of the PC-liberal dyke stereotype.
Do I think it's insulting to state that Smith does not claim the most academically-focused student body in the nation? NO. Because I know students who have picked one school over the other, such as Wesleyan over Swarthmore, or U of I over UChi for the very reason they DIDN'T want too intense of an environment. There are many rewarding things to be got from a less intensive environment, such as potentially stronger friendships.</p>

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<p>{Do I think it's insulting to state that Smith does not claim the most academically-focused student body in the nation?}</p>

<p>Heresay!</p>

<p>{Do I think it's insulting to state that Smith does not claim the most academically-focused student body in the nation?}</p>

<p>Heresay!</p>

<p>{Do I think it's insulting to state that Smith does not claim the most academically-focused student body in the nation?}</p>

<p>Heresay!</p>

<p>{Absolutely not, though I think I was ONE OF the harder-working people.}</p>

<p>Heresay!</p>

<p>{There are many rewarding things to be got from a less intensive environment,}</p>

<p>Heresay!</p>

<p>{Even a little proud of the PC-liberal dyke stereotype.}</p>

<p>Dyke? OUCH!</p>

307

<p>"Me thinks you protest too much!"</p>

308

<p>Yikes. I think this has gotten waaaaay out of hand and probably isnt what prospies should take into account on what Smith is really like. It all sounds more like DailyJolt posting to me. </p>

<p>I think every person has their gripes about Smith. And I think it's really pretentious to make comments about how much more academically minded you are than others, because like you said Ecape-most Smithies only know about 100 (maybe!) on a personal level to know how much work they do. Please find a college that can handle your brilliance. But all of these contradictions and back and forth about moot issues at Smith shouldnt be wasting our time here. And like I said before arent good for prospies to read=big bad impression. Thanks.</p>

309

<p>{{so where you get waspy flakes}}</p>

<p>What are you? Jewish, Asian, other?</p>

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<p>Well said, Sara. I for one will not involve myself in these arguments anymore. As a prospective parent of a potential Smithie, she and I are very pleased with her selection of Smith. We see it as a tremendous fit for her. I wish Ecape well in her endeavors as she searches for the right "fit" for her.</p>

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<p>Seriously. Whatever. I do not doubt that had I graduated hs from the impoverished local school-system I attended through middle school and then gone to Smith, I would have found Smith very challenging. I regret that the internet does not allow for tone-of-voice or expressions, and therefore allows so many different and potentially malicious interpretations of one written sentence. I am tempted to think if I met any of your (pl.) daughters at Smith, chances are we would get along just fine, and a conversation like we've been attempting would make a lot more sense. Who knows, maybe I HAVE already been friendly with some of your daughters at Smith.</p>

<p>In truth, being the liberal I am, I am the first to say our culture puts WAY too much emphasis on book-smartness. I feel this way to what some may call a radical degree. In middle school I used to argue w/ my mom that construction-workers' salaries shouldn't be so different from businessmen's or scientist's, because construction-work is so hard. I would gladly trade a couple dozen pts off my IQ (whatever that may be -I dunno) to be unusually talented in music or acting. It's just that I think of academics as my thing, so I AM a bit obsessive about them.</p>

<p>But fine. Whatever. Think whatever you want about me and my intentions. All you have to do is ask me not to risk any more posts on the Smith forum, and I'll oblige.</p>

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<p>Thanks.</p>

<p>So any more interesting comments on Smith life for our lovely prospies?
Housing, food, ec's...?</p>

313

<p>I'll try to be helpful with that specific question sara, to stave off some of the bad feelings:</p>

<p>Housing is def above-average for a college. I like the smaller houses, but the quads offer a more typical college dorm experience with weekend-parties in their big rooms. Cutter-Z is an acquired taste visually, but it's easy to get singles there. It also has a three-day burntime which is always preferable to the oldest houses' three-minute burntime lol. Food is also generally good. Different houses offer different menus, which is pretty unusual for a college. The "normal" menu can get a little greasy and repetitive for my tastes, but the vegetarian/healthy menu offers some awesome choices, included wholewheat waffles and lots of fresh fruits and veggies <em>yum</em>. Other choices include oriental, "soul-food," grab-and-go. A lot of the dining halls leave out treats like icecream for students after-hours -ALWAYS appreciated. Some upper-classmen may still be complaining about the consolidation of the dining rooms (each house traditionally had their own and everyone in the house ate there)... but I personally like being able to choose where I eat b/c it makes it easier to stay friends with people I've met from across campus.</p>

<p>Northampton is definitely a good college town. If you like to cook and you live nearer downtown, there are some great little fresh-food markets a couple of blocks away. And sometimes, students above freshman year will live in apartments downtown, like above the rice pudding place, which is a MUST TRY (unless you hate rice pudding). They have like 20 flavors!</p>

<p>Some houses have student-use kitchens, some have their own exercise rooms, some have computer rooms. Unfortunately as a freshman you don't get to select a preference for a specific house, just for a "general campus location."</p>

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<p>There are tons of ECs to choose from -as I've mentioned Smith Dems and womens' groups are some big activist ones. Smith has more acapella(sp?) groups than just about any college, some being considered more prestigious than others. Smith and the five-colleges have dance groups ranging from belly-dancing, to hip-hop, to modern, to swing, to gumboot (African). Sports are pretty strong at Smith. Rugby is an awesome-fun sport in my opinion that tends to be most popular at women's colleges, but carries a stereotype (I was best friends with 2 of the 3 openly-straight women on the team of 60). Sports teams tend to party together. Cultural groups are strong at Smith -probably also true of many colleges. A lot of women spend their time by simply hanging out with their friends in their house, doing stereotypical "girly-things" that probably would not happen as much at a coed school. Girls in my house were always watching chick-flicks. My friends and I (very diverse group ethnoculturally and socioeconomically as I have mentioned) had a "massage/homeade food/dance-around-in-underwear/philosophize about science, politics, and sex" night about once a week.</p>

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<p>{{Unfortunately as a freshman you don't get to select a preference for a specific house,}}</p>

<p>Sure you can, although there are no guarantees. My daughter asked for a specific house and why she was doing so on the comment section of the housing form. She got her house. I know the note made the diff because I was told of that fact during a conversation with housing.</p>

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<p>{{as I've mentioned Smith Dems}}</p>

<p>There is a Republican club. Don't forget the snotty waspy girls. They need a place to play too</p>

<p>{{with 2 of the 3 openly-straight women on the team of 60).}}</p>

<p>Maybe a few more straight women but not many. It’s the same even at the coed colleges but to a lesser degree. There /are/ lesbians at the coed LACs if you can believe that.</p>

<p>{{Smith has more acapella(sp?) groups than just about any college, some being considered more prestigious than others.}} </p>

<p><a href="http://sophia.smith.edu/crapapella/%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://sophia.smith.edu/crapapella/&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

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<p>Yup us snotty WASPy Girls and our Republican club. ;) Its fabulous.</p>

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<p>I know there's Smith Repubs... I was just naming the biggest, most active groups I am aware of. As I have expressed previously, I think it is best if student's speak from their own experiences about schools and don't try to express things empirically (UNLESS they have carefully-analyzed studies w/ appropriate random samples, or they have talked to an appropriate, objective authority (like the EC director), of course).</p>

<p>I know there are lesbians at coed schools too lol. I just meant that rugby seems popular at all the all-female colleges. (And for the record, I always use "gay" instead of "lesbian," b/c so many people at Smith like things gender-neutral, and b/c for me "lesbian" conjures up images of excited teenage-boys and male-geared skin-flicks, all of which is of course condescending to real women who choose to love other women.)</p>

<p>sara: haha, in my life I've met some Repubs I really like, who also made me think about my strongly-held political convictions. I'd have to meet you and judge for myself where you hit on my snobby-WASP-ometer. Cheers and luck with transfer. I'll try not to be resentful if you get into Midd and I don't :P</p>

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<p>I was thinking, a couple of people on the Smith forum have mentioned considering PC a NEGATIVE aspect of Smith, and I exhibited some of that above. Prospies might be interested to hear more about the PC issue. I personally don't consider PC negative. Here is my quick, diplomatic philosophy on PC: It's just another form of politesse. I really have no idea of the historical reasons for why we shake hands in our culture, for example. But shaking hands is not too inconvenient and it shows people you acknowledge them as a person/avoids offending people. Language usage always evolves over time. It's no more harmful for it to evolve in response to PC than for any other reason. So be polite; be PC.</p>

<p>Perhaps some people think of PC as patronizing -but it seems to me unless the PC is used in a patronizing way, that's a minority. And you can't please everyone.</p>

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<p>"You dont have to be politically correct to be right"</p>

<p>Smith republicans slogan. Being PC all the time is a pain in the ass, lets be honest.</p>