<p>BJ, are you still in school?</p>
<p>"Ive heard something like 40% of the student population."</p>
<p>Better 40 percent gay than 40 percent homophobic, in my opinion. At least in my book.</p>
<p>And, in case you're wondering, I consider myself conservative on many issues (mostly economic issues), but I couldn't STAND a predominantly conservative social atmosphere. It's what you get from being from Berkeley. </p>
<p>I guess I'm curious about to what extent disagreements with politics leech into personal friendships/relationships at Smith. I mean, here in the Bay Area (from my experience, anyway), people may tell a conservative, "You're conservative?! How awful! Now lets go out for lunch," but not, "You're conservative?! I'm not talking to you anymore!" This way I can avoid being harassed by supporting gay rights, but people still respect me for expressing more conservative views on other issues. Do you know what situation is more realistic at Smith? </p>
<p>And a question about Smith's housing system: Do you know how common it is for people to switch houses? It seems like there would be a lot of people dissatisfied with the people in their house, especially in the first year. Same goes with roommates. </p>
<p>Also, how competitive are people with each other about grades? Do people generally set their own standards, or do students madly try to do better than everyone else to be #1 in the class (like at many of the ultra-prestigious school)?</p>
<p>Thanks.</p>
<p>Wes-Cali: No, I am no longer in school. Received my doctorate in '93. My D will be attending Smith this Fall, however.</p>
<p>Arianneag: I can try to answer your questions, but as I said before RLT and TD would be the definitive answer men. As afr as being liberal vs. conservative at Smith; there is no doubt that NoHo in general swings way to the left. Although, from all my readings about Smith, I find the campus to be very accepting of either; while Smith Women are very strong willed and love to debate issues. I do not see that as a deterrant either way for you, or otyhers, regardless of your political views.</p>
<p>Housing is another issue that we are facing in this household as well. From what I understand, Smithies fall in love with their houses and become very close to their housemates. I am sure, however, that if the chemistry is not right, it can be changed at some time or another. The house system is one of the best things about Smith IMHO.</p>
<p>As far as competitiveness at Smith for grades, I do not see that in any of the students I have spoken to, and as far as TD and RLT have indicated, it is rarely a problem at Smith. I have found Smithies to be very helpful, non-bragging, and hard-working types who like to have fun on the weekends, but work their a--es off during the week.</p>
<p>}}One unfortunate girl, whose name was the same as a Republican first lady and was pretty "out there" with her Republicaness(!?) got harrassed fairly}}</p>
<p>Actually, there was a girl from the R club that was spit on a few weeks ago during a debate regarding the V Monologues. Im still ticked. I would be just as ticked if a R spit on someone. But one sick student isnt indicative of an entire campus. Additionally, one girl being harassed who was out there and probably not part of the mainstream Republicans or their club certainly doesnt warrant (at least to me) comparing the tolerance shown the Republicans with giving a man a fair trial before being hanged. </p>
<p>Doing so is no different (to me ) as making the same joke against the students at Amherst, Williams, Midd, etc. and their tolerance of the gay or Black community. Sure, there may an instance of a student that represents a minority getting harassed at any of colleges, but that doesnt constitute inferring the whole campus as being intolerant of the gay or Black students/organizations, even though theyre a very small minority.</p>
<p>{{The few times I dipped into Jolt I encountered some exchanges that were as, ah, sprited as some of the more zingy}}</p>
<p>I agree, but you know as well as I, no one takes the Jolt seriously. There are always a few fringe students who complain to the extreme about everything, and you dont even know if theyre Smithies.
Hell, if you believed everything on the Jolt youd think Starbucks was part of Castros regime. Although Wal-mart may be</p>
<p>}}And the Dateline thing was the re-tread of a joke: it was originally about the remaining "American Indians" in 2020 as told on Rowan & Martin's Laugh-In in 1969.}}</p>
<p>I had no way of knowing that because I never read the original post. Besides, even had I watched the R&M show, theres no way Id remember a joke 36 yrsor hours, for that matter-- later. However, I still dont see the point of the using the joke in reference to the R club. No big deal though. Its hard to understand ones sense of humor by words on a puter screen</p>
<p>{{{I have no brief about the Democratic Club so I have no idea where you're pulling that from}}</p>
<p>Comments made and discussions Ive had with students. I know women in both clubs. There are a couple of women in the R club I know and admire greatly and am very aware of their tolerance for others, gays, Democrats etc. and the friendship they have with polar opposites and the tolerance shown them by fellow class and housemates, which is why your comments spiked my ire. The fact it was in the middle of the night and I wasnt thinking clearly may have had an influence too-lol</p>
<p>{{From your touchiness, one might deduce that you're a Republican.}}</p>
<p>No, Im not a Republican per se. I do believe in fiscal reasonability, but Im certainly not anywhere near to agreeing with the right wing of the party or the evangelical Christians. Im more of a McCain R
I even liked Dean when he was governor of VT. He did a great job. I dont know when he lost it.
As I said, my touchiness came from what I perceived as making a joke of people I know and like a great deal and improperly categorizing the women of Smith as being so intolerant the R club should have difficulty even existing</p>
<p>{{As for the Left Coast}}</p>
<p>I was wrong to post that. I certainly wasnt trying to offend you. I actually had in mind the fact the state is indeed on the left hand side of the map, and youre almost never on campus because of the distance to hear or witness the interactions of the different groups of students. I lived in Calif and have relatives there. Im well aware the state has every political view possible, and you cant categorize a state by a general reputation or idiotic comments made by a few political or radio show hacks.</p>
<p>It's fairly easy to change houses. The easiest is at the end of a school year, but in the middle of one you just need to talk to a few people about <em>why</em> you want to move, and submit a form indicating which houses you'd like to move into. It's usually easier to find a new roommate within a house. A lot of people like a house but aren't compatible with their roommates, and first years changing rooms is very common.</p>
<p>Borgin: Thank you for your info. Our D liked Smith - had two tour visits, one summer, another on Junior Preview day. Very positive and then in November, she went for an overnight visit to both Smith and MHC. Left with a very positive impression of MHC amd negative of Smith. Her complaint was the host and her roommate lived in a smaller house. They were both rather negative hosts and left our D with the thought that if she went to Smith and was placed in a smaller house with similar negative housemates that it could be a very long four years. Consequently, that put Smith in 'last' place among her applied to schools.</p>
<p>Her thoughts was, a roommate match could be negative anywhere, but it is easily changed, but a whole house! So if she could get out of a 'negative' setting at Smith, that could be a major input to her final selection. Thanks.</p>
<p>Yes, you can switch roomates and or houses even in your first year. I believe there is a 6 week period before changes are allowed. Also if she put on her housing form that she doesn't want to be in one of the smaller houses, she is unlikely to get put in one. The quad is mostly large houses so there is almost always some people she would like.</p>
<p>{{ I believe there is a 6 week period before changes are allowed. }}</p>
<p>Six weeks could be an eternity! The housing freeze only lasts for three. :) And yes, you can put specific housing requests on the form if you like, ie "More than 70 residents" or "I'd prefer Elm Street but not houses x, y, or z."</p>
<p>Megan, my D requested a house of more than 40 students to avoid the pitfalls of any potential "small house" syndrome. Fwiw, all the houses of Green St. are also substantial in size, no worries there.</p>
<p>Even if the academics were the same--and Smith is heads and shoulders above MoHo, in almost every possible way--the location did it for my D. A 5 minute walk to Northampton beats a 15 minute bus ride to Amherst any day.</p>
<p>In regards to the OP; If you really are interested in Biology and don't like having to take certain course requirements, then Smith sounds like a great fit. Their bio program is not short of being spectacular, and they have no core requirements. To try and compare the women at both institutions just doesn't make any sense to me. You will find some you like and others you do not at both; or anywhere else for that matter. Look at the fit "for you!" Both are great schools; although IMHO, and a bent-one at that because my D will be attending Smith, I have to agree with SamAtty on Smith being heads and shoulders above MoHo. Especially in bio and sciences.</p>
<p>Well, I don't mean to be unkind to MoHo students but D didn't even want me to park the car there. That aside, I've heard a persistent thread that MoHo is a, ah, little more "insulated" and "less demanding" academically overall, that the speed of the pitching is faster at Smith. This from people who have taken classes both places...not my D, so nobody blame her for this opinion.</p>
<p>I don't mean to generalize, but isn't EVERY school fairly intolerant of conservatives these days? I'm sure some "out there" Republicans would encounter discomfort at any number of colleges, not just girls' schools.</p>
<p>
[quote]
They were both rather negative hosts and left our D with the thought that if she went to Smith and was placed in a smaller house with similar negative housemates that it could be a very long four years. Consequently, that put Smith in 'last' place among her applied to schools.
[/quote]
MeganVirg...I hope that one bad overnight doesn't sway your daughter from attending Smith. The experience you mentioned could have happened anywhere. I think the advice of asking for a larger house will help, as there are more women to interact with, if that's what she likes. Academically, your D could be sorry she made the decision. Hope all works out.</p>
<p>This is a tangential question, but I am trying to gently coax my D into seriously considering a women's college. Several of the old "seven sister" types of schools keep coming up on her match type of lists. She's currently a junior in a co-ed boarding school so although she has boys all around, she's kind of like at a woman's college in that her all girls' dorm is locationally separate from the other dorms, and is populated by the more diverse types of students (international, multi-cultural, lesbian, outside-of-box, higher gpa kind of girls). So in that respect, I think many of these northeastern women's colleges may be familiar to her. She would like to attend a co-ed college, so I'm asking her to look at Vassar, but could anyone help me understand how comfortable a heterosexual girl would feel at the following schools (and I understand that this is a Smith forum, but maybe some of you also considered the other women's colleges and would care to throw in your two cents' worth). We're talking Barnard, Wellesley, Mt. Holyoke, Bryn Mawr, your venerable Smith. I think she's discovering that although she really likes diversity (and requested an international student as a roommate) that the strident pc thing is counterproductive. She mentioned that the international student clubs were actually fractionalizing the campus instead of bringing it cohesion, and thought that organizations need to be reworked to de-emphasize differences and look for commonalities. Would this "peacemaking", moderate stance leave her stranded in the middle at these colleges?</p>
<p>Either would be an excellent choice. I know women who have attended both and I have spent time on both campuses. My perception is that Smith would be the more liberal of the two but not intolerant of ANYBODY. Bright women from varying backgrounds. Generous merit aid at Mount Holyoke.. don't know about Smith. Plenty of guys close by (if that's your choice and if it matters) at Amherst, UMass Amherst, Hampshire.</p>
<p>"Would this "peacemaking", moderate stance leave her stranded in the middle at these colleges?"</p>
<p>LOL! My d. is a Quaker (and very active in the local Northampton Friends Meeting - one of the reasons she chose Smith). She gets to use her "peacemaking" skills. </p>
<p>There is one difference among the schools that has an impact on discussion patterns. Smith has by far the largest number of very low-income (Pell Grant) and low-income students of any prestigious private liberal arts college or university. The "pc" thang, whatever that is, can also reflect differences in life experience, which, in the case of Smith, will be wider and more pronounced. The flipside is that, with the exception of the French House (Dawes) and the two coops (Hopkins and Tenney), Smith doesn't do "theme" housing, and house draws are close to being random. We've witnessed far more "mixing" among students of various racial, religious, cultural, and political ways of being at Smith than we have anywhere else. Are there frictions? Sure! But that's part of the experience of growing up.</p>
<p>President Christ has instituted a continuing forum on civil discourse called Common Ground <a href="http://www.smith.edu/future/next/civil.php%5B/url%5D">http://www.smith.edu/future/next/civil.php</a> with aid from the Ford Foundation. I don't know how well-attended it is, but I think it would be a great idea for other colleges to emulate.</p>
<p>InvestorScooter, how comfortable a straight girl would be at Smith was one of the two questions my D had after Smith rose on her radar screen. Two visits, two overnights, and now almost two years later...no problem. I actually posed a similar question to yours on this board when D was in the search process and received a very long and positive e-mail from another Smith parent, which did a lot to put my mind at ease.</p>
<p>Most of the time, one's orientation, either way, isn't noticed. There's some occasional "oh, darn" when someone find that someone else is not the "right" orientation but I've not heard of any great discomfort arising. Indeed, one can get "no sale" or "not interested" responses in a co-ed environment as well and I suspect that there are more guys that have trouble taking "no thank you" for an answer than girls.</p>
<p>My D is one of those "non-strident" students who thinks that stridency is counter-productive...and she's fine at Smith, just ignores some of the over-the-top PC-ness when it surfaces.</p>
<p>My daughter, who is straight (but liberal-minded and tolerant), considered Bryn Mawr, Barnard and Mt. Holyoke before deciding on Smith. Her impression of Mt. Holyoke was that it was less selective than Smith, based on who Mt Holyoke admitted (from her high school) as well as the women she met on campus. She was turned off by the fact that their average SAT numbers are inflated, since they only report the numbers submitted to them (and only high scorers submit since SAT's are optional). The campus, while absolutely gorgeous, seemed more remote to her than Smith's. Her impression of Bryn Mawr, where she overnighted, was that it attracted quieter, more studious women than Smith, and seemed a bit dull. It also did not have an art dept. She LOVED the overnight she had at Smith, where she was paired up with smart, happy women who sold the school to her. She sat in on two classes and was very impressed. The small classes, the great advising, the lack of core requirements, the large number of available courses -- all were very appealing to her. Other schools do not have these opportunities. In the end, though, it's all about the fit.</p>
<p>Welcome to the forum, MomofSmithie, and welcome to your daughter to the Smith community!</p>
<p>I am the mother of a senior Smithie (who also happens to be straight but liberal and tolerant) who never would have considered a single-sex school had she not absolutely fallen in love with Smith during a summer program that she attended there after her sophomore year in high school. After that experience, no other college could hit her hot button -- and believe me, we spent a lot of time on road tours looking for alternatives. </p>
<p>We happen to live very near Bryn Mawr and I agree that Noho is a more vibrant college town. I refer to Noho as being lilke a New England version of NYC's Greenwich Village.</p>
<p>Our reaction to Barnard was that it had a very "back door to Columbia" feeling about it. That may be unfair, but that was what we picked up when my D attended a prospective students weekend there. </p>
<p>My D has had a great experiece at Smith and this summer told me she couldn't imagine having gone anywhere else. </p>
<p>Best wishes to your family for the next four years!</p>