<p>I'm having a great deal of difficulty deciding between these fine (but very different) institutions. I've been admitted to Smith (with a STRIDE) and Dartmouth, and I am waiting to hear from Princeton. I decided to post on the Smith board first because I've found that the discussion on here tends to be less focused on name and prestige, more on the actual attributes of the school. :)</p>
<p>First, a little background on me:
I come from a middle-middle class family (about $80,000/year) in a smallish but remarkably liberal/artsy town in northern Idaho. I consider myself to be politically liberal, especially when it comes to social issues. (Human rights are very important to me.) I'm mainly a humanities girl--I love literature, languages, and dance. Not sure yet about a major; I was originally thinking French, but now I'm leaning more towards comparative literature. Either way, I definitely want to study abroad, preferably for a whole year. I really enjoy small, discussion-based classes (My AP English class this year is heaven!), and I am very outspoken in class, though not so much outside of it. One concern I had about Smith is the fact that I have very few male friends, and I generally have trouble meeting/talking to guys (I am straight). I am also not much of a partier: while I'm not necessarily averse to drinking, I've never done it, and I don't intend to make it a major part of my college experience.</p>
<p>So, based on this general background, do you have any information that might help me to make my decision? I'm happy to answer any more questions about my interests and such. I just want to figure this out so I can stop <em>worrying</em> all the time about where I'm going next year! :S</p>
<p>Thanks for your help, and sorry about the long post,
Cygne</p>
<p>Unfortunately, I really don’t think any of us can tell you that one school is better than the others for what you want. Smith has very good French and Comp Lit programs, two full-year French-speaking study abroad options, and a focus on teaching (ie, professors really care about teaching–it’s not just something they do in their spare time from doing research). But the other schools you mentioned are of course wonderful, too. My guess (and this is really just a guess) is that there is more drinking at most co-ed schools, including the Ivies, than there is at Smith, but you can certainly make quieter friends and partying friends at any of them. Three years after graduation, I have friends from Dartmouth and Princeton, as well as Smith, and they’re all wonderful people. </p>
<p>Have you visited any of the schools? If at all possible, that’s what I’d suggest. Also, think long and hard about how much debt you’ll have to take out at each school…I think the amount you have to pay in student loans can often be a bigger deciding factor in what you do after graduation than what college you attended is! </p>
<p>Hi, Cygne, and congratulations again. I agree with SaP: they are all great schools with very different atmospheres, and it will come down to the best fit for you. I assume that if you applied to Smith in the first place, there were many things you liked about it and that you feel that you could be happy there. My D is a sophomore and has found many friends, some the partying type and some as focused on their studies as she is, and both seem to thrive. Her roommate, whom she adores, was a shy, rather insecure girl when they first met, and is now well on the way to becoming a strong and confident young woman while keeping her thoughtfulness and empathy towards others.
As for post-smith, TheDad and Mini’s brilliant daughters among others havefound that both employers and grad schools hold Smith in high esteem.
Now, the more negative point of view. It definitely is more difficult to meet boys, and taking classes at the 5 college consortium takes a little bit og organisation. According to my D, and except if you have a particular requirement that cannot be met at Smith, the majority of students who go running off to Amherst et al tend to be the partying type. Take a look at the list of courses and you’ll see why: as TheDad 's daughter remarked: “you can spend 4 years at Smith, and still find 4 years worth of classes you would have wished to take”!
Just one more point. I am usually hyper critical of JYA programs which can be a rip off. But the Smith Paris program is excellent, very professional, language and course-wise.
So there you are. It’s a tough choice, and I wish you luck in choosing the best for you. The good news is, you can’t really go wrong.</p>
<p>Ahh, I feel your pain, Cygne. I’m about to tear my hair out over Yale v. Smith. :(</p>
<p>I’m also looking at comp lit, and the department at Smith is absolutely fabulous. All of the language classes I sat in on were fantastic. I don’t know much about Dartmouth, but no matter what, that’s a tough choice. Good luck. </p>
<p>My d. is a graduate student at Princeton. Her year of German at Smith got her the equivalent of two years of German at Princeton. Her Italian passed her out of all grad language requirements all together. </p>
<p>She is currently preceptoring (TAing) a music class with 275 students!</p>
<p>If you are looking purely at academic quality, I don’t think this is a tough choice.</p>
<p>Thanks, everyone, for your helpful posts. I definitely have a lot to think about! I must say, the simple fact of the tone here on the Smith board does sway me a bit–I see a lot fewer contentious posts and more proper English. :)</p>
<p>@stacy: I have visited Princeton and Smith both briefly, but not Dartmouth. I was able to do a whirlwind tour of East Coast schools in early September because my dad had a conference in Baltimore, so his plane ticket was paid for. I had hoped to visit Dartmouth for their admitted students weekend in April, but my family is just over the income cutoff for transportation assistance. Smith, on the other hand, has offered to reimburse us for up to $500 in travel expenses for their admitted stuents weekend. I am waiting anxiously for financial aid packages, and if there is a clear difference of say, an extra $10,000+ dollars in debt at the end, then my decision may well be made for me.</p>
<p>@Lost in translat: You are correct, I did see something in Smith that I very much like and admire. I love the concept of houses, the small classes, and the idea of finding a place where I’m not expected to accomplish more than the guys while showing less pride. I also like the treatment of dance as an academic discipline rather than a second-rate EC. (Princeton is better in this respect than Dartmouth.) I have no doubt that I would wish to take a class or two off campus, but I certainly won’t be running around in search of male companionship. If I do end up dating anyone, it will have to be pure serendipity. I’d be interested to know your thoughts on other JYA programs–any that you think are particularly worthwhile?</p>
<p>@lookbeyond: It’s nice to hear about your experience with the classes, because I didn’t have time to sit in on any when I visited. (That’s what happens when you tour nine colleges in seven days!)</p>
<p>@mini: That’s a fascinating observation about the language classes; I honestly would not have thought that at all. How does your daughter like graduate school at Princeton?</p>
<p>Mixed bag. She loves her department, and the research opportunities she has been afforded (some of which are directly connected to the work she had done as a STRIDE.) Smith had far more resources in early music than Princeton, and she misses them. She is not fond of the town of Princeton (which is a big let-down after Northampton.) She has a mixed opinion of the student body; she says they are all very intelligent, but also very competitive (and grade-grubbing); she says that low-income students are very well supported financially, but not socially (though the President is trying to make changes), and she avoids Prospect Street where the eating houses are entirely from Thursday through Sunday (last month they had 14 hospital transports for alcohol on a single night.)</p>
<p>I’ve never asked her directly, but I think she’d likely say that you’d get a better education at Smith.</p>
<p>P.S. I should have added that not a single Ivy League (or Williams, Amherst, or Swarthmore) student was admitted to her program the year she applied (nor, I believe, this year), and of the 14 faculty, only one has an undergraduate Ivy degree (Harvard).</p>
<p>Wow…I’d be interested to see grad-school placement statistics for all three schools. Perhaps I’ll go snoop around their websites! And that is a lot of alcohol casualties >:(. Why do people not learn moderation?</p>
<p>After some intense pro/con lists, I have the answer: Smith wins!! When you get right down to it, Smith has more of what I want than the other two, and any reasons that I might have against it are fairly childish. (Basically just name recognition and “where will I meet guys?”.) Now I just have to see if the financial aid package is doable… It should be here in a few days. I am so excited!!</p>
<p>I’m glad that Smith wins, since I’m coming to the conversation late.</p>
<p>I’m a Dartmouth grad, married to a Dartmouth grad/Princeton PhD, with a daughter going to Smith, so I’m pretty familiar with all of them. My daughter applied to Princeton and Dartmouth (didn’t get in), and I can say three years later that it was the BEST thing to happen to her. Smith has given her an academic confidence that I don’t think she would have gained at the other two. This summer, she will be attending Princeton’s summer research program, working with Princeton professors and graduate students, so it’s not like Smith held her back. :)</p>
<p>I think you made the right decision (though I am a little biased!) I think where Ivies really shine, especially for the humanities, is in their graduate programs, and doing really well at a school like Smith will definitely give you a leg up into those awesome programs when it’s time for that.</p>
<p>Yes, ultimately I felt that the caliber of the undergrad program at Smith (especially in terms of class size and general opportunities) is actually better than those at the other two schools. At least, in terms of what I’m looking for, the fit is pretty much perfect. And I am very pleased to inform you all that my financial aid package is phenomenal–my dad was jumping up and down from the excitement that “we can afford this!” I have also been very impressed with the amount of communication that I have had from Smith: several emails and an hour-long phone call with the area alumnae coordinator, another 20-30 minutes on the phone with a current STRIDE scholar… I like being treated like a human being (and a valued one, at that).</p>
<p>A quick update: I was waitlisted at Princeton, and the Dartmouth aid package was not as good as Smith’s (further reinforcement!). However, I was admitted to Amherst with an even better aid package than Smith, so I’m now planning to visit both in a couple of weeks to be sure that I’m making the right decision. At least I know that, whichever I choose, I’ll have access to classes and such at the other… I’m still leaning toward Smith, but I think that an overnight visit will help me to be sure.</p>
<p>If, after your visit, you are still leaning toward Smith, share your Amherst FA aid with the Smith FA office. You might be able to get a little more.</p>
</p>
I am waiting anxiously for financial aid packages, and if there is a clear difference of say, an extra $10,000+ dollars in debt at the end, then my decision may well be made for me.</p>
And that is a lot of alcohol casualties >:(. Why do people not learn moderation?</p>