<p>I read this thread 3 times before I could really digest it. I am so surprised. I had never considered the "political" ramifications of any college. I guess I was just so focused on finding a good performing arts experience that I must have missed the rest. I would like to think that at every higher institution of learning in this country there is room for many schools of thought. My observation has been that the sensitvity to this issue is held more among those of us that lived the 60's and 70's than those that will be attending these schools in the coming years. I would never advise my children to attend or not attend a certain university because of the political environment. This is a choice they will make implicitly by how comfortable that they feel there. This issue could go into so many areas of diversity..... We are so thankful for any and every opportunity afforded to us it is hard for us to relate to making these kinds of choices. Better a foreigner in a foreign land than an island unto one's self........</p>
<p>I would always hope that any college students would strive to enter an academic arena which is rich with diversity and challenge to ones sense of the world. The fact is that not all schools are like that.</p>
<p>you've got to be kidding. this is texas, not some scene from "Deliverance." i'm sure you can hear those statements or views occasionally in texas, just as you could hear them anywhere. but, give me a break, these kind of comments are not prevalent and it's not right to make people on this forum think it is. and i am a mom who does believe in staying home and raising your own children. so, it's not that i have this big liberal view.......i'm extremely conservative. but, i know that is not the prevailing attitude at smu and if you disagreed with someone, desecration and theft would not be the expected result. those things certainly could happen here, just as they could happen anywhere. i agree that not everyone will be happy everywhere and you do need to investigate the total environment of a school. but, no one needs to post on here about "talk they've heard from kids" that may or may not be accurate and create such a negative impression of such a fine university. and again, i have no affiliation with smu, i just find these statements ridiculous. if anyone here is going to post anything regarding the political environment or anything else about a particular university, it needs to be totally accurate and not impressions or hearsay. my d is as conservative as they come and she knows that the mt world is generally quite liberal, but she is quite able to get her training and still maintain her morals and beliefs by just making her own choices. she has created her own comfort level and found friends of similar mindsets. i agree with much of what you said, some kids aren't going to be happy in certain environments. that's what school visits are for. but you can't come on this forum and just create an image for a particular school.</p>
<p>It seems we've been down this road before.....I'm going to say this once and then withdraw from the field of battle.....</p>
<p>Razorback, </p>
<p>With regard to your posts on this thread and some others on the thread about Rent:</p>
<p>You can't expect that the same freedom that allows you to come on this website and post your opinions about anything that you feel strongly about does not extend to others. You have every right to disagree with the opinions of others, to question their sources, to present evidence that supports your views and contradicts others. You do not have the right to tell them they don't have the right to POST THEIR opinions. No one is forcing you to read them.</p>
<p>Within the guidelines established by this website and this forum, we are all still guaranteed our First Amendment rights. We don't always share the same views but we need to respect the RIGHT to share them.</p>
<p>That's all folks.</p>
<p>Razorback, in all due respect, I do agree with Theatermom and this was an issue in the past on this forum when you posted under a different name. Just as you are posting your views, which I respect even if I don't feel the same, others also want to post their views, which may differ. One set of views is not more right than the other. Everyone is sharing their own impressions or viewpoints and trying to back them up without attacking the other poster's points of view. So, if you are a conservative, for example, I am not going to come on here attacking your point of view and saying mine is better or right. I'm going to share my point of view, simply put. I will welcome you to share your values and perspectives and will attempt to understand where you are coming from and respect that we differ. Just as you want to post, so do others, even though their opinions may be offensive to you, but they are not attacking you whatsoever. They are just posting opinions NOT aimed at any other posters. Attacking posts are ones that are attacking the person who wrote the posts, not the actual views in the posts. The views are allowed. Attacking others is not. We can't be responsible, however, if you infer being "attacked" or "belittled" as you put on the RENT thread, by others who post points of views. They do not INTEND to attack. They intend to share their opinions.</p>
<p>Just for the record, I was not familiar with SMU as kids in my region do not apply there so upon reading this thread, I read THREE different college directories' entries on SMU. It sounds like a terrific school with a highly regarded drama program. The narratives about the climate on campus and the student body were quite illustrative and all three directories said the same thing and I won't take the time to type them all out. I read : the Fiske Guide to Colleges, Princeton Review's Best 345 Colleges and The Insider's Guide To Colleges published by the Yale Daily News. All three gave a certain image of the typical kids at this college and the prevailing climate on campus. They do this for every school. For students who care about fitting in on campus and the types of kids who may be in the student body, this information is important so they can judge for themselves about fit. They should also make a visit. Some might not opt to visit, if upon reading three different source books that describe a certain prevalence on campus, if it does not feel as though it is the right comfort level for the kid. </p>
<p>You described your daughter a bit and let's say she asked here about Hampshire College.....or read descriptions in a directory.....I venture to say that that particular school is not one she'd want on her radar even though it is a fine place. If she is comfortable being very different than the majority of kids on campus, then it is a nonissue. What some of us were saying was that SOME kids care about the atmosphere, climate, campus culture, environment, political leanings of the student body. I am not saying they should care or HAVE to have the same views (it is OK to have dissenting opinions, makes college discussions interesting!), but for those who care about this sort of thing (and I even think YOU care about such things), then it is important to ascertain the climate on campuses one is considering. The descriptions of SMU in guidebooks seems to validate what I am reading here. Great school. Not for ALL people. </p>
<p>Susan</p>
<p>I'm sorry. I didn't mean to start anything. There's no "here we go again." I thought it would obvious to all adults on here and everyone would agree that statements that strong regarding an isolated incident would be out of line. Of course, we all have the right to speak and express our views. I just think we need to be careful when implying a certain image about a school. It's perfectly fine to say they are conservative and that perhaps certain views are strong there. I just thought that some heresay from a couple of kids stating some pretty nasty stuff about a school would be something no one would want. And, I would like to politely request for everyone on here to respect the anonymity rule. References to identity are out of line.</p>
<p>Razorback, I'll reply to your post but would rather move forward. Theater mom was saying we have been down this road here before and we have, for anyone who has been posting here for a couple years. The issue you have brought up is the same as before. By the way I did not reveal your identity/name. Actually posting under two different names is not normally allowed on this forum so let's leave it at that. </p>
<p>I think we ARE trying to respect one another. When someone posts their point of view (which IS allowed), that is not an attack of others. If you infer that to be an attack or take it personally, then that is an issue for you. But points of view are allowed. They have been proferred respectfully. They are allowed to differ. What is not allowed are attacks of the actual POSTER. Questions of their views ARE allowed. I don't see anyone attacking or disrespecting other POSTERS. They are expressing opposing viewpoints, that's all. PLease don't imply that people are not being respectful. They are. If you take their views as offense, that is your choice. They are allowed to post their views. What they are NOT allowed to do is to attack another poster. </p>
<p>This was an issue last spring when posters gave opinions about audition material and other things and so I hope we do not return to this once again. Differing points of view should not be taken as offensive. I'm sorry if they are but that was not the intent of the posters, in my observations. I think all have been quite respectful.
Susan</p>
<p>Please note: my post here was a response to the prior post and while I was posting the prior poster edited and changed the post that I was responding to so my post may not make sense as a response any longer.</p>
<p>I'm sorry for any offense and just want to move forward.</p>
<p>ok, now I understand. I've gone back and read this thread several times and the post that I was responding to in my post #23, is gone. It's also the post I was referring to in post #26. You can read in my posts that I was referring to specific statements in a prior post. I can't imagine what happened to it, but someone had posted regarding some statements that they had heard from some kids about SMU, saying, that they guys their talk about not allowing their wives to work and that someone who made a liberal comment about something, then had some of their property desecrated and stolen. That is what my post was in response to. And I think, had any of you read that, you would agree that extreme language and hearsay shouldn't be used on this board to damage a school's rep. So, I believe this entire negative discussion has been a simple misunderstanding. I was having a very hard time understanding how any of you would condone those statements.</p>
<p>Once again Susan has done the leg work and provided an indept and detailed report of valuable information on this interesting topic..
Susan, I thank you AGAIN. I am envious that you seem to have more time that I wish I had!!</p>
<p>As far as SMU, since I have lived in Dallas most of my life and am considered a "bleeding liberal" I will say that ABSOLUTELY Dallas and the SMU campus is conservative and I have made a choice to stay here and learn to live with that over the years. </p>
<p>However, all the many I know personally who have attended Meadows for acting, dance, music or fine arts (not the regular Liberal Arts/Business students) are very politically liberal in their views and have loved their experience and value their education at Meadows. They would not have considered SMU had it not been for Meadows. Meadows is a world unto itself where artisitic freedoms may be expressed openly and ideas outside the norm are encouraged and supported.
Why else has it continue to be one of the top acting schools for these many years? It has maintained its artistic integrity and not compromised due to the conservative climate that exists in Dallas. </p>
<p>You can look at their current season in all disciplines and see that the conservative potitics of the general campus have not effected their choices. How else could you explain a production of Naomi Wallace's Slaughter City!!!! </p>
<p>I hope students will read this and realize that the political element of a campus is a tangable factor to be considered along with all the other important factors.</p>
<p>Susan, I have prospective students who are seriously considering OCU with the same concerns. Could you, if time permits, please report what you can find out about the political climate on the OCU campus on the OCU thread as you have here. I would be most appreciative and so would my students/parents.</p>
<p>Thanks,
xxx,Mary Anna</p>
<p>P.S. I am still "proud as a parent" for my student's acceptance into SMU's BFA program. Quite an achievement. And if she decides that SMU as the best match for her, I will back her 100%. (she is not a political conservative, btw)</p>
<p>Razorback, I would agree to caution against putting too much stock in one person's vignette or hearsay about a college. It is important to visit and to also glean personal accounts and perspective from a variety of those who attend. </p>
<p>As mentioned, I am unfamiliar with SMU. Mary Anna, actually I am not familiar at all with the type of kids attracted to OCU as a university or the political climate there either. I did not take the time to quote the descriptions of the student body and culture at SMU but gave three directories in which I read similar descriptions. Usually OCU is not in those big fat college directories that I have so I can't look it up for you. There are sites online that have student reviews of colleges and that is another way to get a "take" on a college atmosphere. You just can't put too much stock in any one person's opinion. But if you have three guidebooks and four students telling you the same thing, then there might be some validity in that overview of the types of kids attracted to a college and the prevailing climate on campus.</p>
<p>Mary Anna, I don't really have the time to post as much as I do as I am currently in an intense period of time with the students and parents that I counsel as a college counselor. My work with them is online long distance. Occasionally I take a break, likely too often, and read things online such as this board. This board is not only of interest to me personally given that I have a child pursuing a life in musical theater but it is of interest to me professionally as I counsel students in the college selection and admissions process, including for theater programs. I'm a college counselor at College Confidentail so it makes sense for me to keep up here too for my own learning. I try to give when I can.</p>
<p>You have a right to be proud of your student for getting into SMU for acting as it is a well thought of program. You're a teacher and a parent of students this age so I can't blame ya for that! Enjoy the moment.
Susan</p>
<p>How convenient that all the negative post about SMU have been deleted? I noticed that they have been deleted also? Did anyone else notice that too?</p>
<p>No, I did not notice it. The posts I see now are the only ones I had ever read in the first place. A post cannot be deleted unless the moderator deletes it. A moderator would not opt to delete a post if it merely described the political climate on a campus as read in the guidebooks which I recall being quoted here by someone. A moderator would only a delete post that broke the terms of service. Opinions about a school is not against the rules. Attacking posters is against the rules.</p>
<p>Anything I read here about this school, I have read in the guidebooks. I don't even know this school but am free to read about it. If I were to post what I read in the college directories, would that be considered offensive? I did not bother to repeat or type out what those entries are but read them for yourself, as someone should do for any school....consult many sources.</p>
<p>I found the post I was speaking of, my mistake! It was post #16.</p>
<p>For the record, NO posts were deleted today on this thread or on the entire MT Forum. I would not have deleted posts that gave opinions about a school or quoted other posts about the school, or published reviews such as from Princeton Review. </p>
<p>To those who were "offended": We welcome all opinions here. The opinions were not offensive attacks. If you are offended by other opinions, that is a choice you make. In this thread, nobody dimished "conservatives" but only informed others of the perceived conservative climate on this college campus, which you can readily find in various other college source books. Others are free to disagree and back up their opinions. I witnessed no attacking or offensive posts in themselves. I am observing some posters who are taking such opinions of others as offensive and suggesting that others are offending or belittling when I do not see anyone's intentions to do so. Others merely have given their views that happen to differ from other readers' views. That is respectful and allowed. </p>
<p>We did have this problem on here in the past and don't wish to return to it. Several in this discussion here are aware of that.</p>
<p>No posts have been deleted. However, Razorback did edit and rewrite one of her posts during the edit time that CC allows you to go in and change your post. That is fine. Please don't then say other posts were deleted as they were not. Changes were made to your post today by you but no changes were made by the moderators on this thread.</p>
<p>We value each and every poster on here. Please continue to share your opinions even when they differ. If you have heard about a school, offer up what you have heard with some evidence. Others can take or leave those perspectives and realize they are just an internet poster and must garner many opinions when looking into a college. The information presented here on this thread is actually in line with a lot of published reviews of this school. It sounds like a terrific school but like with any school, as Lorelei implied, one must investigate if they feel they will fit in. Some don't mind being very different than the majority and some do. For those who do, it makes sense to read all you can about a school and visit of course. </p>
<p>Let's carry on. Nothing was deleted on my end and the posts today were not written to offend. If you are personally offended by opposing viewpoints, you may want to skip posts by certain posters. But they are free to post their views as you are posting yours.</p>
<p>Thanks everyone.
CollegeMom</p>
<p>Kelster,
I would worry too much about auditioning for SMU and Evansville after the first of the year. They will still have places for qualified candidates. </p>
<p>I have had students get in to both those schools who auditoned in Jan/Feb. </p>
<p>Keep the faith!</p>
<p>xxx,Mary Anna</p>
<p>Cool. Do they "type" their classes? Evansville apparently does. It's not like I don't already have enough stacked against me without having to worry about whether or not they have already accepted somebody with a similar look.</p>
<p>i'm not crazy. if you read my post #23, you can see that I was addressing a specific statement. that statement no longer exists on this thread. i have no idea what happened to it, but it's not there. I was not offended or belittled or anything else. I just felt a need to state that no one should post what was posted regarding SMU students, nothing to do with conservative or liberal. Just a statement that I thought out of line which was denegrating the student body of SMU. I have not accused anyone of deleting anything. I just know that this statement was here and now it's not. None of it has anything to do with me personally. I certainly did edit one of my posts and so did some others who weren't pointed out. No one on here would have wanted a statement so inflamatory put on here about any school.</p>
<p>Kelster,
All schools cast their class. Sorry. </p>
<p>There is a place for you out there. Not to worry.</p>
<p>xxx,Mary Anna</p>
<p>Allright - I'll jump in (against my better judgement). After all, as a Texan and SMU graduate (go Ponies!!), I feel the need to express my "opinion," which CollegeMom says is "welcome."</p>
<p>As far as Texas being "hardcore", I think the "hardcore" reference to the recent election should be made to the rest of the states that have passed similar amendments. I think you will find the majority of the United States has voted just like Texas. As far as SMU having a "drunk, frat boy image," I researched some of the same sites that soozievt did, and I didn't see those comments. Where did you get that Kellster?? Sure, SMU has a very active greek system. But I have unfortunately heard the "drunk" part of your description applied to many, many schools. I dunno, I just took that whole post to be "negative", and in my "OPINION", without any basis or justification.</p>
<p>Would liberal minded or "gay prospies" be unhappy at SMU? I agree with Mary Anna - don't prejudge. I personally know liberal and very open people who not only attended SMU, but were leaders on the campus. Sorry lorelei2702, but SMU is not "a different world."</p>
<p>In my OPINION, SMU is a great school, has a beautiful campus and is as welcoming as any place I have ever been. Poor or rich, black or white, gay or straight - I think that everyone gets along well. In my OPINION, Texas is not "hardcore," it is mainstream America, and by golly, we love it here. We welcome each of you who wants to come here with open arms. But, don't go trash-talking us (only my opinion), or we'll open up a can of whoop-a** on you! (just kidding).</p>