<p>A high enough percentage.</p>
<p>You get real holymomma.</p>
<p>It depends upon what the student's goals are. I think one of the big advantages many of the elite privates offer are the similarly high intellectual quality of the peer group one meets there. A synergy effect results and all of the students are better off. This is not replicated to the same degree at big state schools.. Sure there are a hand full of brillant students at state u -- but its not the same as being completely surrounded by brillant students. I think that is one of the biggest things you pay for when you choose a private.</p>
<p>
[quote]
What society does to teenagers in this country is awful.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>So how many well informed United States teenagers are emigrating to other countries to spend their teenage years?</p>
<p>Tokenadult brings up an important point. I have seen many private colleges offer better aid packages including grants, scholarships and loans for students. It has been cheaper for these students to take the private school, especially knowing it is often easier to graduate on the four year model. </p>
<p>With increased enrollment at publics, classes are harder to get, and it has become increasingly common for students to be on the 5 (or even 6) year plan. At that point, the public may be the more expensive buy, depending on what public college system. Some publics are much cheaper than others.</p>
<p>This is a really good point. My neighbor told me that "everyone" takes 5-6 years at our state schools - she says it has to do with changing majors, not getting classes when needed, etc. The schools she refered to are about $14-16k/year all-in, and there really are few options for aid for middle class families other than loans. In contrast, my D attends a very expensive private with wonderful financial aid. We would get unsub loans only at the state schools. It would cost us more in the long run at the state schools.</p>
<p>Our state publics range from about $18,000 with room and board to $26,000 with room and board.</p>
<p>kelsmom:
[quote]
My neighbor told me that "everyone" takes 5-6 years at our state schools...
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Yes, 4 years to study, 1 year to crash classes, and 1 year to find parking spaces.</p>
<p>Depends on the state schools. They are more unforgiving about kids registering late, changing majors and more inflexible as a rule. Have to be as they are larger. But there are any number of smaller state schools where those problems do not arise, and you can end up in the same bind at the larger privates. I know two kids, bright, on target, great grades, who needed an extra year to graduate from private colleges because they changed majors. Many of the kids I know who took extra time at state colleges had other reasons for taking longer to graduate. Many were careless about enrolling for classes, failed courses, took too many low level courses, were not focused on finding a major, never got the enrollment process and deadlines straight.</p>
<p>Organization is critical, no matter what school you attend! Pay attention to the GE list, if you change majors consult an academic counselor who can often find the right set of courses that will minimize delays. Register early.</p>
<p>kelsmom: Quote:
My neighbor told me that "everyone" takes 5-6 years at our state schools... </p>
<p>Cool: Yes, 4 years to study, 1 year to crash classes, and 1 year to find parking spaces.</p>
<p>LOL... I don't know about your state's schools, but if ..
you don't take a full 15-17 credit hours each semester (or the qtr alternative),
you don't carefully pick your courses so that you stay on track
you don't have any AP Credits,
you don't take a summer class that you need to stay on track (if you've gotten behind)
you change majors,
you have to take any remedial math and/or english classes
you "party" a lot and end up falling behind and dropping classes</p>
<p>then you could take more than 4 years no matter where you go...</p>
<p>If your school's catalog or website has "suggested" courses to take in a particular order for each major... pay attention to that! That will take into consideration pre-reqs and courses that are only offered in Fall or Spring.</p>
<p>Pay close attention to Gen Ed (aka Core requirements) AND visit your major's advisor frequently to check on your progress.</p>
<p>Some schools now have an online software that keeps track of what you've taken and what you still need to take for your major. If your school has such, use it. It will even "transition" for you if you change major.</p>
<p>When I was still in the public UC I saw a lot of people started with 5 classes (20 units) at the beginning of the quater, dropped 1 class after 2 weeks, then dropped another class after 4 weeks. If the dropped class was part of a 3-course sequence or was prerequisite for other classes then it was hard to graduate in 4 years. It's not because they did not work hard. The system did not have much support for students to graduate in time. I heard that business major students at SDSU could not graduate in 4 years because they could not register for the desired classes. Some classes had priority for senior students.</p>
<p>
[quote]
It's not because they did not work hard. The system did not have much support for students to graduate in time.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>That is something to look at when shopping for colleges. If a particular college has a lower list price, but many students take more than four years to graduate from that college, it may be false economy to enroll there--both because of paying for an extra semester or extra year of tuition and fees compared to a four-year school and because of later entry into the full-time labor force.</p>
<p>The flip side of the coin is that the UCs are quite generous with AP credits. Most full year high school AP courses are given two full quarter class credit at UCs. Students with 7-8 AP classes from a CA high school are given te equivalent of 1.2 to 1.5 years of college credit before they step on campus.</p>
<p>The AP boost to the finish line would be reflected in the overall numbers.</p>
<p>
[quote]
If a particular college has a lower list price, but many students take more than four years to graduate from that college, it may be false economy to enroll there-
[/quote]
but taking longer than 4 years is often the doing of the student, not a diabolical plot on the part of the college. At some colleges, students frequently skip semesters to work, to loaf, to do many things.</p>
<p>It is unfortunate, but some stats do not give you much information, usually because the stat is influenced by things that may or may not be in control of the college. </p>
<p>Keep in mind too that lower cost colleges often attract students less well prepared for college, and often less financially able to attend (my supposition here - I have not researched this aspect), so it would be no surprise that their completion rate and time is lower, due to no fault of the college.</p>
<p>Don't forget to consider the honors colleges offered at many public universities. Most offer at least partial scholarships. And priority registration - making it much easier to get the classes you need and graduate in four years. If you have the stats, it's a good option to consider.
The question of state vs private is really a function of where you're coming from financially. If you don't qualify for fin aid - public universities can be a bargain - even high priced ones.</p>
<p>I totally agree. With the economy as is I feel like private schools will eventually have to come down in price to compete with these cheaper public schools.</p>
<p>toneranger,</p>
<p>Good point. Honors colleges can be a real leveling factor, especially when they offer priority registration and better advising. </p>
<p>There are some pretty good financial deals out there for kids with high SAT scores and good grades at a number of public universities. There's a sticky thread on this topic that is rather hard to wade through. Better, IMHO, is that if your kid has great stats (and this is strictly stat driven, usually by SAT score), then check out the financial aid section of a state university you are interested in. (maybe also the honors college section of the website). Often, you find automatic waivers of OUS tuition if scores are high enough, for example.</p>
<p>newsdad - just a note that, yes, the vast majority of honors college admissions are based on stats - but some are not. The Schreyer Honors college at PSU says that they do not consider SAT scores. They do a holistic evaluation process, supported by essays and teacher recommendations. The average SAT scores of the students are very high...but they insist the scores are not considered. There's a poster on the PSU boards with a VERY impressive background but relatively low SAT scores who got in. That said...it's generally very tough to make the cut...
So..it really pays to research each school to find out what they want. There are excellent deals out there for good students.</p>