(Sorry wrong thread)
I agree that it isn’t necessarily a good idea to go to a “prestigious school” just for the doors it opens. On the other hand, if you can afford it, it may be worth attending a costly school because of the quality of education you will receive. This is subjective, but IMO surrounding yourself with bright and motivated students, terrific opportunities, and top professors in a collegial setting has educational value beyond the doors it opens.
You are lucky to have exposure to kids who have chosen that path, and I wouldn’t underestimate what you can learn from this. If these aren’t the types of kids with whom you would be comfortable, then perhaps the school is not for you.
As for parents of kids who are happy at Alabama (or any school), I would take this sort of second hand testimony with a grain of salt. Some parents, especially parents on CC, have a seemingly unquenchable need to hype their childs’ school and will push everyone they can to make the same decisions. In my opinion, not every school is for every student, and while Alabama (or any school) may be great for some, it is not a great fit for others.
If you truly love skiing and dislike exceedingly hot weather, and if you decide that prestige isn’t important, then maybe forget about the deep South and check out schools that fit your criteria. Utah, Colorado, Montana State and Montana, Idaho and Idaho State, Gonzaga, New Hampshire, Vermont, etc. A degree from any of those places would likely be as valuable as a degree from Alabama.
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It is not 300k. It is 400k, for private undergrad.
Well…maybe they are thinking about colleges today that cost $80,000 a year…so $320,000. But yes…prices are going to continue to rise at many places.
And yes, I know there are colleges already that are well over $80,000 a year now.
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I got to post 45 then stopped reading… Some of our experiences…
- We are a full pay family. In the end my son chose BAMA. The money in the 529 will be his. He’d very grateful for that and so are we!
- He had 5 things in a school that he wanted. UA had none of those. He visited and still chose UA. He really enjoys it and has found work around for all 5 of those things. You may love skiing, but there may need to be more to consider.
- One thing he wanted was a small school. After visiting UA he saw that a small school: 1) Has a limited class selection re: times and number of electives. 2) doesn’t have the variety of clubs and activities that he has really enjoyed being invovled in
- He’s surrounded by other smart kids - becuase that’s who he chooses as friends and the activities he’s invovled in
- IF you haven’t already watched it, check out Malcom Gladwell’s Why you Shouldn’t go to Harvard. This was SUPER eye opening for us - and isn’t just about Harvard.
- Also, as someone mentioned UA scholarship, in the past, has covered 10 semesters and includes UA law school. So if you come in with credits or use CLEP and graduate undergrad in 6 semesters, thats 4 semesters of law school avail to you…
Best of luck!
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Nearly all law schools offer merit, and some offer considerable merit. If the poster is able to do well in college and get a similarly high score on the LSAT, they could have very attractive choices for merit in law school.
The undergrad opportunities are a certainty and the law school situation is hypothetical, but I don’t want the poster to be misinformed about the merit landscape for law school.
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My kid’s at Bama (not NMF) but I’m not here to hype it or extol its virtues or disadvantages. It’s a huge state flagship and, like all schools, honestly, you get out of it what you put in. (The football is pretty sweet, though!)
OP, you sound like you’ll be fine no matter where you end up.
I wanted to talk about law school, which sounds like a “definite maybe” path you were exploring - certainly not as definitive as my son is. (He will 90% certainly not go to Bama for law school, though.)
To a great extent, it depends on what kind of law you envision yourself practicing as to what law school you aim for. If you want BigLaw – white-shoe corporate practices, massive salaries, niche specialities like patent law concerning the fuses on the 2020 Tesla – then you def. want to aim for the T14 law schools. That’s where the trajectory is rock-solid for those goals. (Also the Supreme Court, haha.)
And that’s where going to a prestigious undergraduate school might be worth considering: because there might be a proven track record from previous graduates of that school that gets you a second look & serious consideration from the T14s.
My kid wants to save the world and doesn’t even particularly want to earn money (we are fine with this). He understands money is useful, but that’s about it.
He wants to come back to PA, where we live, and work to change things about his area, change some state laws, work on social justice and gerrymandering and crappy restrictions on voting, things like that. For him, a T14 school doesn’t make a ton of sense. I mean, it’s great if he is a superstar and gets in, but he can do his work at a “lesser” law school, one in PA, with better connections for his goals, and I’m not sure there’d be any advantage to the prestige path.
So that kind of thing should also be in your set of considerations. It doesn’t have to be now, not when determining undergrad, but it can come into play down the line.
Good luck. You will do great…
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As @CCName1 and @Gatormama mentioned if your known goal is law school there are a few things to consider.
First a prestigious undergrad school with a cost of 300K or 360K will not be as important as a great GPA and LSAT score. Also if your goal is not working in a “big law” firm as @Gatormama indicated her son doesn’t want. The consideration will be different.
Being a social warrior, a prosecutor or a public defender brings a lot of different consideration of the right law school. Similarly wanting to work in a particular state or city also creates different law school choices
As @CCName1 stated there is a lot of law school merit money at all levels of law schools. The reality is that all law schools are looking to improve their USNews and World Report rankings. And those rankings are mostly based on 2 things. LSAT scores and GPA. All schools are looking for students who help them increase the medium scores in those statistics because that helps them improve in their rankings.
So generally if you have over the 75% for the laws schools GPA and LSAT that school is likely to offer you merit money.
By way of example me D had a 4.0 from Clemson and a 168 LSAT. She applied to a bunch of school. Got full tuitions scholarships to Minnesota, Arizona State, University of Florida. Got lesser merit at UGA, Villanova, and Richmond.
She got waitlisted at Umich, UT Austin, UVA Vandy and GW. I would note she applied late to all schools. My sense of things is that the earlier you apply the better for admission and better for merit.
My guess is that she also would have ultimately been admitted to one of waitlist schools has she been been admitted but probably no merit money at those schools.
I know lots of law students in Pittsburgh where I practice where lots of students who are happy to practice here that have lesser stats but over the 75%tile for those schools will get lots of merit money.
So there will be lots of options. But study hard make great grades, get a great LSAT and you should be fine.
The other advise I would give, which is the same I told my daughter when she told me for the first time after her Sophomore year in college that she wanted to go to law school. Only go to law school if you want to be a lawyer. Law school is too expensive and difficult to go as a place holder or something to do because a college graduate doesn’t know what else to do after graduation.
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I argued this up too but was told it’s not necessarily correct. Or at least that was the counter argument.
I know a Rutgers student at U Miami Law on a full tuition scholarship. Turned down Vandy.
Wise move - I don’t know - nor do I know the long range goals.
22 posts were split to a new thread: Law School from Big Merit Schools for Undergrad
But back to OP - can a 3.9 and 170 at Tulsa or UTD or Maine or Bama get the same offer as the 3.9 from schools he mentioned upthread - Dartmouth, BC, Williams.
I’d argue in many cases yes and maybe in some a better chance due to school diversity. Of course other factors such as work after undergrad and recommendations also factor in.
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Please move on from the nitty gritty of law school. We’re straying from the OP.
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Edit: deleted per instructions.
@momofboiler1 Would it be possible to move the law school discussion to a separate, standalone thread? I agree that it is tangential to the OP’s question, but it is interesting on its own and I would love to see an ongoing conversation on the topic. Thanks!
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You and @NiceUnparticularMan have brought up a larger point I think often gets missed - universal to any school, profession or aspiration.
What someone thinks is the best school, or what someone thinks it takes to be successful in a career or what someone believes to be the best way to reach their goal…is often a mix of assumptions, hopes and magical thinking.
Very few of us are clear sighted about what our dreams and goals actually require. Or whether we actually have (or could/would want to obtain) the skills necessary.
There is a reason so few pre-med and pre-law students get accepted to, let alone graduate from law or medical school. There is a reason so few lawyers make partner, let alone capital partner.
I think people trying to persuade high school students that there are other options outside the Top 10, Top 50, Top 100 schools are often trying to convey is that there are more options to success and there are more ways to measure success than most people, let alone most 17 years, can imagine.
And at the same time, no matter what route you decide to take - the work continues. There is no point at which you ‘make it’ (e.g. - into Harvard, into Yale Law, into Big Law) where you can rest on the laurels of being deemed ‘the best’.
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Dare we call this the Human Condition? No matter how we try to handicap success (in any field), the universe has other ideas?
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As John Lennon explained (although probably not first), life is what happens to us while we are making other plans.
Which doesn’t mean we should never make plans, but . . . just be ready.
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It’s a bit early to worry about it. My daughter is a senior applying to college now. I can tell you from experience, there’s going to be a world of difference between now and when you actually start applying. It’s nice your parents saved for college. We never had that opportunity.
My advice, go for scholarships and save as much of that money as you can, just in case you decide to go to graduate school. Money is always a finite resource, and being debt free is a huge plus.
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I’m a big fan of schools that provide merit discounts, especially for those of us donut-hole families. I think the schools that provide for merit discounts seem to have a more economically diverse student body. Not all >1% and 100% financial aid recipients, lots in the middle. It’s also nice for the kids to get rewarded for their hard work/effort.
I highly recommend the book The Price You Pay for College: Understanding Merit Aid by Ron Lieber (NYTimes columnist). The Price You Pay For College - Ron Lieber Ron Lieber
He also recently launched a course called Merit Aid: What it is and How to Get It. I signed up and took it as a refresher as it’s been a few years since my '21 went through the process. I learned even more the second time around. https://meritaidcourse.com/
I have no connection with him or his website, just a big fan of pulling back the curtain on all of this and being fully informed consumers, as college is a product that the schools are selling at exorbitant prices, and everyone loves a discount, right?
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