Ugh. Our family thought we had it figured out. Our son was offered the Stamps scholarship at Wake Forest. Even with offers from Duke and Vandy, it looked like Wake and the scholarship would be the choice. But then came the Stanford acceptance. That has presented a huge decision. I’d love some feedback from this (presumably biased) Stanford forum.
Background:
We are full pay (household income $300K+)
Our son is our oldest child with younger daughter 5 years back
Unknown major yet
We have almost $200K saved for his college (plus $50K for younger daughter)
Stamps Scholarship: Full Tuition, room/board, $750/mo stipend, $15K research/travel grant to use over 3 summers
On one hand, the Stamps scholarship would allow us to fund grad school for our son and divert significant savings to our daughter. Wake is a great school with solid opportunities.
On the other hand, Stanford is Stanford. I feel like the opportunities presented by Stanford are unparalleled.
This is a classic money vs prestige scenario that is a great problem to have - I realize that. I’d just appreciate any thoughts from this forum. Thanks in advance.
Wow - congrats on all these wonderful acceptances. What an accomplishment! I frequently tell (when asked) my friends that competitive merit aid at highly selective, need blind schools is really designed to pick off the ones that would otherwise go to Harvard or Stanford. Your son is one of “the ones” and that is an amazingly small crowd. It’s Wake’s version of the Jefferson Scholars program at UVA or Cornelius at Vandy, etc.
S attends Wake (sophomore). I can tell you it’s an amazing place and provides a top notch education. It’s no wonder it’s been rated among the top schools for undergraduate teaching for many years (like in the top 10). Small discussion based classes taught by leading profs is the norm. Great well rounded liberal arts core and excellent majors / outcomes in business, compsci, pre med, pre law, etc. You can get anywhere from Wake Forest!
But…“Stanford is Stanford”. For example, if your son wanted to pursue the incredibly competitive world of management consulting out of UG, MBB lives at Stanford. That’s just one, but a good, example. I imagine the opportunities in Silicon Valley are incredible!!! That makes a difference. Think about your financial resources. Would it make a major difference in your life if you were to pay for Stanford? Can you pay for it out of cash flow? Do you have a ton of home equity AND you were considering downsizing anyway?
I ask these questions out of experience. Although our choices were different than yours, we were in a similar position. Essentially free state flagship at a popular prestigious school or full pay at Wake (what we narrowed our choices to). I have been saving for college for a LONG time and earn a good living. We have also been saving for retirement for a long time. My basic MO is, other than in case of emergency, our retirement savings will never be touched for anything other than our retirement. So using it for school was/is not an option. However, between earmarked college savings and cash flow, we could/can afford full pay. Do I like it? No. Would I prefer to not pay it? Yes. But…that’s why we saved…for that exact purpose - to be able to provide a profound opportunity for my son (and his sister in a yr). We’re not going in to debt, just using existing resources. Based on my conservative calculations, we’ll have plenty for retirement, so not spending the money would mean simply having more (which might be nice - pay for additional trips / memories) but we decided it’s also fun to use it for Wake and X and see those memories happen in real time. Of course, it was a personal decision. I would not have chosen it if it required substantial debt on anyone’s part. S is taking the unsubsidized Stafford loans as we required him to have some skin in the game but that will easily be paid back and quickly once he starts his career.
I hope this helps provide clarity in your thinking. Best of luck, and congratulations. You must be proud!
From a purely ROI perspective, it’s hard to justify Stanford. $300K grows to $2.1M in 40 years even at a pretty conservative 5% real return rate.
And Stamps would offer a lot of opportunities and open a lot of doors as well.
What opportunities would he get at Stanford that he wouldn’t get with Wake with Stamps?
Even if you spend the money, it’s the difference between Stanford or Wake + a free (elite, assuming he gets in) MBA or other master’s + funded travels all over the world and still a little left over to start a nest egg.
Though I would make sure that he and the younger daughter get the same amount of money (taking in to account inflation) to spend on education or other enriching pursuits (hence why I would fund travel but not a car if he chooses Wake).
We had a young lass from our school in the exact same situation a couple of years back, though she was also considering full rides at U Miami and Vandy (3 options or Stanford - dream school). She chose WF. When I asked her brother a couple years later he said she was loving it and glad she made the decision she did - terrific opportunities and loves the place. There was also another lass applying there - not sure if she attended - due to her experience.
^ OK, I saw a response. Yes, being by Silicon Valley with a Stanford degree opens doors. On the other hand, a Stanford MBA also opens doors (to MC, etc.). Probably more than undergrad Stanford. And with the money saved, that could be fully funded without taking on debt. Yes, he would have to get in, but given his current trajectory, he has a good shot (at least at getting in to an M7 b-school, who are the top targets for MC).
^ I agree the Stamps / Wake make it a tough decision. Interestingly, the head of Wake’s Career Services came from Stanford after heading up their graduate school’s career placement center (former Stanford grad and Bain alumni). Wake is a GREAT place and provides a GREAT education and opportunities.
It’s an interesting quandary. I’m a financial advisor by trade. Over the years (30), I’ve learned that financial planning / advising is more about client issues / vision/ concerns than the actual money. The money is just a resource. I think of it like the junction between the human element and math. The math part is ridiculously easy. The human element part is very challenging (and interesting), as everyone is so unique. In this case, the ROI mentioned may have zero or 100% relevance (or any % in between). With us and for ours, it came down to “we could so we did”. Many probably think we’re crazy but we’re ecstatic with the outcomes to date.
OOh, I feel your pain. Tough call. If you have funds/savings that spending $300k (assuming you have travel expenses to address too) doesnt dent your retirement, quality of life or plans for younger dau, AND ther is a strong reason to be in SV, visit both, then decide.
We know a Stamps scholar, and wow, are they enjoying the perks – beyond the money, there are special invitations to meet with visiting speakers, on campus research opportunities etc. It really is a phenomenal opportunity. I think it goes a long way to closing the experience gap with Stanford.
If your son chooses Stanford, it will require all of his share of the college savings, plus a bit more. Will you be fully ready to pay Stanford-level costs for his sister starting just a year after he finishes college? Do the math. Be honest with yourself about those numbers.
You are incredibly fortunate to have resources that would allow you to give your son this option. It truly is OK for you to do so if he decides that he prefers Stanford. But first I’d make sure he visits both places and talks with current and recent Stamps students, as well as Stanford students and grads with his projected major.
I would go with WF, it’s just a fact that students who are accepted to schools like Stanford will do just as well if they actually attend or not. The monetary difference is just too much to ignore.
I want to say that money talks and a full ride at a Top-25 is hard to pass up. But Stanford has the reputation. Not to mention that it is relatively easy to get a good GPA.
I would go by the potential major and best fit at this point.
Congratulations - you must let him know we all send a collective “high five”! The work and dedication to achieve such results is not to be taken lightly.
So either he has unique intellectual gifts, is incredibly hard working even among hard workers or most likely both. Those qualities don’t disappear once you walk onto campus.
Therefore, I recenter the question as to who is “better off”?
The superstar Stanford grad with no money for med school, mba program or grad school.
Or the same superstar from wake forest with a boat load of money to spend on the same exact (and I mean exact) grad schools to choose from. The answer is not at all difficult.
If you will do no more than ug and want the better cache and connections of Stanford. It’s certainly a superb option.
Another consideration is the cost (if there is a cost) of grad school. I recall OP mentioning unsure of major at this point. So who knows if grad school is even in the cards. But assuming it is, let’s not discount the chance of grad school sponsoring or scholarship. Clearly he is an amazing student. Assuming his trajectory continues, he’ll still be an amazing student. Many in that category have grad school paid for by employer or via scholarship. Have a brother who got a full ride PHD from a top research university and friends who had their M7 MBA paid for by their employer. Of course, no guarantees but this kid has the chops (so far).
I’m not in any way affiliated with Stanford. But I’m biased anyway, because I’m a neighbor. You cough here and get a Stanford alum sick. ??
VC capital of the US.
My small gym has a new member, young high tech guy, grew up in Kalamazoo, Michigan and he just graduated from Stanford. The connections here in Silicon Valley run very deep. They’re everywhere. ?♂️
I don’t see anything here about what the son’s interests are. Yes, MBB ‘live’ at Stanford, and VC firms are thick on the ground there- but we don’t have any evidence that I can see that those are what interest the student.
OP, it’s not ‘just’ prestige v money. For one thing, Stamps is getting to be like Jefferson & the other big named scholarships- in the places that matter they have real prestige. For another, ‘prestige’ matters differently in different areas. Is your son thinking law or med school? there is no ‘prestige’ benefit there.
Without meaning to be rude: how fact based and relevant to your particular child is that? Nobody can take advantage of every opportunity - a buffet is only interesting to the extent that you like the foods on the table and that you are hungry for them. How much narrower will the opportunities be at WF?
Don’t underestimate the benefits of being a star, either. WF wants its Stamps scholars to become stars as they go out into the world, and work hard to help make sure that happens.
Very true. But that’s true regardless of what path you choose. Either way, you will experience stuff you would not experience otherwise and give up other experiences.
And actually, a lot can be bought with money.
IMO, so much comes down to self-confidence. Many will want the Stanford stamp of approval (though frankly, those folks who are aware would understand that the Stamps at WF is probably as or more difficult to get). Those who are confident in their abilities know that they will be successful regardless of where they go.
I’m quite certain, for instance, that on a per capita basis, UNC Robertson Scholars have as or more success later on in life than HYPS grads.