<p>I'm torn about where to go. I didn't get much in the way of fin aid from either, but I have some outside scholarships to put towards whichever one I end up going to. I like the Stanford alot, but I don't know if I want to put myself in so much debt while I'm so young. Also, I visited the campus and, while I really like it, it seems like it could be a little boring. I checked out Berks campus and found it to be really lively(even though there are alot of homeless people). I have no doubt that both schools are great for my major(english) so thats not really an issue. I've already heard that you guys are trained to hate each other, but if anyone has any advice I'd be your buddy forever. thanks.</p>
<p>go Berkeley! it has much more energy than Palo Alto.... Palo Alto is full of snobby suburbian people.... Berkeley is much more awesome!</p>
<p>noo..go Stanford!!!</p>
<p>go to the admit days for both and see where you get a better vibe. Though stanford may seem a little boring...there are a LOT of things to do there. just talk to some of the people on the Stanford09 yahoo group. neways...good luck with your decision!</p>
<p>oh btw....the quality of life and the atmosphere at STanford is one of best...look up Princeton review's ratings on that..and if u ddont belileve in those...just talk to some ppl from both schools.</p>
<p>I live in Bay Area and am familiar with both Stanford and Berkeley. Berkeley is more eclectic and has great ethnic vibes. Great food, never a dull moment and its education ranks higher than Stanford on the national scale overall. Berkeley is liberal and gives every student a chance to speak out. In fact, the more opinionated you are, the better people will like and respect you at Berkeley. Because its student body is SOOOO vast, there's always someone to hang out with. </p>
<p>However, that vast student body is cutthroat competitive and class sizes are huge. A class of 500 is considered a small class at Berkeley. There's little personal attention from professors (and they are VERY excellent professors - Berkeley's professor system is as competitive as they get) and a lot of the work is taught by TAs. But a degree from Berkeley definitely will qualify you to work anywhere in the world because the EXTREME competitive element of Berkeley is acknowledge nationally and universally. This is also why Cal hates Stanford because undergrads there have it "easier."</p>
<p>Stanford, while competitive, is NOT as cutthroat as Berkeley is. The atmosphere is suburban - again, totally different from the urban rock-punk-liberal image that is Berkeley.</p>
<p>(continued post)</p>
<p>Stanford on the other hand, has a huge campus. Its dorm system is better than that of Berkeley, because it's private. Stanford offers somewhat the same level of education and one can always transfer between Stanford and Berkeley to take classes. However, Stanford is extremely expensive. For educational purposes ONLY, it appears to be the better deal to go to Berkeley, where you get the same/better education for a much cheaper price. </p>
<p>The real decision comes down to what sort of life you'd like to live in college and what kind of environment you'd want to surround yourself in. The education is the same (Berkeley a little better because of the crazy competition there), it really comes down to preference and financial circumstance. Feel free to PM me if you have any questions.</p>
<p>yibun's got the right idea, but exaggerates a bit... For an English major neither school is going to be cutthroat competitive. Liberal arts competition isn't bad. A 500 person class is pretty much as big as they're going to get at Berkeley, not the "smallest class size", and those are only going to be intro classes. But yeah, Stanford intro classes aren't going to be too small either.</p>
<p>Well, maybe the liberal arts won't be as bad - but most of my friends who have gone there/are attending there are engineering/math oriented majors, so maybe that's why I have such an exaggerated view of things. But I'm just telling you so that you're aware of the general atmosphere of things...</p>
<p>"Great food, never a dull moment and its education ranks higher than Stanford on the national scale overall."</p>
<p>Yibun, where did you see Berkeley ranked higher than Stanford? USNews ranks Stanford undergraduate much higher than Berkeley, and most of Stanford's graduate rankings beat Berkeley as well.</p>
<p>Ya, Yibun is talking absolute rubbish, " its education ranks higher than Stanford on the national scale overall." Stanford is a far better school than Berkeley using any ranking or measure. I'm not sure about the other subjective points such as competitiveness or "ethnic vibes."</p>
<p>Hey Nick</p>
<p>If Stanford offering you a good fin aid package..then it should be stanford. I was offered admission to both also and Stanford's fin aid package was sooo much better than Cal's. Both are great schools. Ignore what yibun is saying about the rankings...most rankings rank Stanford higher than Berkeley..but these rankings sometimes are so close that there is rarely a difference between the top 5 or 10 schools. So choosing Berkeley wouldnt be a bad idea either. Just look at fin aid and also consider the personal attention given at Stanford...that was a big plus for me..and also the fact that its not so cut-throat competitive as Berkeley...I've been through enough of that in high school I dont want that in college.</p>
<p>To address all others above:"</p>
<p>The bottom line: Stanford outranked Berkeley in business, law, engineering and education while Berkeley gave Stanford a better run for the money in social sciences and humanities."</p>
<p>I meant overall on the english humanities scale, because that's what the person said s/he was interested in. </p>
<p>Source: <a href="http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/news/local/11294492.htm%5B/url%5D">http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/news/local/11294492.htm</a></p>
<p>April 2, 005.</p>
<p>Dude, that's at the GRADUATE level. At the undergraduate level, Stanford trumps Berkeley by too much of a margin.</p>
<p>not quite...for you us news worshippers check out undergrad business...haas is #3 after wharton and sloan</p>
<p>that is, if you want to major in undergrad biz...im not sure if stanford even offers it.</p>
<p>Stanford is Stanford and Berkeley is Berkeley. The admit pool to Stanford is measurably superior to the admit pool at Berkeley. At Stanford you'll be surrounded by much more intellectually motivated students who have accomplished amazing things in life. This is not the case at Berkeley. Although there will be some amazing students at Berkeley by the law of large numbers, on average you will be surrounded by a less intellectual student body. The bureaucracy at Berkeley is also horrendous. To the administration, you are just a number, and they don't care whether you flunk out, are overwhelmed, or go through incredibly hard times. In terms of undergraduate education, you cannot compare the two by any means. Stanford is so much better than Berkeley that you might as well be comparing Yale to UVA. </p>
<p>Anyway, like 99 percent of cross-admits choose Stanford. You might feel a bit awkward at the Big Game when the Stanford crowd yells, "Accepted" and points to you saying "Rejected!"</p>
<p>Gutrade, by the "law of large numbers" there will always inevitably exist an individual who will choose UVA over Yale, Chico State over Harvard, Berkeley over Stanford, or a janitorial job over a CEO position. Maybe different people want different things.</p>
<p>Ubermensch, what you are saying is certainly true, but those people are the exceptions to the rule, certainly not the norm. From what I've seen and heard, Berkeley tends to be more number-driven than Stanford, as many public institutions are. Stanford is like HYP in that it counts the intangibles (EC's, leadership, and personal qualities) very heavily, which is why its admissions tends to be regarded as somewhat random and unpredictable. This explains why Berkeley is labeled as academically cut-throat, whereas Stanford's student body is considered to be more diverse and unique.</p>
<p>An English major from either college isn't going to land you a high paying job straight out of college. So the question is whether you think smaller classes are worth starting your life out with tens of thousands of dollars of debt. </p>
<p>Berkeley's campus isn't the only thing more exciting than Stanford. The city of Berkeley, and the close proximity to San Francisco give Cal students a hell of a lot more to do off-campus than those stuck in stale Palo Alto. </p>
<p>I'm biased (Cal student) but so is everyone else on this thread, so that's okay.</p>
<p>Both Berkeley and Stanford are unique in their own ways of approach to a college education. Berkeley typically forces its students to go out there and get it themselves. They have to find time to talk to professors, spend hours and hours studying... just for a B, but in the end, you might find it much more satisfying since you weren't hand-held throughout your undergraduate years. If you are very independent and want to be in an urban environment, go to Berkeley. If you feel you want more attention and want to be in a sheltered rich neighborhood, go to Stanford.</p>