<p>That's my point-Islam as a whole is really skewed by many Western thinkers. The religion has received a bad rep because of a small percentage of radicals who have acted violently.</p>
<p>
[QUOTE]
the ones whose mostly fundamentalist leaders will read this article and use it to further indoctrinate their determined followers into believing that destroying the West would be pleasing not only to Allah, but to an infidel spokesman.
[/QUOTE]
</p>
<p>Do you honestly think that Islamic imams will brandish an article from the Stanford Daily News to inspire hatred? Yeah, right. Not only does anyone with half a brain understands that the article is SATIRE, but please. How ridiculous.</p>
<p>
[quote]
What you have to understand, Andi0rz, is that there is no such thing as "going too far" in the name of the Prophet, Allah, or Islam. That's what you and your AMERICAN Muslims friends seem to have forgotten. Most Muslims, like most Americans, can't stand multiculturalism and are deeply fundamentalist. Get over it.
[/quote]
This is not true. Not even slightly. Stop repeating everything you hear-- there is no way you got this information from a reputable source.</p>
<p>I think people like you, who claim so no so much about Islam, should read the Qur'an. And don't tell me you have because there is nothing in there stating that "going to far" doesn't exist. It is actually a very peaceful and wise book.</p>
<p>evilmonkey32, do you honestly think I don't know this is a satire and not meant to be taken as a real suggestion? Of course I do. BUT I AM ME. HOW MANY TIMES MUST I SAY THAT? I, and most people on this board, would never take the article "seriously." But that's because you and I are what the Muslim fundamentalists call collectively the "Western devils"-"little Eichmanns," if I am quote Ward Churchill. But that is not the point of my *****ing. The point is to draw attention to the incredible degree to which young intellectual elites like yourself are disconnected from the feelings of the masses. In this case, the Muslim masses. </p>
<p>JackBauerPowerHour, stop spouting such lies. The Holy Book of Islam contains countless intances of hatred and violence portrayed in a positive manner. Anybody can look these up if they wish to. Another thing, I NEVER claimed to know "so much about Islam." I simply claimed to know a lot about the mainstream sentiments of people who happen to be Muslim towards Western countries. Like I said to venus121, stop reading things into my posts which are simply not there.</p>
<p>Except mainstream sentiments (esp. those promoted by the media) focus exclusively on radical Islam.</p>
<p>if there's one place where you can speak your mind and satirize stuff like this, its in a university newspaper. don't freak out and rob people of that! that was hilarious.</p>
<p>Yes yes yes.</p>
<p>I give up and admit that it WAS hilarious. But it's still bad taste and maybe not the best thing to publish in times like these.</p>
<p>Have you read it? Have you spoken to the majority of Muslims in existance? </p>
<p>The problem with you is that you confuse reality with what appears to be reality: it seems that a fundamentalist mentality is predominant in the Islamic population simple because Islamic fundamentalism is more discussed, more emphasized, and also because members of this group happen to be more outspoken than the general Muslim population (as Mystic Merlin said).</p>
<p>Again, you are wrong. If you read the Qur'an, and then show me the precise passages that are supposed to incite violence and fundamentalist thought in believers, then I will take what you say into considersation. As of now, you have gotten all your information from secondary sources or blatant haters.</p>
<p>Greatestyen blew Arafat.</p>
<p>Also: do you consider those in France who burned down the buildings and cars in their OWN neighborhoods fundamentalist? Probably not. I hate that everything that Muslims do is seen in twisted perspective.</p>
<p>It is people like greatestyen who help the terrorists gather support.</p>
<p>I'm not gonna lie, 7-dust has made two incredibly awesome posts.</p>
<p>As evidenced by JackBauerPowerHour's last post, I must not be speaking English. </p>
<p>I explicitly said that I thought European Muslims were, on the whole, considerably less fundamentalists than their Middle Eastern/African/South Asian counterparts. But I don't have the time nor the patience to sit here outlining my worldview to have you forget it each time you post something new. </p>
<p>Anyone interested in finding out more about the complex issue of whether Islam is peaceful or not is urged to visit these sites:</p>
<p>Islam as warmonger: </p>
<p>Islam as beacon of peace: </p>
<p>Yes, I know these are hugely biased sites but quotes from the Qur'an are quotes from the Qur'an.</p>
<p>@greatestyen:</p>
<p>i assume you're not a muslim? or that you don't live in a muslim nation? or that you don't know, at the most, more than 100-200 muslims by their first names? and that you're no spokesperson for a muslim community?</p>
<p>well, if you're not any of the above, please don't make generalised, inaccurate statements about any religion's beliefs. sure, a section of muslims don't like the "west". just like a section of the west may feel threatened by every muslim last name. that's a sad thing. but that doesn't represent the majority. saying that muslims hate the west is like saying the west hates muslims. both statements would be absolutely absurd.</p>
<p>seriously though, it's because people like you spread stuff like this about muslims "hating" the west that the situation at hand gets only worse. muslims feel like it's an unfair representation, decide that the west is biased and then seriously feel like hating them for thinking we are all identical globs with one track minds. and then hatred breeds violence and violence breeds retaliatory violence.</p>
<p>sure you may read newspapers from all over the world, and know where 'multiculturalism' comes from- haha. i think i could get that from the tone of your writing - all very pedantric and bookish like some facts were swallowed from a textbook and poured out over here. </p>
<p>you don't like me saying these things about you, do you? </p>
<p>it's natural for other people's incorrect assumptions to **** the concerned person off. similarly, it's a bit more than annoying that you feel that you having read some newspapers and articles makes you the expert on what the majority of muslims think.</p>
<p>if i didn't pity you, i'd be outraged.</p>
<p>oh, a few suggestions before you quote the quran the next time:
a. learn arabic.
b. read the quran in its original version.
c. read up on the history of arabs during the prophet's time.</p>
<p>i've read three english translations for each line in the quran. they're hardly ever the same. it's a belief in our religion (i speak as a muslim) that the quran cannot be exactly translated. which is why, arabic is a language a lot of non-arabic children learn so that they can read the quran's original version. </p>
<p>also, you agree that the sites are biased. the articles were written with the intention to portray islam as a scary religion. if i were like you and read them, i'd think every person with a last name of arlandson hates muslims. haha.</p>
<p>translations of quran, especially if quoted in sites like these are as authentic as the fake levi's sold in the streets of china.</p>
<p>kee10, I applaud you
:)</p>
<p>greatestyen, you're claiming that Islam can be judged as a violent religion because the Koran contains some violent passages. However, the Christian Bible also contains violent passages--for example, all the stuff in the Old Testament about all the things that can justify killing someone (adultery, for instance). However, Christianity is largely considered (at least today) to be a peaceful religion. This runs counter to your argument.</p>
<p>Also, 7-dust, please don't try to refute greatestyen's arguments by saying "That helps terrorists." This is not a valid refutation of any argument or statement he has made, and it does not contribute anything to this discussion.</p>
<p>i got to agree to a small extent with gretestyen:
the muslims do somewhat dislike the west, who can really blame them for it though? its not like the west is doing them favors or anything, we pretty much screw them over.
I do not think they flat out support terrorism they are more laissez faire about it, more like this attitude: " well they should've seen it coming all that crap those westerners are doing in the world"
Also most muslims don't really like all the corrupt pop culture of the west, but like americans they still buy it anyways!</p>
<p>kee10,</p>
<p>Can you tell us what typically happens to an Arab person when he/she has religious conversion--from Islam to, say, Christianity in, say, your country? I've heard pretty mean things including death. However, I wonder whether what I heard is real.</p>
<p>Sly si makes the wise point that this shouldn't be about hermeneutics or even hagiography, but about the adherents to the faith today. It's quite true that American followers of Islam are, as a whole, more tolerant and better integrated than European followers, who are again miles ahead of most of the non-secularized middle east.</p>
<p>What I find despicable is those among you on this board who would deny people like greatestyen the right to speak soleley on the basis that he does not have the same priveleged viewpoint upon Islam that you do. Certainly, feel free to educated him with your insider's knowledge. But you should no more deny him the freedom to comment upon Islam and Muslims than you would a European the freedom to comment upon America or I deny you the imperative to comment upon Christianity.</p>
<p>Playing identity politics does not give you the sole claim to a voice on a certain issue. Of course, you ARE in good company. Plenty of practitioners of identity politics at Stanford subscribe to the same methods as you. Keep up the squelching and stifling and you'll be more than ready to join the Stanford community in the fall.</p>
<p>PS. This is not to say that all of the Stanford community is like that, but many are.</p>