I basically have a full ride to my state flagship, although their CS program isn’t that strong. It’s ranked about 70-80 in the Best Colleges for CS. On the other hand, I could also attend CMU CS but will probably not great financial aid, so I’d have to pay $~70k/yr. At the state flagship, I’d basically live at home and only pay $3k per annum for tuition since I received some merit scholarships.
Would a better college experience at CMU be worth the debt?
what “state flagship”. I think that matters here. Not all state flagships are the same. Ex…UCLA, Cal, Michigan, UVA, and UNC are the best ones I can think of where going there makes sense over CMU. If it was a lower state school like Penn State (still good but not like the top 5) passing CMU prestige would be too much for me.
CMU is arguably the BEST cs school in the entire world. The opportunities and the knowledge you’ll get from CMU will allow you to get a crazy salary and pay off those loans quicc. The only state schools I could think off that are worth the loss of prestige bc of the discount are UIUC, Umich, UCB, UCLA, GTech, Udub, UCSD
@quarkyplasma Which state Flagship? How much loan do you need for CMU? Depends on your goals,
and desire to suffer in cloudy Pittsburgh, among very quirky, nerdy kids at CMU. Here is a ranking system that
may surprise some readers. Carnegie Mellon grads have no where near the highest CS salaries, California schools consistently beat CMU grads for salary. MIT also beats CMU for salary. Many public flagships are the same for salary. I don’t particularly think CMU is worth $70K. It will take a long while to pay it off, IF you end up in California, with the high cost of living out there. I would go for flagship, and think about transferring after two years, to a better flagship, like GaTech or Michigan, so your loan is lower.
https://www.ivyachievement.com/computer-science-rankings/
How much debt?
If the CMU cost does not involve debt, at a price difference of $67k per year, or $268k over four years, what state flagships are so poor in CS that this difference is worth it?
“CMU is arguably the BEST cs school in the entire world. The opportunities and the knowledge you’ll get from CMU will allow you to get a crazy salary and pay off those loans quicc.”
This is SERIOUSLY flawed. CS grads from nearly every school are in demand. The CMU “prestige” nets you a median starting salary of $110,000. That’s a handsome, but if you had to finance that on loan (which you can’t) your payment would be almost $40,000/year. Now, let’s assume you just invested that $280,000 at 6% and didn’t touch it until the end of your career. In 40 years you’d have almost $3,000,000. That’s how much MORE you’d have to net over your career to make a CMU investment break even. That’s simply not going to happen.
@eyemgh You’re right but it’s even worse than you presented.
280k or some level of it require interest as well. The actually amount it will cost you is probably more like 320k plus. And it’s all after tax money. They will need to earn 410k minimum. 25 percent fed and 5 percent state.
Take 410k and compound it out over the lifetime of the student at market level returns. Staggering amount of money.
These representations from teenagers on how it all works and ultimate outcomes is expected. It’s woefully uninformed and lacking experience or perspective.
You should have to pay at least a decade of mortgage payments and other bills prior to commenting on any of these “should I pay x or go to y threads”
I think cc should have a program to verify privately one’s educational background, financial acumen or expertise via professional position or experience.
Give you a certain avatar for professional financial advisors, college counselors or former adcoms. Another set of avatars for your profession. Engineer. Doctor. professor. Mbb consultant. Inv banker. Computer or tech executive. Teacher. Etc.
It would allow readers to judge the level advice rendered while maintaining anonymity.
Short answer: no. Long answer: read posts #5 and #6.
As a computer professional myself, you don’t need CMU to have a prosperous career, nor would the debt be justified. What you’re going to get out of college is an entry level job. No more, no less. There’s no special salary for prestigious graduates. That’s a big myth. The higher the company goes on salary, the easier it is to attract an experienced professional to do the job. That’s a basic principle of economics. Prestigious colleges have high starting salaries…but also they’re on the east/west coast, with a high cost of living. For those places, the salary is entry level. You’re better off staying away from debt.
How would CMU be paid for?
If loans, then State Flagship all the way.
If your parents say “go where ever you like”, we don’t need loans and still have tons of retirement money then you decide.
If anyone needs to take out loans, then State Flagship.
A lot of assumptions being made on this thread - we are speculating until you can tell us this:
Will you need to borrow money? If so, how much?
What is the state flagship? I see it is ranked 70-80, but location makes a difference. Also, there are some state schools which have really great placements for their CS grads, even without an elite ranking (I think San Jose State would be an example of this).
How important is the “traditional” college experience to you vs. being a commuter student?
What are your feelings about fit in each school
That has a lot to do with location. California has the highest CS salaries in the nation - and many college students return to the areas where they are from or nearby. CMU’s student body is very east coast influenced (still great salaries, but not the same - with the exception of NYC metro).
@yikesyikesyikes, those would certainly be nice to know, but nothing about fit, rank, location or any other factor can offset the fact that one school is $67,000 per year more than the other. The opportunity cost of that difference, from a pure investment perspective could not be justified regardless of the school in question.
Well, USNWR #70 to #80 includes:
“Secondary flagships” include:
So the question is, is CMU worth $67k more per year than one of the above schools?
OP asked this question a month ago and hasn’t been back. Also, since decision is due tomorrow, I imagine he/she has made their choice. No point in offering further advice now.
Two other things that you need to consider. 1) you may realize that you really don’t like CS and switch major. I know you think that will not happen, but it has a much greater chance than 0% of happening. 2) if it is debt, it will highly limit your post graduation opportunities. You would not be able to take a low pay/high equity job at a startup because you have to make your debt payments.
I am not one to push evaluating a college degree under the pure average monetary return philosophy for all people. For some people, for example those that might come from less fortunate circumstances, that approach might make a lot of sense. For others, not so much. There really is not a one size fits all model for recommending a certain higher education opportunity over another.
If we chase pure average monetary returns based on cost, then the following choice makes the most sense for most people pursuing CS: skip college altogether and sign up for a good coding bootcamp that boasts average starting salaries that are about the same as an average college. It would be a lot cheaper, and if someone like the OP could get into CMU SCS, then he/she/other pronoun can get into a top coding bootcamp easily.
Also, even if we were to follow this philosophy, the additional information would be helpful. An average CS grad from an average school can expect a starting salary of around $66k according to most industry talent search sources (they might even present inflated numbers, since they have an incentive to do so, but let’s assume they are being honest). CMU grads average $110k. That reduces the original $67k rough immediate opportunity cost quite a bit. Also, the CMU average does not even include additional compensation beyond salary that makes some of the top CS opportunities even more attractive (like the really big stock grants and options that are refreshed). I am not even at one of those prestigious tech companies (but a pretty good opportunity nonetheless), and my additional compensation beyond salary for my first job out of college is about 20% of my salary. My friends who are going into the tippy top opportunities see an even higher percentage of their total compensation coming from sources outside of salary, and their salary is already bigger than mine.
I agree what you are saying about that money instead being used for investing and what not should be considered as part of the decision, but I do not think we currently have enough information to definitely tell the OP to go one way or the other.