<p>calmom - yes, but when they figure out the gpa, they take your soph & jr year, so if you only take 1 or 2 APs a year... i think the limit is 8 sem.... it's not a big deal, but it does count...</p>
<p>also, one more pt & then i promise i'll stop:</p>
<p>if stress makes you get off your duff and get something done -- it's a good thing!
if stress paralyzes you and you can't move forward -- it's a bad thing!</p>
<p>find a way to strike a balance!</p>
<p>Hilary, thank you for your post. I think what you are feeling is very common today and it is an important reminder to us parents to keep-in-touch with what our children are experiencing. Hang in there --- you sound like a great kid!</p>
<p>Hilary, parents, teachers, and kids are trying to strike a balance in challenging courses, benefits for selective college entry, stress, immediate happiness. And we don't always get it right. Sometimes it turns out wrong when it was right at the time, and sometimes vice versa. Many times we never find out. When you have a student who is very promising but just yet in the college mode, as a parent or teacher, you may suggest some stretch that he is just doesn't feel like doing. And it may be a stretch that is unhealthy and unwise. But, on the other hand, if you just let it go, a few years later, you may be faced with a transcript with a middle level classes, great grades and other stats ,a nd a kid who has limited his opportunity by not taking the toughest curriculum he could have.. And his response may well be that he was not well advised. So it is a difficult position to have to push a little, watch a little, back off a little, all at the same time. Sometimes you get kids who bite off more than they can chew which can be unhealthy, harmful and result in bad grades, bad attitude. Sometimes kids who are capable of doing a little more need that push. It's just when does the push turn into a shove?</p>
<p>fredo- that's very interesting!!! I guess there's no perfect solution. </p>
<p>Agree with klc about the good and bad stress. And with jamimom also, I think that students have to be realistic and not shy away from a challenge but also not take on too much. </p>
<p>Hilary, that's part of the challenge of being high school age. It's a time when you need to find out what's best for you- when to listen to advice from parents and teachers and when not to. It's not easy.</p>
<p>Hi, I'm new to this forum, however, I have been reading different posts since December. I have to say, that I'm a little glad I did not find this forum until after my daughter finished making her applications! Talk about feeling stressed, reading this forum is stressful! I feel so sorry for the anxiety and pain some of you and your children have had to go through. Here in the midwest, things are so much more low key. At least here where we live! </p>
<p>At D's high school, which is public, very diverse, and competitive, we are moving from a weighted GPA system to a system of unweighted GPA, but in order to give credit to those who take more challenging classes, quality points will be calculated in order to determine class rank. Therefore, the more challenging the course, the higher the quality point value assigned to it. Class rank will ultimately be determined by a combination of both GPA and quality points earned. </p>
<p>D's school offers both an extensive menu of AP courses and the International Baccalaureate program, which D is just finishing. Applying to colleges here is so low key by comparsion to what so many of you have gone through. Maybe you should all move to the midwest...just kidding, but so few here strategize on how to get our kids into the top tier schools. Few take SAT prep courses, no one works with a college counselor, beyond the HS counselor. We never even read D's essays or apps before she sent them off! They were her business and we wanted them to truly reflect who she is. Beyond requesting she choose a backup school she could live with, we told her to go for it. I worry at the stress we put our children under to get into the 'right' schools. I truly believe that a child can be highly successful wherever they land if they choose to take advantage of what the school they are attending has to offer. There is too much emphasis on getting into the 'right' school and too little emphasis on beginning to figure out what really brings joy to the heart of these young people. By the way, we are not all country yokels here, we have kids from D's school going to WUSTL (including D), Northwestern, BU, Yale, Vanderbilt, Duke, Emory, UPenn, to name a few.</p>
<p>It's an issue of control. Students are choosing to control how they spend Thursday night -- watching the OC, for example. Teachers and parents know that by sacrificing control of Thursday night, students gain more control over the future. The purpose of education is to create choices for students. To keep those May-of-senior-year choices alive, some Thursday night choices have to be sacrificed. These students are stressed by the mismatch between short term and long term goals. For some, perhaps, there are no long term goals. I find that my balkiest students are those who do not look at the big picture. </p>
<p>In a very immediate sense, these are the students who believe that any assignment can and ought to be entirely undertaken the night before it is due. They make no mental connection between the assignment being made five weeks before the due date and the relative complexity of the task.</p>
<p>My most serene and successful students place the due date on a calendar that includes EVERYTHING -- soccer tournament, Grandma's birthday dinner, babysitting obligation, and the OC. Then these students set due dates before mine that work with their schedules. They also set short term benchmark dates and note them on the calendar. </p>
<p>I teach this, but not all embrace this. </p>
<p>We also work on long term goals, even if the long term goal is "having a choice."</p>
<p>Another revelation/epiphany: Your ECs are personal choices; this is how you have "chosen" to spend your free time. It is no more appropriate to tell a teacher that you could not complete a task because of the soccer tournament than it would be to say that you could not complete the task because of a party.</p>
<p>Being grown up is difficult and it is not always fun. Adults schedule fun. We have regular tennis games that we put in our planners. We make note of parties, events, and your orthodontist appointments there, too. We meet our work obligations and have fun because we have planned for both things to happen.</p>
<p>Make a plan; you will all be happier.</p>
<p>P.S. Sometimes the plan is overwhelming. Good Luck to all.</p>
<p>I don't agree with unweighted GPA's. My son took as many AP classes as he was offered, even taking his calculis course on-line when it wasn't available at his HS. He will end his senior year with a 3.959 GPA. We will have 3 validictorians - only one has taken the AP classes and she should be rewarded for her hard work. Our school will change their policy next year.</p>
<p>I agree that HS can be a very stressful time for kids. Especially if you are taking AP classes for someone other than yourself, playing sports for someone, taking band, etc. My son took classes because he was qualified for them - you can't just sign up for them, you must be recommended by your previous teacher in that subject - and because he knew he would be bored to tears in most of the other classes. He has known what his major would be since 8th grade (Astrospace Engineering) and took the classes he knew would most help him with this major and prepare him to get into a college where he could take this major. At the same, he excelled in the activities and EC's that he enjoyed. He didn't just pick clubs and activities to satisfy someone elses expectations of him. Whether that be a parent, grandparent, or college admissions panel. I would think it would be hard to really put your whole heart into an activity you didn't like. He chose band (marching, symphony, and jazz), drama, and NHS and put as much time and energy as he could into these.
It paid off. He will be attending his first choice of colleges, The United States Air Force Academy, in June. He was also accepted at Arizona State, Purdue, and University of Michigan.
It is such a fine line between encouraging them and pushing them. I seem to have found it with my son....my dauther will be a freshman in the fall, we'll see how I do with her!! :)<br>
I kept telling my son - it's only 4 years, but then again, it's only 4 years! I wanted him to enjoy it and get the most out of it he could because you can't go back and do it over again. But I didn't want him to squander the time and end up not being able to do what he wanted after high school.</p>
<p>I know it doesn't seem fair, but managing stress is part of life. I don't care where you live or what causes your stress - whether you are a 16-year-old from Thailand that just had your family washed away or an American teen with the wonderful chance to take advantage of advanced courses - both teens are "stressed". I know it is sad, but be glad that your stress is related to having to learn too much rather than find your next meal or worry about where you are going to sleep. Now - I will try to stop lecturing but you could try reading the Bible - stress and suffering are put into our lives on purpose to build perseverance and strength. My daughter's biggest desire is to be a doctor - she needs to learn how to manage her time, stress and struggles so that she can be a competent doctor one day. These challenges will make her a better person in the long run. I would rather her learn these things in high school than in her residency when people's lives could be in danger. There will be many things in life that you will have to do that you don't want to do - they are boring (sitting through meetings at work), repetitive (listening - once again - about safety in the workplace), and unnecessary - but these are things you will have to face and it is better to develop a great attitude and find the good side (gosh - I would NEVER have read that great book if I had not taken AP English) in everything. Just some friendly advice...</p>
<p>I wholeheartedly agree that stress is apart of life and that our kids need to learn how to manage it. I feel very sorry for the kids who have the stress of having to manage a courseload they are not thrilled about, participating in the 'right' EC's to get into their #1 choice college when that EC is not a passion, taking endless SAT prep classes, etc., etc. Life is stressful enough when they choose their classes and EC's and have to learn to manage their time efficiently, make mistakes, and then sit back and reflect on what they could have done to handle a situation better. We as parents can provide input or suggestions, but far better to let them see their way through it. Too many kids get to college and cannot manage because parents have always picked their classes, EC's and managed their time. So many parents (and very many parents on this forum) are way too overinvolved in this process. We all want what is best for our kids and we want our kids to be successful but we need to give them space to figure some of this out on their own. So what if they do not get into their first, second or even third choice. Their life will not end. They need to pick themselves up and reevaluate their situation. We need to encourage our kids to think about what makes them tick and give them the space to grow and handle their choices and the outcomes of their choices. What we should really be striving for here is raising capable kids who can handle themselves through adversity. That only happens with practice and with experiencing firsthand defeat and moving onward from that point.</p>
<p>KLC, does your high school have honors classes in sophomore year? The UC system also weight honors courses the same as AP in terms of calculating GPA.</p>
<p>calmom:</p>
<p>unfortunately, but the UC's weight very few honors-level courses from Frosh or Soph year, (the UCOP website implies that no Frosh Soph courses are weighted but that is incorrect). Honors Geom/Alg II, Honors Eng, Hon Science, Hon History et al, are not weighted unless it is the equivalent to an honors-level Jr/Sr course, with appropriate Frosh-Soph prereqs. </p>
<p>For example, Honors Chem would likley be approved for weighting bcos it's prereq is usually college prep Chem. For math, Honors pre-calc and Calc are weighted regardless of when taken (bcos they are considered a Jr/Sr course and have prereqs). AP courses are always weighted no matter when taken.</p>
<p>How do you find out which courses are NOT weighted? I thought that if it showed up on the approved "honors" list for that school, then it qualified to be weighted. I haven't found anything on the UCOP site to the contrary. ???</p>
<p>I'm a sophomore starting to feel it already. I guess I shouldn't be complaining too much yet though.</p>
<p>Times have changed so much. I know a doctor friend of my parents who went to U Chicago without taking any advanced courses or making very good grades. He is now the supervising physician in a top ranked emergency room.</p>
<p>I seem to be in a huge minority here but I'll give my point of view. I'm a junior in a fairly competitive highschool; an average of 15-20% of each graduating class(~425) ends up at an ivy league or the like. I'm currently in AP calc BC and AP Physics C along with 5 honors classes. I would be taking more classes but there isn't enough time in the day, I'm taking an additional class instead of lunch. I'm currently sceduled for 4 more AP courses(as many as I can take) next year, and am planning on taking possibly 6 or 7 exams. I have extracurriculars most days and play a sport(well enough that there's a possibility of being recruited). All of this would even be almost resonable if I didn't miss up to 50 days of school in a year for reasons beyond my control. I could easily justify taking an easier courseload due to my absences. </p>
<p>The reason for subjecting myself to to all this is quite simple really, and getting into a top college is only a small part it. Mainly, I just enjoy all the pressure, total insanity and exploring various ideas. I can't remember actually being in school for more than 6 weeks straight without missing at least 3 consecutive days. There have been times when ive been out for a week and a half at a time. Having been under that much pressure that many times for so long I've learned to compartmentalize my life and work very efficiently so I'm still able to relax whenever I need to.</p>
<p>I enjoy the really high pressure, thats why I do it. My parents don't push me too much unless they think I'm slacking. I know it's not like this for everyone, but it is an alternate point of view.</p>
<p>I enjoy a certain amount of pressure, but that's when I'm handling it. Once a grade drops I get annoyed.</p>
<p>In my freshman year I went to an elite private prep school where everyone was stressing <em>as freshman</em> about getting into top colleges. I hated the atmosphere because I like learning for the sake of learning. I think I got more out of my classes though I got A's and B's than my classmates who got all A's did. This kind of attitude encourages kids to gets A's and ONLY A's, which promotes stress. Every year juniors at the prep school had nervous breakdowns. It was awful. </p>
<p>WHY?</p>
<p>It is because they want to please their parents and get into Harvard. The prevailing attitude on College Confidential is that Ivies are the best way to go for everyone. Not everyone can get into Ivies, and now most of my friends from the private school I attended as a freshman found themselves rejected despite the best efforts of four years to get in.</p>
<p>My perspective is that high schoolers are KIDS. They don't know what they want - they don't even know who they are yet. There are the exceptional kids who truly ENJOY school, and some of them get great grades and some of them don't. That's life. Your child is NOT condemned to work minimum wage jobs if they go to a state school or a community college. If they are motivated in those environments I am confident that they will be as successful as someone who attends a New England college that accepts 20% of its applicant pool. Anyone can make whatever they choose from any situation. </p>
<p>I attend a California Community College. I graduated from high school in three years and decided to stay home. I think I am getting a good education as it is. At UC Berkeley, which is where I eventually would like to transfer, I would be in classes of 500 right now. None of my classes is larger than 30. My teachers know my name, will be glad to write positive recommendations, and provide personalized feedback. My 3.8 HS GPA is hardly a slacker GPA, but I wouldn't have gotten into a selective college. I would have been admitted to a lower tier UC or a CSU school. I would not be getting the education in their introductory classes that I am getting now, and I would be paying from 3-8 times as much for it. </p>
<p>I have to stress that this was the right path for me. I didn't stress in high school and am confident enough in my abilities that I don't feel as though I need to get into Yale or Johns Hopkins to get a good job. If you are motivated you will do fine in life regardless of where you went to college. You get a degree and do the most you can to have a good learning experience and you will be fine in life. </p>
<p>I'm sure there are grads from some rural university that accepts 90% and shined in their environments that are beating out Colgate grads for jobs. I think it's unhealthy for high school kids to stress as they do because they are KIDS. They think their life will end if they don't get into _______ University. It won't. They'll do fine.</p>
<p>Stress is a part of life, but the reasons kids feel the stress about getting into college is because they think they will a) disappoint their parents b) not get a good job/make no money c) simply feel like a failure.</p>
<p>it is indeed miserable... there are so many classes i want to take at my school, but i didn't take them because they aren't college prep classes/ap/honors- the ones that colleges wants to see.</p>
<p>I get stressed just getting out of bed thinking about work.(j/k)</p>
<p>calmom, Not all honors classes are counted one extra point, just like bluebayou said, only the UC approved honors class. However, there is a huge difference between regular class and honors class(non-UC approved honors). The regular class is less challenging. A student is more prepared for college if he/she is in honors track(even if there is no extra point), and student must maintain a B average otherwise will not be promoted to the next level of honors class.</p>
<p>That is true there is a fine line between moderately stressed(healthy) and overly stressed(not healthy). I keep my kids staying on the high academic stress so they can be challenged, however they must have a good 8 hours sleep every night, no homework Fri/Sat and no stress/pressure on ECs. I think this is where it determines whether they go to Ivies or not. I'm not sure I'll be jumping for joy(parental bragging right) or cry(monetary problem) if they got accept to Ivies, that is why I don't pressure them for ECs. If they want to do it, I'll support them, if not, I'm fine with it.
A funny thought about the thread on Andi's son, I must admit my kid is neither good in Music/Math nor any sport. Her EC would be playing hours of Neopets(lol), but who knows this could be a great eye/hand coordination for future surgeon? Or may be not? Who knows?</p>
<p>My daughter is a former Neopet addict -- I think she still has a little Neopet world in which all are thriving, but I do not think that she spends much time with that any more. However, back in the height of her Neopet-management days, she made a killing on the Neopet stock exchange. In fact, when I saw how much she had accumulated, I wondered if I should have put dd in charge or managing our real-world investments. So perhaps all that Neopet time might lead to something useful after all...
(At least its better than my son's high school addiction to "Grand Theft Auto" which, as far as I can tell, has no redeeming qualities whatsoever)</p>