Strike

Colleges and Universities A-Z Naval Academy - Annapolis
1

<p>The teachers and councelors in my school district are deciding to go on strike. They aren't able to write any letters of recommendations because they think it would defeat the purpose of the strike. I know my nomination packets for my congressmen are due right around the first day of September, but I don't know if this strike will still be happening.</p>

<p>My questions are: </p>

<p>Has anybody experienced anything similar to this, and if so, what have you done?</p>

<p>Do you think any of the congressmen would accept a letter, in place of my recommendations, from my guidance councelor explaining the situation for me (even though she will be on strike she said she could write something like this for me)? She would also write me a letter of recommendation herself.</p>

<p>If none of this is possible, what should I do!? I see the nomination deadlines coming closer, but I can't do anything about this strike! I'm getting worried about it...</p>

2

<p>Wow- I think this may be a first!
Well, you do have some time- most applications for nominations do not have to be in until late september-early October....personally, I would take up the offer of the guidance councelor and have him/her write a recommendation for you. You could send that in, and forward the others at a later time (although most MOC request everything at the same time), or have him/her seal it and give it to you to hold....and hold it as long as you can (but not longer than 2 weeks before the MOC deadline) and hopefully by then the teachers will have settled their strike and started writing their letters for you.</p>

<p>You have some time, so don't panic. Just double-check the deadlines for your MOC....and figure you have until 2 weeks prior to that to get your stuff in.</p>

<p>ps....personally, I dislike teachers that do this, and hold the kids in limbo. Strike for what you will, but don't hurt the kids in the process. IMHO. Shame on them.</p>

3

<p>Then why aren't YOU down at thet school board demanding higher pay and benefits for the teachers. Then they wouldn't have to strike. Shame on all of US that support the circumstances where teachers are so poorly paid. [I am not a teacher although I have been a substitute teacher and seen what they have to put up with firsthand.]</p>

<p>Otherwise, I agree that you should explain circumstances to MOC, use whatever recommendations you can get, including asking the principal for his/her help given the circumstances. [It IS a bit juvenile for a teacher to refuse to write this type of recommendation, but ce' la vie.]</p>

4

<p>Bill,
Loved your comment in support of teachers. However, as you know labor disputes frequently involve other issues besides wages including, working conditions (e.g., class size with directly affects student learning and the quality of education), safety (another issue that impacts students), health benefits (a major issue for everyone these days), staffing, etc. I teach in the third largest school district in California and our contract prohibits us from going on strike. We just voted on a new contract that resulted from an entire year of bargaining and the teachers are pretty satisfied with it.</p>

<p>Imilew, It sounds like you have a good sense of the application timeline. You have almost two months after Labor Day for most congressional nomination application deadlines. All other college-bound seniors will be in the same boat needing evaluations/letters of recommendation. Don't sweat it because the teachers probably won't strike afterall, and if they do it will probably be resolved quickly because most parents can't stand having their kids at home beyond summer vacation. They will pressure the school board to support the teachers/counselors and the students will be the big winners because happy teachers make good teachers. </p>

<p>On the other hand, maybe that guy on the other thread had a "heads-up" on this issue when he supported the idea of an uncle writing a recommendation to the member of Congress...;)</p>

5

<p>
[quote]
Then why aren't YOU down at the school board demanding higher pay and benefits for the teachers.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Students should not fall for what the teachers are trying to trick them into doing. Teachers are harming the students by using them as props in their monopolistic conquest for more money and all that crap mentioned above. They are telling you that it’s the school board's fault that you are being harmed, because the school board isn’t giving in to the teachers union. Really, it's directly the teacher’s fault that you are being harmed. </p>

<p>If a student thinks that teachers really do deserve more, then the student can go ahead and talk to the school board about it. Teachers shouldn't be blackmailing students into joining their cause when students really have nothing to do with the dispute between teachers and the school board. I propose targeted termination of employment for teachers at the helm of the strike. pwned.</p>

<p>If being a teacher wasn't worth the money or rewarding moments or summer vacation, then we wouldn't have enough teachers... but we do (some people say teacher shortages, pshhh). This makes people argue that if we don’t pay teachers high enough, the smart people will go elsewhere and the schools will be (are in some cases) filled with moron teachers. That is assuming that schools should just hire anybody who wants the job, and they shouldn't. If schools actually have high standards for who gets to be a teacher, and they pay what you may think is inappropriate, then there WOULD BE a shortage of teachers, and then the pay and benefits and all that for the teachers would increase! yey! And you don’t even have to bring monopolistic unions into the deal!</p>

6

<p>taffy,
You need to carefully reread Bill's post; he was talking to a parent.</p>

7

<p>lmilew:</p>

<p>Do not panic! I live in PA as well and work in a public school. I am sorry to hear your teachers are threatening a strike....
First, your gc must work until the strike vote is taken. If she has contractual days to work in the summer she must do so.... she is probably refusing to do any "extra" work, outside her contract per advise from the union.</p>

<p>Second, state law limits the length of the strike. The PA senator's deadlines are late Sept and your cp deadline is prob early Oct.</p>

<p>Third, if she is refusing to help you while she working a contract day and before they vote to go on strike the get to the HS principal or superintendent.</p>

<p>Keep in mind, you may not need a recommendation from her for a nomination. Our cp's nomination's manager told us the the recommendations can come from anyone...... Scout leaders, teachers, club advisors, athletic coaches, members of clergy if you are active in your faith..... Personally, I think in most instances gc's are bad choices because most of them only know the student by reputation and have never really witnessed them "in action".<br>
Don't hesitate to call your cp's nomination manager, you will probably find that person very helpful.</p>

<p>Good Luck and hopefully they will settle before the first day of school!</p>

<p>By the way..... PA is one of the few states teachers can strike AND the public school teachers here are Very, very well paid..... go figure.</p>

8

<p>Just to set the record straight about teachers’ salaries in Pennsylvania. Beginning teachers start at $38,751. Listed below are average teacher salaries from the current Philadelphia school district’s salary schedule.</p>

<p>Step Seven: </p>

<p>$53,710 Bachelor’s Degree</p>

<p>$55,634 Master’s Degree</p>

<p>$59,124 Master’s Degree + 30 units</p>

<p>Just think, a master’s degree + 30 units translates into approximately eight years of college, about the same amount of time to acquire a medical degree, but look at the disparity in pay. There are also huge regional disparities in the United States. My school district’s pay scale is at least 25 percent higher than Philadelphia and 40 percent higher than Seattle, Washington, but their cost of living isn’t that much lower than mine. </p>

<p>I know we have already had this discussion, but I don’t consider the above teacher salaries to meet the definition of “Very very well paid.”</p>

9

<p>Yea well that is Philadelphia..... in my kids school district the average is about $80,000. First year teachers start at about $35,000 but max on the scale in only 15 years..... don't forget they only work 185 days per year and get paid for all the "extra" things they do..... club advisors, mentoring etc</p>

<p>Also, don't forget that most school districts pay for at least 1/2 those grad credits.... </p>

<p>but all of that is beside the point of seniors needed their college recommendations and transcripts sent off in a timely manner.....</p>

10

<p>
[quote]
Then why aren't YOU down at thet school board demanding higher pay and benefits for the teachers. Then they wouldn't have to strike. Shame on all of US that support the circumstances where teachers are so poorly paid. [I am not a teacher although I have been a substitute teacher and seen what they have to put up with firsthand.]

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Well I am both a teacher and a nurse.</p>

<p>And just as I would not strike as a nurse, putting my patients in jeopardy, so I would not strike as a teacher, placing my students in the same situation.</p>

<p>And I attend our school board meetings- reguarly- as a parent and as a taxpayer.
And in our district, our teachers are highly paid- by the public in our community. And as far as I know, at least dating to 1981 when we moved into this district, they have never taken to a stike, and at a time when LI budgets fail as often as they pass, our district has never had a budget fail.</p>

<p>And yes, shame on the teachers that, knowing their students and their parents are under deadlines, choose to use them as pawns in salary negotiations or otherwise. There are better ways to go about it.
Like I said, strike for what you will, but don't hurt the kids in the process.</p>

<p>IMHO.</p>

11

<p>I think teacher strikes are so rare that if they happen it's a major news story on the national news. It impacts overall productivity because it creates child care issues.</p>

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<p>My guidance councelor was already told not to return to work as part of the strike, having her writing letters for me is something extra she is doing to help. Only the administrators are still working.</p>

<p>I would contact the principal about my problem, but that is another dilemma... we don't have a principal at the moment. The School Board is currently trying to find a new one. </p>

<p>The thing that gets me though, is that the teachers in my district are paid A LOT, some of the highest salaries of teachers in the state. I believe this one is in regard to the health benefits and longer hours... very unfair to the students.</p>

13

<p>It's not for you to judge, and it sounds like a messed-up situation if the school doesn't even have a principal. I suggest you focus on other aspects of your application at this point because you still have time to get the recommendations.</p>

14

<p>
[quote]
believe this one is in regard to the health benefits and longer hours... very unfair to the students.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>IF the students get hurt in the process, then yes, it is.</p>

<p>
[quote]
I think teacher strikes are so rare that if they happen it's a major news story on the national news. It impacts overall productivity because it creates child care issues.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>It creates a lot more than child care issues.</p>

<p>I recall, when I was trying to finish my masters, a time when my professors went on strike, for similiar reasons. It was a bitter strike, lasting nearly the entire semester, and try as I might, I never looked at them quite the same way when it was over. The professors that retained my respect were those professionals that continued to hold classes despite the strike. </p>

<p>But back to the issue at hand....</p>

<p>Hopefully, this issue will be resolved for you before your applications are due, and you can proceed as planned. Lets hope your teachers keep the interests of their students up front and center, and resolve their differences at the table without harming the students in the process or locking them out of the classroom.</p>

15

<p>
[quote]
you need to carefully reread Bill's post; he was talking to a parent.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>And my argument still stands. It is as little the parent’s problem as it is the student's problem. I have also heard the suggestion that students/parents/anybody-besides-the-teachers should be at the school board complaining about teacher salaries, so if I'm not debating Bill, I'm debating somebody else out there.</p>

<p>As for the master's degree thing.... bachelors + masters + 30 units can be done in 6 years. Of course there a huge difference in pay between teachers and doctors, because the requirements for the job and the job are soooo different. Any doctor could have been a teacher, while very few (if any) of the teachers I have had would have been able to even get into med school.</p>

<p>
[quote]
I don’t consider the above teacher salaries to meet the definition of “Very very well paid.”

[/quote]
</p>

<p>You can't just look at the numbers/salaries and decide if something pays well or not. You also have to look at the job itself, and in this case the salary fits the job.</p>

16

<p>I suppose a distinction needs to be made between two actions.
Are the teachers hurting the kids merely by striking [disregarding for the moment whether or not such an action may be illegal in the jurisdiction] or by refusing to complete the requested recommendation?</p>

<p>I agree that, despite a strike, completing a recommendation, at least in this very limited circumstance, should be done.</p>

<p>My comment was in response to the suggestion that teachers shouldn't strike because it holds the kids in limbo.
Thus, my question above, is the writer disliking teachers who strike and refuse to sign recommendations or is all teachers who strike?</p>

<p>My suggestion to the writer that he/she should be complaining is in response to the notion that he/she dislikes ALL teachers who strike. If this is the case, then how would he suggest that a group of persons move management for increased pay/benefits? If a group of persons is not allowed to organize and speak for themselves [at least those in public service] then others should be prepared to so for them. [Especially for a group such as teachers.]
Now, that is not to say that teachers are blameless. There are plenty of teachers who do not deserve even what they are being paid now. However, many problems in the classroom have been created by us. [Pogo lives!] Unfunded mandates [no child left behind and all that jazz], meddlesome education commissions, helicopter parents, etc., etc., etc. Throw in unions--not a huge problem here in Texas and we still have a horrible education system--and it is a volatile mix. Oh, and don't forget the children!</p>

<p>Simply stated, if I didn't feel I was being paid enough as a teacher, I would probably strike too. And, while you're at it, who says I have to feel out 50 stinking recommendation letters. That's not in the job description is it? I mean think about it, not only do I have to spend my time in the classroom, but today's parents [kids] expect me to decorate the classroom, babysit the kids, enforce regulations, AND write recommendation letters. Guess that's why I am not a teacher.</p>

<p>I think there are teacher shortages in some specific areas that require any kind of advanced knowledge, e.g. science, math, foreign languages.</p>

<p>"It is as little the parent's problem as it is the student's problem." Isn't that the problem? Nobody thinks its their problem and, accordingly, our public schools continue their slow decline. Or, as a liberal migh have it: Lets teach and endeavor for mediocrity. As a conservative might have it: As long as we teach that dinosaurs co-existed with man and the garden of eden, all is well.</p>

17

<p>I didn't mean for this to be a debate over teachers and their salaries!</p>

<p>I was just looking for some suggestions on how to handle my situation with enough time to get everything in as I apply for nominations... thank you to everyone who gave their ideas!</p>

18

<p>QueenBee and Taffy - I teach in WA state - The top of our payscale is $55,130 with a masters degree + 135 additional credits and 15 years experience. Most of us still have a minimum of 15 more years to teach after reaching the max. We still have to keep taking credits in order to renew our teaching certificates, but there is no more salary advancement for those credits. Our district pays $400 a year for professional development. This summer I took 10 credits. (so much for having the the "summer off".) If I go to a workshop during the school year, I end up paying for the substitute out of my pocket because it goes over the amount paid for by the district.
I teach kindergaten and generally work at school from 7 AM until 5 or 6 PM. Then I usually put in about an hour or two of work after dinner. That's 3-6 hours per day that I am NOT paid for. At the end of a school year I usually work a least a week after school is out packing up my room for the summer and I start back in the fall about 2 weeks before school in order to set up my room. We are NOT compensated for that time either. The general public is not aware of this extra time that we give. I was teaching in GA when I got my master's degree. I funded it myself. I won't even talk about the hundreds of dollars that I spend on items for my classroom each year.
Yes, there are some rotten apples that do the barest minimum, but the majority of teachers that I work with continue to give and give and give because we care about our students and want what's best for them.
Thank you to those of you that spoke up in support of teachers. It's the negative comments that make you sometimes think, "Why do I do this, the parents don't even notice?" Then you remind yourself, "I do it because I love children and enjoy watching them learn."
Remember to THANK a Teacher, it means so much!!!!</p>

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<p>Bill0510-</p>

<p>My position is really simple. I belong to two professions- nursing, and teaching. I will argue that parenting is also a profession to which I belong.</p>

<p>I am from the old school in which I firmly believe professionals have a higher calling, which is to serve the public good. As such, I do not believe professionals shoud strike.</p>

<p>I believe that walking off the job, whether from the patient bedside or the classroom, will place innocent people in harms way, be it patient or student. And while the outcome will be immediately apparent for one, that doesn't mean there aren't more subtle ones for the other.</p>

<p>I have had my issues with working environments in both arenas. I am not paid my worth as a teacher, and I am certainly not paid my worth as a nurse. I get little, if any, thanks. Sometimes I get a little recognition- most times not. But that will never be the cause of my turning my back on my patients, or on my students. Ever. </p>

<p>That does not mean I do not go kicking and screaming where I feel things should, and could, be better. As a professional, I make a conscious choice to do so in ways where it neither hurts my patients or my students. </p>

<p>So I am not sure how that translates into answering your questions. What I can add to this is that just as I would not arbitrarily hold back on mediations from a patient, I would not arbitrarily hold back a letter of recommendation for a student, strike or no strike.</p>

<p>That is what professionals do. So in response to your specific question, yes, I do lose respect for professionals who choose to strike. I also dislike teachers who look at writing letters of recommendation "above and beyond" their call of duty. It is part of the package. Don't want to write them? That's ok...then teach in the grades where you will be less likely to encounter such requests! I hate doing annual evaluations for 150 employees....but hey, that is part of the territory! I do have other choices if it gets that intolerable!</p>

<p>Now, being a law professional and all that.....Would you leave a client in a lurch, in the middle of a trial, over your working conditions? "Judge, can you please hold off on the sentenancing of my client...I have an issue with the (fill-in-the-blank-working-condition-terms) and I must take my leave to strike....client of mine, you don't mind, do you? I'll be back as soon as the strike is over to handle this for you....."</p>

20

<p>Another thing to consider is that a very high percentage of midshipmen parents are educators...</p>

<p>anxious mom, I know that Washington state teachers are extremely underpaid and it's not like housing in the Pacific Northwest is cheap anymore. I'd say your district's salary scale is about 15-20 years behind most urban districts. I have never heard of a teacher having to pay a substitute for their own professional development. That's exploitation. You're right about the job too. Most of the kids are a pleasure to work with and our colleagues are quality people as well.</p>

<p>Okay people, list three recent teacher strikes and exactly long they were out!</p>

<p>navy2010, Are you defending attorneys? ;)</p>