<p>@Times3 In my next life I am going to own a fleet of falafel carts outside every studio building that Tisch uses as well as outside every studio building at all of your kids’ schools’ studios as well. Cha ching.</p>
<p>@Fish. Loved the Jaws clip. That is exactly what I hope this thread never becomes. I think so far so good.</p>
<p>Here is another question I thought of for this discussion: </p>
<p>How do schools, (especially state schools like UNCSA and Purchase and the like) with truly bargain tuitions for fantastic training and small class sizes, afford to pay their faculty for studio instruction and class time upwards of 30-40 hours? That feels like more instruction time than anyone would expect in any undergraduate major is it not? KatMt? Others?</p>
<p>KatMT: “Freshmen tend to have basic level coursework that is more tightly prescribed, so it could be very difficult to get the preference of a full day off or a large specific time off for a full time student.” (I still can’t figure out how to do the cute box!)</p>
<p>As far as the basic level coursework, it depends on the school and the Freshman. Both my D’s (Northwestern and Williams) didn’t have much basic level coursework in that they either tested out of that and/or the school didn’t have a lot of prescribed work for Freshmen. </p>
<p>But I was referring to the whole four years rather than just Freshmen year. I think as a non-Freshmen in a BA/BS if you weren’t double majoring and if having time off was one of your top priorities - say if you wanted a day off to go to an internship (which can count as a class too, or independent work) - you can probably schedule to have the day off. </p>
<p>My D’s experience is similar to glassharmonica’s D at Fordham. She is definitely busier with mandated outside theatre stuff than my other non-theatre D at Williams.Both are very busy though. (They both do work study too.) I think one of the differences is that the BA programs are a less structured schedule across the four years (you have more choices in classes) whereas the conservatory is structured for you, and the conservatory is focused nearly entirely on theatre-related work.</p>
<p>When I say “basic level course work” I mean they are often placed in specific classes depending on the level they are at. Freshmen do not always get first pick of classes, either, so at some schools it could be very difficult to consistently schedule a full day off. It could get easier as a student gets further into the program. But, if a required course is only offered on MWF the student will have no other option but to take it.</p>
<p>However this will vary from school to school. So many variables… :-)</p>
<p>PS. I am not talking about Northwestern specifically, just schools in general. I missed that the original question was about Northwestern. Oops!</p>
<p>Exactly connections! I’ve been trying to think of how to say that -
“I think one of the differences is that the BA programs are a less structured schedule across the four years (you have more choices in classes) whereas the conservatory is structured for you, and the conservatory is focused nearly entirely on theatre-related work.”
I would say this is a major difference this discussion has been trying to pin down.
Some schools maybe very close in credits to a conservatory but it is where the credits come from that makes the difference. I would guess too that students in a conservatory have schedules that all look very similar and students in a BA or a not quite conservatory BFA have some differing classes based on their choices.</p>
<p>
Ouch! May I suggest summer school transfer courses from your local community college as an investment in her future sanity?</p>
<p>Halflokum understood the point I was making.</p>
<p>Some people here seem to be saying “Well, a conservatory has A, B, C, and D, but a non-conservatory doesn’t have A, B, C, and D.”</p>
<p>I don’t believe it.</p>
<p>I think of the novel Nicholas Nickleby, where Nicholas gets a job in a school called “Dotheboys Hall”. When he shows up, he discovers it isn’t actually a hall! The headmaster, Wackford Squeers, insists there is no law (no “act of Parliament” as he says) that prohibits him from calling it a hall.</p>
<p>I think it would be naive to just assume that a program has A, B, C, and D just because it calls itself a conservatory, and that a program doesn’t have A, B, C, and D just because it doesn’t call itself a conservatory. You have to look at each program and see for yourself what it does or doesn’t have.</p>
<p>KEVP</p>
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</p>
<p>The distinction is true, that in the conservatory-style schools are more structured and have fewer academics. D4’s BA theater program, however, leaves zero choice in terms of electives, so it doesn’t exactly feel unstructured. (This is exacerbated by her theater double major, although many course do count for both majors.) She has at least 2 academic classes (these first few years) per semester and has to think carefully in order to arrange them so that she’ll have met the distributional requirements. Sometimes classes actually overlap and she needs permission to leave one early to go to the next. She also took a summer school class this past summer and will probably take another next summer. Her goal is to have her schedule clear to concentrate on her thesis as a senior. The students who don’t do this will end up doing gen eds along with their thesis, or even staying an extra semester to graduate. </p>
<p>I have 2 other kids in college right now. D2 is in a BFA art program (if anything is more time-consuming than theater school, it’s probably art school–that is, if you are dedicated and spend long hours in the studio.) She transferred to a school with more gen eds than her original art school and is ending up spending extra time there (at my suggestion, because the facilities and program are so excellent and, as an in-state school, the tuition is relatively low.) As a result, as a super-senior she is taking Italian, her first-ever elective, and something she has wanted to study for years but has never been able to. </p>
<p>D3 goes to a true conservatory (for music). She has one academic class a semester (yearns for more) and often has as many as 12 classes rostered for a semester. Her school allows cross registration for everyone (except actors…) with a storied university uptown… except (something most prospective students don’t realize), it is nearly impossible to schedule those classes against an irregular conservatory schedule. She is actually going to visit the dean to ask if she can stay an extra year as an undergrad to add a second major (and maybe, since her requirements will be finished) take a course or two at that storied university, so she can have a richer education.</p>
<p>This is a fascinating thread to which I have not much to add except to say to FBF that I for one and I don’t think I’m alone in this am just so grateful to you that for whatever reason you decide to still come back here and post on this college board. The information you share and analyze with aspiring theatre majors, their parents and college students here is invaluable so we hope you continue to feel welcome to do this. Sending you Break A Legs to whatever you are aspiring to work on! and Bravos to whatever you may be doing!</p>
<p>Tisch students don’t have to wait until they are done with gen eds to take electives – they can take electives alongside these classes, and they also can fulfill gen eds right up until second semester of senior year. They do meet with academic advisers along the way to see how they are fulfilling their requirements. Tisch academics do include seven semesters of theater studies; these are not done in the studios, but on the alternating days.</p>
<p>Some (if not all) of the performance electives must be at most two credits, because my daughter is taking her second one right now, and both times, she carried two full credit academic courses as well (ie., if the electives were four credits, we’d have had to pay extra because that’s over the per semester maximum included in tuition).</p>
<p>The flexibility that comes with the Tisch curriculum is that students need a minimum of six semesters of professional training (the full-time studio) but can take up to eight semesters of it, and they can complete a semester of studio over the summer as well. Any acting electives are additional options, not substitutions for the studio requirements. So, there are a variety of ways for students to mix and match performance and academic interests (freshman and sophomore years must be studio years; junior and senior years there is the flexibility to change studios or take a semester or two for strictly “academic” studies).</p>
<p>While each studio is different in how they structure their curriculum, I would be surprised if the total number of hours varied much – if it’s 8 credits, then I would imagine that there are class hour standards by which each studio must abide.</p>
<p>I will also add that for those students who either want to save money on tuition or get out early in the world, the flexibility of the Tisch curriculum (and acceptance of AP credits) seems to enable alot of students to graduate early. I know quite a few kids who have taken this route.</p>
<p>The Jaws clip says it all, FBF! This is a great thread-- now that D is a sophomore I’m finally understanding how the different programs work!!! Never too late.</p>
<p>KatMT, your response was to the question I had about BA programs and being able to plan out your classes. Do you think that if that is important to my son it would be appropriate to ask that question of a rep from a theater department?</p>
<p>Shacherry – I think it would be appropriate to ask that question. I know I would be happy to answer it honestly for the program where I teach, and I assume that others would as well.</p>
<p>I think the answer will vary from program to program… for example, I teach in a small MT program where all of the freshman MTs are in a MW voice class and a F performance lab. There is only one section for each of these courses, so all freshmen in the program are in these classes. We also placed each student in their acting class for the fall. Some were in a MWF class and others in a TH class. These placements are based upon dance class level placement and whether or not the student was also living in the arts Living Learning Community (LLC). </p>
<p>There is slightly more flexibility for the Theatre students, because the program is slightly larger and their are a few more sections of some freshman classes, BUT there are still some restrictions based on the arts LLC, which classes we place the students in based on their audition/ interview/ portfolio review, etc…</p>
<p>All of our freshman also have to complete certain specific general education requirements before the end of their freshman year, so the general education for freshman may also be a little more tightly prescribed, because the student will be looking for general education classes that work within their major course schedule.</p>
<p>Once students reach sophomore year they start to have a more flexibility in scheduling (although there are still some classes that a student takes in sequence over their four years that only has one section or all sections meet on specific days that would prohibit a student from scheduling a full day off from classes). </p>
<p>We have had students in their junior or senior year who were performing/ rehearsing up in DC (a 1.5 - 2 hour drive) who were able to make it work with their course schedule if they took fewer credits/ went part time those semesters. We also have worked it out for a student to take all or part of a semester off for a professional opportunity.</p>
<p>I blah, blah, blah about these specifics in relationship to where I teach as examples of what MIGHT or MIGHT NOT be possible at any particular program that you will not really be able to find out by just looking at view books and websites. </p>
<p>Hope it helps :-)</p>