<p>I just sent out the paperwork and signed the whole note agreement to get a subsidized direct loan. I noticed after I got my MPN number that they wanted a meeting. Am I correct? Do they want a meeting to talk about the direct loan or is it just optional? Also, when do we receive our loan? Since mine was sent out so late, will that affect the time I receive it?</p>
<p>More than likely, the meeting is to fulfill the Entrance Counseling requirement that is also attached to receiving the Direct Loan. Some schools still require the Entrance to be conducted in person rather than online.</p>
<p>Meeting? I took this loan out, but didn't hear anything about a meeting...Plus, I got my money already.</p>
<p>If you are supposed to go to a meeting, please schedule it. When I worked in financial aid, we did face to face meetings. We tracked everyone down & dragged 'em in. Help your f/a office out & stop by to set up a quick talk. It's painless.</p>
<p>Some schools don't have "meetings." My d's school did it online. Check with your FA office; they'll tell you exactly what you need to do.</p>
<p>I think most schools do online counseling now, which is usually required before the loan will be certified. Because entrance counseling is not optional, if it's done in person it will have to be done in the near future. It only has to be done once, normally. Because my D switched schools, she had to do it a second time.</p>
<p>"Its painless". That's priceless. </p>
<p>We can get away with "Its painless" exactly once, when the kids were 18 months old, but at 18 years old, "its painless" means a conditioned response. </p>
<p>Who wants to hear that the money has responsibilies, interest, terms, and obligations that will tie them up for 10-30 years and if they are lucky, until they die? What is the attention span of an 18 year old, in orientation, meeting new people, in a new living situation? The same is said for a graduating senior, stepping into the life's abyss? </p>
<p>Pay attention to the entrance and exit sessions. Read the find print. Understand the understanding.</p>
<p>Perhaps the students will later discover that there is no more money for loans because the previous students never paid their obligations. Student loans = Ultimate Subprime Lending.</p>
<p>LongPrime, you mean like it says in the above article.<br>
I do believe we are setting up for a big implosion by allowing students to take on excessive debt (though some of the people mentioned in the article 'only' started out with 20-30K in loans - which imo isn't excessive for a 4 year degree)</p>
<p>LongPrime, you are correct. By "painless," I was referring to the act of coming in & having to sit through the counseling. I wasn't actually referring to the information that would be presented ... it sort of goes in one ear & out the other for most students ... for those who do listen, it really CAN be painful.</p>
<p>Wow, has anyone else followed that Times link to the SLJ website? The stories people have submitted there detailing abuses by Sallie Mae and other lenders are unbelievable! Although most are posted by people who have had difficulty repaying their loans on time, even those who have paid on time, even in advance, seem to be held hostage. Scary, huh?
I have to wonder how much they're really counseling kids before they take out these loans - do colleges know what they're letting their students in for?</p>
<p>In many cases, the schools are providing students will precisely the right information....repeatedly. At my institution, we have both traditionally aged students as well as a large adult population. Our traditional students have mandatory Counseling meetings where we review Stafford Loan information; we also require them to complete electronic entrance counseling. We hope by being redundant, something will sink in. For our adult students, we only use electronic counseling because the adult population is spread out too much that it prohibits meeting with all students to complete the counseling in person.</p>
<p>In my office, we updated our paperwork to include loan information at every step along the way. We even include a repayment schedule with the instructions for applying for aid. We advise our students to borrow responsibly...taking into consideration that they can always increase their loans later if they find they didn't borrow enough to begin with. The problem I see is that students are not taking the time to read or listen. I can't tell you how many of my adult students call 4 years later and swear they didn't know that the "Stafford Loan" was actually a loan. Many also call after graduation and swear "my education surely didn't cost $40k for 2 years, did it?"..to which I retort, "Absolutely not, your tuition was only about $20k but you chose to borrow your maximum each year."</p>
<p>Borrowing has gotten so bad that I have refused to even offer my graduate students the GRAD Plus loan...they don't need the money to meet cost but even with the max allowed for Stafford loans, they don't reach COA. I have had many graduate students complain because I do not allow them to borrow the additional GRAD Plus funds...which would mean a total of $32k each year they are in our 2 year MBA program. Realistically, they don't even need $32k to complete the ENTIRE program using 100% of their loans to cover all out of pocket expenses.</p>
<p>I've had countless students who have refused to complete their FAFSA applications because they only want to take a private educational loan, typically through Sallie Mae. Even when I ask them to compare the interest rates between the two types of loans, they still think the private loan is a better option since they "don't have to provide tax documents to anyone."</p>
<p>Students just need a better education BEFORE they start college...probably starting in elementary school or middle school...explaining how debt can adversely affect ones future. By the time they reach people like me, the damage is already done and they completely tune the FA counselors out.</p>
<p>I find the NYTimes article disturbing. I think the gentleman who started the organization/website is misguided. Why on earth would you quit your job if you have financial responsibilities? He is an engineer? They didn't give him a raise so he quit? He's taking Salsa lessons? I understand there are those who legitmately may not be able to repay the loans, but come on. He wants to change the way bankruptsy handles student loans? This is just a symptom of a much larger problem and that is we live in a disposable society, if you don't like it, get rid of it. This is really not fair to the rest of the country who take their debts seriously.</p>
<p>I agree, milkandsugar. Once, when refinancing our mortgage, I asked our mortgage rep what people who have huge, expensive houses in our are do for a living. He told me that they often have jobs that pay less than our family income ... they just overextend themselves. He told me that I would be floored to know how much people have on their credit cards (NOT being paid off each month, as I do). This was 10 years ago. In the meantime, I think things have gotten worse. There's a sense of entitlement & people borrow so they can have the things they feel they deserve. Then, when it's time to pay the piper, they often want others to bail them out (bankruptcy, mortgage assistance from govt, etc). I agree with NikkiiL ... somehow, we need to teach kids fiscal responsibility. As long as so many adults around them continue to borrow so much, though, I don't know how much will sink in.</p>
<p>When my co-workers and I discuss finances, they are floored at the fact that my family of 4 survive off less than $30k per year and only I work. (Average income for my area is $22k) My husband doesn't work (personal coice we made) and is always home when the kids get out of school or have a holiday or come down sick. When I explain that I have NO credit cards, no recurring debt and only minimal monthly bills (rent, telephone, internet, Direct TV and insurance), they are amazed. I learned early on, but not early enough, that living on credit was a HORRIBLE way to survive. That's one of the reasons I rent instead of owning. (My only debt now is my personal student loans.)</p>
<p>I have been working hard to teach this concept to my daughters...live within your means and only purchase what you can afford to buy outright. I even got my job at a college so I could provide them with a relatively free education. My institution has agreements with several institutions that provide my dependents with tuition benefit waivers, so all I have to pay is room, board, fees and books. They get two choices...receive enough scholarships to get a full ride to the school of their choice OR go to a school that offers an agreement.</p>
<p>I'm completely in agreement with you, Nikkii, on teaching our kids financial responsibility. My kids started in pre-school with savings accounts, allowances, going to the bank to buy savings bonds, etc. and I soon instituted a 50/50 cost sharing on their "extras" - whether it was an extra toy, sport, pair of shoes or whatever - which quickly taught them to plan ahead and choose very carefully. They've still accumulated the normal "gotta haves" and gadgets of their generation, participate in ridiculously expensive sports that they're really passionate about, and have travelled quite a bit - and I make less than $30K per year too! But they also like to work and their "education" has always included frank, age-appropriate, discussions about money and the choices it can give or take from you. As a result of this, and consistently living below our means even when there were things like beautiful new cars that tempted us, I think my kids have become smarter consumers and very good little savers too. My D will be going through the financial aid process for next year and is already asking alot of questions about how everything works, hence my "research" here and elsewhere. Although she's aiming for a career with 100% placement, very good job security, and a high starting salary, she wants to borrow as little as possible and pay a substantial portion off with her first "signing bonus". I really don't want her borrowing anything until she's at least two years into the program and knows it's truly what she wants. Hopefully the scholarship gods will smile upon her...</p>
<p>Anyway, the threads I found disturbing on that Student Loan Justice website (and I agree the founder seems to need a reality check and a real job), were the ones detailing the ill-treatment people have received from lenders, even when they say they were paying their loans as agreeed! I realize these are anecdotal but can all of these educated people be stretching the truth? There are numerous accounts of things like allocating lump-sums to future payments instead of principal reduction (costing the student thousands in extra interest); restarting loans that had been discharged or paid in full years earlier (thus, documentation was discarded in the meantime), or never disbursed in the first place (lender can't provide documentation either, but won't correct records); consolidating or changing terms without the borrower's consent; making threatening calls at home and work on a daily basis and starting garnishments for amounts in dispute or not legally due - which has apparently driven some of these poor souls into stress related disorders! Is there no system for overseeing this or working with some of these lenders? Their posts indicate that some SL lenders claim they are not subject to the normal fair credit/truth in lending laws and that Sallie Mae is one of the worst. According to some of these former students, even taking them to court and prevailing still doesn't guarantee they'll straighten their own mess out! The fact that there is no mercy for the downtrodden is one thing but it doesn't seem right that they could be systematically ruining people's lives with impunity! I'm not advocating for an "easy out" for student loans although, realistically, no one can pay what they truly do not have and there should be some way for people to retain their dignity and pay what they can without the loans going into default and ballooning. I've heard some horror stories from people I actually know who had legitimate runs of very bad times, clearly beyond their control, so I'm more inclined to believe this could actually happen to anyone. If so, maybe you could direct some of your stubborn, determined to die in debt, students to that website for a sobering look at what happens when life (or your lender) throws you a curve!</p>
<p>When lenders are unscruptulous in their collections attempts or when action is taken that is in direct violation of written agreements, students do have recourse: the Ombudsman. One of my former students is going through this process now, disputing the loan with the lender, and contacted the Ombudsman. We just had to gather copies of ALL documents related to the student to send to the Ombudsman showing aid processed, documents received, charges assessed to student, excess funds forwarded to the student, etc.</p>
<p>I also personally know the horrors when a lender gets it wrong. Almost 9 years ago I took out Direct Loans to fund my education. 6 months after graduation, I began contacting the lender ot find out where my payment booklet was. They SWORE I did not have loans. I checked NSLDS and my loans were not showing there either. I even made several attempts to send monthly payments in, only to receive the checks back with a statement saying there was no account in which to place the payment on. Mistified, I figured the school messed up and never processed the loans (they messed up my Pell Grant and only processed 1/2 of my awarded amount). A year ago, a collection agency tracked me down and demanded payment of my Direct Loan. When I explained the situation, they agreed to send me a copy of my MPN and account history...to which I was surprised to discover why no one could find my loan...they placed my loans under the wrong social security number. Unfortunately, I didn't understand FA back when everything started, so I no longer have the documents that proved my case, so I am stuck with 9 years of interest and penalties and JUST got them out of default.</p>
<p>I also see tons and tons of undergraduates who leave school owing $60k for an education that only costs $40k...and graduate level students who leave our 2 year program (which costs less than $25k including books) leave school with more than $40k in additional debt. Its absolutely OBSURD!</p>
<p>^ I'd talk to your congressman. Not your fault that they missed your TIN, they also had alternative ways to trace you, but never spent the effort. If the sum is big enough, sue them for harassment.</p>
<p>Nikkii - That is completely wrong that they returned your timely payments and it seems like they certainly should have waived the penalties, if not the interest. I think I'd be disputing that in a hearbeat! Was the Ombudsman program any help to you in this?<br>
It's sad how many kids borrow for things they don't need to - but good to know that some will be thanking their savvy FA folks like you later! Just wondering what prompts all this -do they think it's an attractive rate or is it the deferred payment that's enticing them? I've heard students talking about taking out more student loans to buy a car, even though they live on campus, and wonder how they feel when they're still paying for that car 10 years after it's in the junk yard! With student loans and credit cards being so easily accessible, these financially naive students seem to be on a very slippery slope!</p>
<p>In my case, I no longer had grounds with the Ombudsman because I had discarded the evidence that I had made attempts to repay right after graduation. Had I known FA like I do now, I neverwould have thrown away the letters and returned checks....live and learn, the hard way. I did get through to the collection agency who removed the collection fees, but I be paying the interest, so the bill is now only half of what it was. </p>
<p>Some students see the low interest rates and deferment option as a GREAT thing. Others face situations similar to me when I was there age: I tried to get a car and was told since I had no credit, I couldn't get a car loan. Stafford Loans re so simple to get: no credit, bad credit..no problem, it just makes it easier to get what you want.</p>