<p>I disagree that summer programs should not be attended with an eye to their increasing the likelihood of acceptance to a BFA - but it depends on the specific program. All of these programs are great fun for the kids - they get to immerse themselves in their passion with like minded peers. For many of them it will be the first time that they do NOT feel like the proverbial fish out of water. There are specific programs that focus more exclusively on the hard skills that will help them when the time comes for college auditions, especially audition skills. Those programs that focus on end of program performance opportunities can't possibly spend the same amount of time on hard skills development because so much time is spent on rehearsal. I'm not making a value judgement because different students/parents want different things from these programs. As you research the various programs available, try and be clear about what you want out of the program and make sure its a good match for your individual objectives. I've said this many many times on the forum, but I am totally convinced that the help my D got with acting, selling a song and audition prep were critical to her college (and subsequent professional) audition success and college acceptances.</p>
<p>Also, I wanted to chime in about the rehearsal period comments. My D has been working at the MUNY in St Louis this summer (since the beginning of June) where each fully mounted musical is rehearsed for only 11 DAYS before opening! And given that each show runs only for 7 days, those ensemble members who were hired for more than one show (the most anyone can do is three) are often starting rehearsals for a new show during the day and performing the current show at the same time for four days in a row. While my D reports that she is working harder than she ever has, she is also exhilarated by the process and is learning more than she imagined possible. She is so impressed by the talented people with whom she has the privilege of working and understands that it is only because these folks ARE so talented that they can put these shows on their feet so quickly.</p>
<p>I'm glad theatermom posted because I think her sharing of her D's experience at CMU's precollege program correlates with a point I was trying to make. That is, it does not matter where you get the training and preparation for college auditions but what matters is that you DO get training. Someone with no training would be at a clear disadvantage. For some, this training was had at a summer program. The summer program did not get them into a college program but what they did there definitely contributed to their preparation. Others might obtain that preparation in another way. For instance, my own child did not get audition prep at a summer program. But she worked with her private voice teacher on preparing her songs and she worked with a private acting coach senior year to select and prepare monologues, plus acting her songs. Also she trains in dance at a studio. The bottom line is that kids who are going to pursue musical theater need training. That may come in a summer intensive or through lessons or classes at home, and so forth. </p>
<p>My child's summer program did not prep for college auditions. CMU's program, for example, offers a great deal in that area so someone might want to go there to get that kind of preparation, or even to sample college life. My child's summer program was a balance between training (classes) and production experience. (from the description of OCU's summer program, it too offers training and production experience) For instance, while my D did not prep for college monologues at her summer program, she took Acting Master Class which I am sure has added to her acting skills. Years ago, she took vocal coaching which does work with a student on a song (but she does this at home). My thought is that in the years leading up to college, a student should be getting acting, voice and dance training throughout the year. My opinion is that ideally there is some balance between training and theater production. Doing actual shows adds to someone's background in stage work. As well, the more you audition, the better you get at the actual skill of auditioning. Doing college auditions should not be the second or third time you ever audition in your life. These are all things that can be done leading up to college. Choosing a summer program should fit what you want to get out of it or balance out what you might be able to get during the year in your home area. An example of how to balance the summer program with what you get at home during the year....our school or community has no acting lessons or classes so my child never had any but she did take acting at her summer program every year. There is not a ton of theater going on during the year here and so her summer program gave her an opportunity to do high level youth productions. For someone else, they might want to fill in the holes from what they do at home and what they might get some place in the summer. I also want to make sure that someone who cannot afford a summer program realizes that a summer program per se is not needed to get into a BFA program. But the bottom line is that training IS needed. There are various ways to find it in different communities. Some are lucky to have drama teachers at school who might be willing to work one on one with a kid on monologue prep. We don't have drama classes or teachers at our school. It all varies but all these programs do have the benefit, as Theatermom indicates, of being instrumental in one way or another in a kid's preparation or training in the field. </p>
<p>My suggestion is to find training during the year and summers to prepare you for this field. It need not be audition prep at the summer program but there are ones very strong in that and if you might not get that at home, opting for a summer program that offers it is a way to get it. One needs to pick a program that best matches what they are looking for. But any one program or even going to a summer program is not needed to get in but it can help prepare someone very well (as Theatermom mentions) and the main idea is to get that help some where, whether at a pre college program or in lessons at home, or any other ways. No one program is going to get you in but any program or any prep in your home area is going to be needed to enhance one's training to go for this. Some kids go to performing arts high schools and get lots of help there and some like mine do not have that but find it privately outside of school. Some do summer programs, some don't. But most who are ready to embark on the college audition process have been adequately prepared and trained in the skills of singing, dancing, and acting, and in preparation for the auditioning too. Where you find that varies but finding it is important. </p>
<p>OCU summer program - Thanks again, ocuMTinfo for sharing the wonderful update of the week. I think your description helps explain why I hear so infrequently from my son! I've talked to him twice, though, over the past 5 days, and he keeps saying "Footloose is going to be a GREAT show, Mom, get people to come!"</p>
<p>Okay - here is an open invitation for all of you living near OCU - come see Footloose this Friday night at 7 in auditiorium of music school for very reasonably priced tickets, no reservation required!</p>
<p>We've done some very good local summer programs in past, so OCU is our only away from home summer experience, but I must plug it as wonderful. They have much good class / learning time, including prep. for college auditions, and also put on a show at the end. Anyone looking for future summer programs should strongly consider this program regardless of where you live in the US.</p>
<p>In response to the question from Vocaldad, I can provide some info about three programs S has attended:</p>
<ol>
<li>Walnut Hill Summer Theatre program (<a href="http://www.walnuthillarts.org/summer/theater.html%5B/url%5D">http://www.walnuthillarts.org/summer/theater.html</a>) He attended this 5-week residential program last summer and we would highly recommend it for it immersion in classess and productions under the teaching of highly qualified teachers from the performing arts high school, working professionals and college faculty (the summer faculty will vary but some of the full-time WH theatre teachers run the program and will be there every summer). The age range is 13-18 and the quality of the productions, especially the final musical, are exceptional. Each student is cast in at least two productions but the auditions are competitive.</li>
<li>Boston Conservatory Vocal/Choral Institute (<a href="http://www.bostonconservatory.edu/programs/summer_choral.html%5B/url%5D">http://www.bostonconservatory.edu/programs/summer_choral.html</a>) While this 2-week program's name might dissuade some MT kids, S is a very dedicated MT student and felt this program was excellent. He has just concluded two weeks at BOCO where he felt he benefitted from great personalized attention (through 4 master classes and daily vocal, opera or MT, and choral classes). Since solo recital performance of MT, opera, or classical pieces happen at the end of each week, students who would be uncomfortable with that level of immediate solo visibility might be challenged. BOCO faculty from vocal performance and MT voice, working MT and opera professionals are the VCI faculty. Master classes were taught this year by working MT directors and a well-known Boston singer/faculty member.</li>
<li>Long Lake Camp for the Arts (<a href="http://www.longlakecamp.com/%5B/url%5D">http://www.longlakecamp.com/</a>) S attended this camp for three years, during the last of which he was 15. The facilities and performance opportunities are very good. (Residents stay in cabins-boys and attractive camp dorms-girls; the Lake is beautiful.) Returning leadership in the musical director's role makes a positive difference; the camp owners are not really "arts" folks, though, so do make sure that Danny is still heading the musical theatre program. Many kids love the setting and the quality of the performance opportunities so repeat campers in the same session (there are 3, 3-week sessions) are quite typical, similar to what Susan describes for SDM. In comparison, Long Lake has a bit larger enrollment than SDM but is smaller than French Woods.</li>
</ol>
<p>Thanks for the info on the camps. Do you know if Boston Conservatory gave camper evaluations, or admitted any students to the MT program based on their performance at the camp (assuming of course, that the student applies and receives approval in the regular application process thru the university). Or, on the other hand, did the school gently let them know that they need not go thru the expense and time to apply, as they would not be considered for the program (or had a very slim chance). </p>
<p>I have heard that in the past, CMU has waived the audition process for a very few (maybe just one or two each year), based on their camp experience. Perhaps current students from the CMU camp can let us know if anyone gets admitted at the end of the camp.</p>
<p>If there are any students that attended other MT college summer programs (Steinhart, OCU, U-Mich, NYU Cap 21, Northwestern, etc.), please share (if you will) if the school provides feedback as to the liklihood of acceptance into their program. It seems that it would be a real service to the student (and parents), and save them the expense, time, and anxiety of an audition trip and application process, if the school knows (based on the camp experience) that the student is unlikely to be accepted. </p>
<p>If the school faculty has worked with the student for 2-6 weeks, do they really need the student to make another trip (sometimes including airfare, hotel etc.) to campus for a 5-minute audition, not to mention the time spent on the application process (essays, etc.). Also, if the student knows they will not be admitted, they could use this money/time/expense on another school, where they may have a chance of being accepted.</p>
<p>It is true that CMU will offer 1-2 students on average admission to their School of Drama from pre-college. Last year, there were 2 actors offered admission (no MT's) - in the class that is rising juniors, there was 1 actor (and possibly 1 MT? But I'm not sure). Not sure about the class that is rising sophomores - but the 3 examples I cite are all for sure, as I know all 3 of the students personally. That having been said, I believe it is true that they do not ALWAYS admit through pre-college - but for those who are admitted, they find out in late August, before even beginning their senior year in high school! (CMU sends all pre-college students written evaluations of their final auditions and teacher feedback from their courses - and the admission is based largely on a student's work throughout the program, not just his final auditons.)</p>
<p>While I don't know the answer to your question, I wholeheartedly agree that it would be a great benefit for summer program teachers to let the students know if they have a decent chance for acceptance into the college program. Why should a student dish out all the money for air fare, application fee/audition fee, etc. if they don't have a prayer? The only problem I see is, I think most times the staff running the camp is NOT the staff who auditions prospective college students. I could be mistaken. But if it IS the same staff, they have DEFINITELY heard 16 bars of an upbeat and 16 of a ballad, and probably MANY minutes of monologues! And if there is a dance component, they have seen the student dance! I have seen many theater productions where there are many talented people and I personally would be able to determine if he/she has enough talent to enter a college program (if I were a college professor who auditioned people all the time). Hopefully some professors could address your question. Personally, we live in CT and my daughter only auditioned for NYU and WE spent over $1000 in application and audition fees! We never paid any airfare or anything! I can't even imagine those students who had to fly to 8-9 schools and audition. (She did apply to 8 other schools, but cancelled the other auditions when she got into NYU).</p>
<p>RossJi, I know in the past you have mentioned that a disadvantage about applying ED was that you could not compare financial aid packages. This is quite true. Perhaps there is some solace in learning about the great deal of money that your family saved on the audition process by your D getting in ED! The expense of travel (by plane, car, train) and hotels and fees to all these schools was enormous. Added to that was additional coaching on more songs and monologues as there were different requirements for each school and so all the private lessons to prepare went on for many more months. I do not even want to add up what it cost, LOL. This was an expense that you were spared. Plus sometimes there are revisits in April to decide where to go or to at least attend an accepted student event that your child might not have done. It all added up. I realize it might not be equivalent to the whole financial package differences but at least there is that positive part on your end (looking on the bright side of things, that's me). A big plus your D also had was to know where she was going in December and not go through months of not knowing all her outcomes until April, let alone all the travel and conflicts with their normal schedule of classes, lessons, rehearsals. It was quite the year. So, revel in the benefits on your end but I realize there were disadvantages as with anything else. </p>
<p>BOCO did not give formal evaluations to each student. S is a rising junior so we were not as focused on this as the seniors. A BOCO faculty member did a session for parents on the final day about the college application process--we did not know about it, either thanks to S's lack of tracking the announcements or that they were targeting seniors' parents. S did come home with numerous instances of faculty encouragement to apply, their positive comments about his talent, and a strong sense that he would be considered favorably. That isn't nearly as conclusive as a written evaluation and an admission offer but we'll likely be looking for those program attributes as we choose next summer's program!</p>
<p>Thanks Susan - I do feel a little better about not being able to compare financial packages. CCM did accept my d academically and invited her (as well as many others!) to audition for more scholarship money beyond the $4000 they were willing to give her, but we would have had to fly there; you're absolutely right when you say you often have to fly to a school AGAIN to participate in a scholarship "contest"/not sure what to call it! I think this was in ADDITION to having the regular audition, although I believe CCM was part of Unifieds, so we wouldn't have had to fly separately for the regular audition.</p>
<p>RossJi....I have heard about the trip you must make for the scholarship consideration at CCM. Freelance's D is going there and was unable to make that extra trip (due to conflicts) for the scholarship thing and knowing her D as I do, she would be a prime candidate for either artistic or academic scholarship. I must say that I would not like a system that made you make a trip there for the scholarship consideration on top of all the audition trips. My D got scholarships at every school she got into and these did not require ANYTHING extra in terms of applications or trips. For CCM, you had to go in person for the scholarship stuff and it did not necessarily always coincide with the audition. It is not only an enormous expense and time commitment but it is especially so given that at that juncture, the student has not decided to attend as he/she does not have acceptances in hand. Conceivably for CCM, you might make three trips.....one for the scholarship thing, one for the audition (on campus or unifieds) and one for July orientation if you enroll. This does not even count the fact that many visit campuses in junior year to decide where to apply. We are now talking major mula. I can see extra application stuff for a scholarship but not an extra trip, particularly at the point before admissions decisions are rendered and particularly if not on an audition weekend. </p>
<p>On the topic of college program decision makers at summer pre college programs.....I think this can only help a student. My kid never went to a pre college program but it makes logical sense that if a dept. director or faculty member worked all summer with a kid who they felt was good for the program, they will keep that person in mind because they know a lot about the person, beyond what a typical applicant can demonstrate on audition day. I think it only makes sense that it CAN be a leg up if they like you in the summer and bode well come audition time in winter. I've heard of kids getting into UMich or CMU for example after going to the summer program on campus. I don't think going to the program should be with that in mind but it is one thing that could be a positive outcome. I think someone should go with the mindset of the preparation and training that will be gained from the experience and the benefits of that for college auditions in general. I do not think going to a pre college program gets you into college but can be helpful as one way to get that kind of preparation that is needed. And in a few cases, if faculty really love your talent and get to know you, it will likely be considered as they weigh your admissions. </p>
<p>My D attended UM's summer workshop while it was still at Interlochen for four years. She loved every second of it, with no intention for it to be a college prep thing. Her first year was the summer between 8th and 9th grade! Like the SDM people, she wanted to return every year, and was able to, even though every year she had to re audition for a spot.</p>
<p>Each year the seniors had a meeting with the director, Brent Wagner, to discuss applying to UM for college. We only know about D's last year, but most of what was said was that it wasn't a done deal that students who attended the summer workshop had an "in" to the school. In fact, he told everyone that he may or may not even see their audition, depending on their grades. </p>
<p>From my D's senior class, only two were admitted for Fall '04 and from what I have heard, not sure at all, but we hear that no one was accepted for Fall '05 who attended last summer's workshop. That is only hearsay.</p>
<p>The point is, it can help but it can also hurt to attend these programs. If the director doesn't see improvement, it won't bode well. All only my opinion.</p>
<p>So glad to see you here. I just got back from my third and final trip to St Louis/the MUNY and while there I asked my D if she knew if your D was in Italy and she said she was. I had been thinking about her and the fact that you are going over to see her and feeling very jealous as I was flying into 103 degree heat in the Midwest! I hope you will either post here or email to let me know how she's doing and how your visit goes. What a great experience - for both of you!! Travel safe and give her our best!!</p>
<p>And theatermom, I was just thinking about YOU and wondering if you had been out to see more shows after Beauty and Beast (I knew you had planned on it but did not recall the timing). Would love to hear about the shows and also aboug Goukla's D's adventures in Italy! These kids are doing some very cool things!</p>
<p>Vocaldad - When I spoke of OCU's program above, I failed to answer your question about college admissions. The kids from camp do go again to audition for college. We were NOT told that the camp would substitute for an audition, although I think I read that they accept video taped auditions.</p>
<p>We know a few people who post on CC who previously went to the OCU summer program and who then were admitted for the college program. I strongly believe this is NOT a guarantee. Being at the summer program allows the faculty (the very same ones who teach in and head up the college program) to evaluate not only the talent but also the work ethic of a student. I believe this could absolutely work for or against a student in the college admissions process. This is probably true at any of the summer programs.</p>
<p>Hopefully ocuMTinfo can confirm these thoughts. I hope I'm not misleading anyone with these thoughts that are just based on my perception.</p>
<p>Something that stuck with me from Dr. Herendeen's talk at orientation is that he doesn't want students who are jerks, no matter how talented they are. They take pride in being a "family" and want everyone to treat others with respect. He ranks "not being a jerk" right up there with being able to sing and act. My guess is that this area is being evaluated as they watch the students during the summer program. He also said at the orientation that he uses the program for recruiting purposes and also wants the prospective students to be able to evaluate their program for college during the summer camp.</p>
<p>My head swims with the events since D left for Italy. Every flight she had was delayed for many different reasons which made her miss her final connection with the people from the Daniel Ferro Vocal Program all together! This kid got herself from Detroit to Paris to Florence, to a bus station in downtown Florence and finally to Greve, Chianti all by her 18 year old self. Her father and I had no idea where she was for almost 20 hours. To say the least it was hard on mom and dad.</p>
<p>All of that bad luck turned into gold as she has had the time of her life. She is working with Daniel Ferro and all of his fabulous colleagues from Germany, Italy, and the USA. She cannot say enough about her vocal coaches (there are three; one from Germay, one from the US and one from Italy) and especially her voice teacher. She has lessons three times a week and coachings almost daily. There are Italian diction and language classes daily and Master Classes almost daily. Master classes run about three hours long, with everyone getting a chance to sing. D calls the classes fascinating, and she says she is learning more than she ever thought she might in such a short time. She loves Italy (who wouldn't) and says it's like being in heaven.</p>
<p>Hubby, son, and I will be going to Italy early next week. We will tour for about a week, then meet up with D in Greve for whatever concerts or recitals there will be. </p>
<p>I guess I'll stop there. I could probably go on forever. I will post again when we get home by the middle of August.</p>
<p>Congratulations to both of your D's summer performances. Our kids sure are fortunate to be able to experience what I never dreamed about at their age.</p>
<p>Thanks for your good thoughts! I am sending mine right back to you all.</p>
<p>Gkoukla, wow, just from that description, it sounds like the most amazing experience for a young singer! She has likely learned so much! And to be in Italy and on her own and the whole experience, unforgettable! </p>
<p>I hear ya on the nervousness of her travel and how she made it there on her own and all your concern and not knowing. That would do me in, for sure. I get worried even now waiting for my youngest (16) to call to let me know she is leaving the city where she has spent the evening (crazy message on my machine that the professional musical production she went to see was not good and they left part way through to go to the movies...) and driving home alone 25 miles and until she gets here, ya know how that goes. So, imagine half way across the world, yikes. But like your 18 year old, I let my 18 year old go on an adventure this summer quite on her own as well involving much travel. She was not alone like your D when traveling but I did let her drive with two other 18 year old girls 6000 miles to Alaska. I tried to stay calm and am pretty proud of myself for doing this and letting go. She is quite responsible and called each day as they reached their destination. Still, it's our job to worry, right? When they lived at home, I knew just about their every move but not any more! I'm sure my younger one can't wait for that, LOL, when she moves to NYC in one month. I hope I can live through it :D. </p>
<p>Anyway, it is very exciting what your D is doing and also that your whole family is getting to go there to see it. Italy....poor you guys, ha! I have not been there since I was 17 myself. My sixteen year old got to go to Italy on a school trip a year ago. I'd sure like to be in these kids' shoes. Have the most wonderful time. </p>
<p>Thanks for asking! I just returned this afternoon from my last of three trips to watch my D work in the ensemble of three shows at the Muny in St Louis. What an amazing experience - for me to see her work, but more importantly for her to do the work. She has three more performances of the last show, Mame, and then she'll be coming back home after the most intense and most rewarding summer of her life so far. She has been challenged and nurtured, pushed, mentored and had her hard work rewarded. She has made some wonderful friends with MT students in other top programs and had the privilege of getting to know many top notch Broadway performers and working with incredible creative teams (choreographers, music directors, designers, directors etc.). She has not had a full day off on 8 weeks! - rehearsing one week, performing the next week. But as a newly minted Equity performer in an Equity house she will tell you that she has been well paid, she has always felt protected and has been treated with respect. She is very happy that she made the decision to accept her Equity card.</p>
<p>For me, sitting in the audience of 11,000 people, watching my daughter as happy as she can be, doing what she loves along side so many talented professionals was really an out of body experience. I can't help it - I still think of her as my little girl! I guess a part of me always will. But this summer made it clear to me that she was and is ready to start swimming in a bigger pond. She will be the first one to tell you that of all the things she learned this summer, the most important thing is just how much she still has to learn. She was disappointed to see that not all professionals always behave in a professional manner but that disappointment has been tempered with the inspiration of seeing other professionals whose credentials might suggest that they could "mail in" a performance (or two or three) in rehearsal, instead come prepared to work every day and give all they have, all the time. I know she is leaving this experience eager to return to school and work even harder (and believe me, she has always been a HARD worker) and make the most out of the educational opportunities she has been afforded. She has gotten great feedback about her work this summer and about how much they have seen her grow. I know she will also audition for other opportunities next summer because there are no guarantees, but she would be thrilled to work there again next summer. </p>
<p>For those of you who might be interested in such things, along with the St. Louis natives who work at the MUNY each summer (as a municipal institution, they are required to hire some number of local performers - I don't know how many for sure), many of the top MT programs were represented in the ensemble over the course of the summer. Ensemble performers are hired for as many as three shows or as few as one. As far as I know (and I didn't see every Playbill) this summer the majority were from hired CCM (10), UM (9) and one or two each from CMU, PSU, BOCO, Webster, Indiana and AMDA.</p>
<p>Gkoukla,
Your D's experience in Italy sounds thrilling. I know she will come home with marvelous memories and much richer for the educational gifts she has been given. I pinch myself regularly in gratitude for the opportunities my D has had and I know you do as well. We can't wait to hear your post travel report.</p>