I am curious to hear people’s opinions on whether or not to submit test scores this year. My daughter is applying ED1 to Swarthmore next month.
She has an ACT score of 33.
In 2021 Swat’s median was 34 with 33 being the 25% and 35 being the 75%.
BUT that was after at least one year of Swat being test optional. So those percentages are not representative of the total matriculants but rather they represent the matriculants that choose to submit scores. In 2021 only 60% of matriculants submitted scores.
Because of that the median has shifting upwards. In 2019 when every matriculant had to submit scores the median was 33 and the 25% and 75% were 31 and 35.
My thinking is with all that said, a 33 is still a score that, all things considered, probably helps the application.
For context my daughter has a 4.0/4.6 gpa and has taken a ton of AP classes. She currently is taking 8 AP courses her Senior year (Calc BC, Chemistry, English, Latin, German, Spanish, Government, and Art). With that context I think the 33 shows that the GPA is not a fluke.
Interesting the Swat English ACT shows higher than math. Last year math was 30-35 while English 34-36.
60% submitted. It’s noted two rungs down on the CDS in matters of importance and equal to race. The school is very diverse - caucasians made up 32% of last years entering class followed by non resident alien.
So I hate to say it like this as I know I’ll get blowback , but I’d be more hesitant to submit an under the average score if I was Caucasian.
The problem with the SAT data is that you don’t know who didn’t submit those scores. This year’s Princeton freshman survey revealed that 40% of athletes did not submit scores, compared to only 8% of non athletes.
My comment was made on those with hooks not submitting … I don’t like how it comes off when I say but my belief is it’s reality. So if I’m Caucasian, I wouldn’t submit. If I’m not I would.
I’m saying if you are unhooked you better raise, not lower the average!!
We don’t know anything about OP besides what they shared.
Interesting…I hadn’t fully considered race. My daughter is Caucasian. NOT an athlete. Not a legacy…really has no hooks with the exception of being a Classics/Medeival studies person which is pretty rare these days…
I agree that 33 shouldn’t hurt. But it’s lowering the average and they will not want an unhooked student doing that IMHO. On another I’m telling someone at Northwestern that a 32 should go in bcuz they have a hook.
Honestly Swat would be a tough admit in your case even with a 36 but then you wouldn’t have needed to ask the question.
It’s a tough call. I lean against. You’ll never know why you are rejected …but the reality is she will be…it’s not her….the far majority there will be and that’s why you have targets and safeties just in case.
The major won’t help as they admit to the school and not the major.
Best of luck.
Ps. It’s tough. In our case my daughter decided. Had a 32 and used it at 20/21 bcuz she was proud of it. I mean it’s 95th percentile plus so the discussion is crazy. Went TO at Rice. Rejected Her call. Likely didn’t change anything. Same result I’m sure either way. These kids work hard and a 33 is unreal. But yet for swat it’s not. But of course you want to use it but should you ??
You should only apply to schools that are test mandatory. This way there’s no question
I disagree with @tsbna44 re the major. If she is clearly pointy in that direction it will be relevant and in her favor. Swat is TOUGH, but I think her chances are as good as any assuming she has ECs that are relevant etc. Honestly, after having gone through this process last year I decided that being pointy in Humanities and you can build your application around that, you can stand out a little.
While I vote for submitting the score, I am assuming that no section is particularly low (do you have to disclose the breakdown?) Another thing to look at is her HS profile - how does her ACT compare? It’s all about context.
Whichever decision you make, should it not work out, do not dwell. It will not be “because” of the score one way or the over.
The Admissions person I spoke to at Swat suggested that major has a major sway in the ED process. According to her, they use the ED process to ensure that their departments have enough students to survive. She used Dance as an example. Appreciate both your perspectives.
She is definitely building her app around her Language proficiency and interest in the Ancient and Medieval world. Swat is particularly appealing because of how good their Medieval Studies program is. Her ECs are good. I would say they are quality over quantity (Governors School for Latin this last summer, Academic Team, Spanish Tutor for ESL kids…).
Talking to him this week. Before she actually got this score he suggested a 33 would be borderline. She goes to a very good public High School. We are in Charlottesville VA and thats a great system.
If an admissions counselor said this about major than go with that but it’s counter to what they publish.
I know some say you can ask admissions if you should submit. People point to BU specifically. So you might ask. We did and the answers were vague 100% of the time but maybe you’ll get lucky. As it is, it’s two rungs below gpa/act in regards to importance as is the activities if you believe their common data set. The essay and recs are top level important.
Good luck either way. I hope she finds the right school whether it’s Swat or otherwise.
Good discussion IMHO
Edit u answered my suggestion in your note to @Mwfan1921
Agree…always love the discussion on this site. Swat is always going to be a reach for anyone…its just the way it is. Carleton and Grinnell are next on her list followed by Midd, Wes, Macalester, Haverford and William and Mary. WandM is a state school for us which makes it cheaper and easier to get into…that one should be relatively safe. So, I am not concerned…she has an amazing list and I would be happy with any of them.
Mary Washington ? One rank rates it #1. I know no one would realize. All you mentioned are outstanding. No uva ? Dad doesn’t want to see her every weekend :). She’ll have great choices from the list you provided. And maybe even some merit from Mac or Grinnell !!! Best of luck.
Edit and I don’t know but maybe worth researching - can Bryn Mawr be a back door into classes at Swat/Haverford ?
Regarding the ACT breakdown, no she is pretty consistent across the board. She is clearly a Humanities kid, but she has a real strong Stem background. She’s in Calc BC and AP Chem this year and did AP Physics II last year…So no dip in the math or science.
UVA is pretty much everything she DOESN’T want from College which is fine by me. Its very Frat centric.
I have seen that article about Mary Washington and it actually started a fiesty debate in another thread I started about Classics majors. Mary Washington is ultimately not a great school. I put it 6-7 in VA for Public Schools and 8-9 once you throw in the privates. They may have a great classics program but I can’t imagine they are producing graduates who are getting into elite PHD programs. That is ultimately what my kid thinks she wants…
From what I can tell Grinnell’s financial aid will be the same as the other elite SLACs. Mac is a step down though and I do think she could get something additional from them. She absolutely loved both of those schools.
Added to my last note about bryn Mawr ? Has classics and can participate at Swat / Haverford. Might it be worthy of investigation ? A much easier admit.
Yes Bryn Mawr could be a way into those other schools. The quaker consortium is those three and Penn. You can register for any class at any school if you go to one of those four. Bryn Mawr is on the list…just down a bit further.
