agree with you, but your second observation about not knowing what goes on inside a coach’s head demonstrates that your husband’s comment about the cream rising to the top probably applies to top D1 athletes, but certainly not to academically selective D3 schools, with hundreds of qualified candidates all bombarding emails.
This is misguided.
D1 coaches are bombarded with just as many emails as d3 coaches.
D3 coaches must also win in order to keep their jobs. They are looking for talent just as much as d1 coaches are.
If your daughter isn’t getting the interest she hoped for – and your posts certainly make it sound as if this is the case – she needs to drop down a level in terms of swimming.
4 Likes
This was previously clearly stated, D24’s priority is to study her major of interest at a selective school with a good fit, and ideally swim competitively on their team. it is not to swim at all cost at whatever school will recruit her, irrespective of fit and/or academic strength.
she’d be likely recruited to several girls schools, but she’s not interested in spending 4 years in a girl school.
This statement is certainly not true about all selective D3 schools. My DS was highly recruited by many elite D3 colleges, and the coaches were reaching out to him, calling and emailing, sometimes immediately, after receiving emails!
As @cinnamon1212 and many other posters have said, your posts are your opinions or feelings about the recruiting process, but until your DD has completed her recruiting journey, you should not be making statements about how it runs because it may confuse others reading in the future. You should be reading posts, asking questions and seeking advice from other people on here who have navigated this process. Over the past few years I found a wealth of information on this site to help me better understand what to expect and to help guide my DS.
4 Likes
Surely there are academically selective schools with weak(er) swimming programs? That’s what she should be targeting.
I don’t know swimming, or I would suggest some. I know men’s soccer, and there are great, selective, academic schools where the soccer is pretty weak! It’s all about targeting – finding the sweet spot between the right level of academics and the right level for the sport.
2 Likes
Regarding emails that grab attention - no experience with swimming as my recruited kids (as well as the kids on the team for which I was the recruiting coordinator) were not swimmers, but you want something that grabs the coaches’ attention. Grad year, swim time, SAT/ACT score (if high), GPA. That all should go in the subject line as well as athlete’s name.
Emails should not be generic in nature, coaches want to see you know a little something about their program and about their school. The emails absolutely, and in no way, should look like a parent typed it up. College coaches are very tuned in to this and if it sounds like it was written by a parent then it will most likely get deleted. Keep in mind that not just the HC should be on the email. Assistants, even grad asst coaches, should be included. The HC might not be the first one to screen the initial email.
For subsequent emails or after coach replies, keep replying to the initial email so the coach will see how many conversations the athlete has had with the them on the email chain.
Honestly, at this point, I’d also have my kid cold-calling coaches in addition to the emails. It’s getting pretty late in the process for a ‘24.
Also, in regards to some sports, athletes can call a coach before the NCAA contact date for their class but in most cases the coach will still not be allowed to discuss recruiting at all with the athlete.
2 Likes
Are you saying some parent could write a check to a coach or sports program to help their kid get recruited.
Just checking for clarity.
1 Like
And that is ok. So if her hurdle is no school less selective/prestigious than McGill (where it sounds like she’s interested and may meet GPA/test requirements) then that is her choice.
I don’t know what this means (how can she be recruited if she doesn’t want to go to that school?), but if a coach from a school she has no interest in reaches out to her she should politely say something like ‘thanks for reaching out, but the school is not a good fit’. That’s it, no long explanation necessary.
Under no circumstances should she continue discussions with that coach (assuming she’s certain she doesn’t want to attend that school), because that would waste everyone’s time.
3 Likes
As a parent who went through recruiting for a different sport, this thread strikes me as 1) potentially very confusing for novice parents and 2) more about the parental mindset than the recruiting process.
All coaches have preferences, theories, and biases that are invisible to recruits and parents and separate from the quantitative athletic results. Coachability, likability, character, leadership, height, body shape, grades, fit with the school, fit with the other athletes, experience with the high school (or country), etc. etc. could be considered by coaches.
I’m sure your child is wonderful and should be recruited by an Ivy League school - but they may or may not be as it’s a random process. it’s best just to do the hard work and see how the process unfolds.
For novice parents interested in recruiting, I would advise finding a different thread on CC for advice.
8 Likes
Make sure your DS knows exactly what she wants and target accordingly. My son was certain he wanted a highly regarded academic school with a low acceptance rate (he was a bit too focused on acceptance rates after a school counselor presentation back in freshman year!) but also a competitive swim team. He absolutely wanted to continue swimming at the same high level he was accustomed to, but not at the expense of the academics, so we researched and targeted appropriately. We created a list and it wasn’t easy to get the perfect combination! As the process continued , he honed in on liberal arts schools specifically, so schools like CMU fell off the list. Next to fall off were highly regarded schools in the South or California because he did not want to go that far away.
You can find the right balance. I am sure being an international applicant/recruit may add intricacies to the process I cannot comment on, but I know there are plenty of swimmers from other countries. The NESCAC male rookie swimmer of the year announced at championships last weekend is from India.
3 Likes
very similar objectives, D24 happy to join both LACs and larger Universities, but not girls schools (Mount Holyoke, Smith, etc), pure STEM (MIT), and pure city campus (NYU).
Thanks much for sharing his journey
If my have changed as this was a few years ago, though for D1 T&F it was July 1st before the Sr. Year. The student could reach out to the coach, though the coach could not initiate contact or call the student back.
Prior to July 1st there was some contact though July 1st AM the phone calls and contact came in from a # of schools/coaches. We knew of a few that seemed to have interest though there were a # of top schools and programs that we had no idea that we were even on their radar, and were at or near the top of the list.
I imagine similar to swimming, T&F is a little easier for coaches to scout and recruit as it is not subjective. The times, distances, etc. speak for themselves. There are of course other important factors, such as academics, the school fit for the student, how much of an upside in the student athletes further development do they perceive ,what the teams needs for certain events, etc.
3 Likes
The rules are determined by sport. And there are some sports that take the rules far more seriously. So the “the coach can’t call but can accepts calls” is only possible in some sports.
1 Like
This used to be the date for swimming. I imagine like T&F, it was a much better date given the development that happens in Jr year. I also don’t believe most are ready/mature enough to choose a school.
I believe all sports are now June 15th after sophomore year. From what I understand this was an effort to curb the earlier each year recruitment of lacrosse players, basketball players etc. The end of Jr year sports were moved back - a casualty of a “well meaning” plan.
I have yet to meet a swim coach who is happy with this new timeline. Switches in commitments will happen more often (I know of three high profile swimmers this year). Athletes transferring (or just walking away from the sport like at UT) will become more common.
ETA - According do this calendar it looks like there is a small variation with a small number of sports. https://ncaaorg.s3.amazonaws.com/compliance/recruiting/calendar/2022-23/2022-23D1REC_OtherSportsRecruitingGuide.pdf
3 Likes
The coaches’ association sets the dates (at least they did for lax). The Lacrosse coaches had asked for recruiting dates for years, but the NCAA would not get involved so finally the coaches set the date of Sept 1 of junior year. Before that, more than a handful of freshman would commit and many sophomores were committed before the spring season even started.
The NCAA does set the NLI date, and now handles the transfer portal and the recruiting rules about that.
After 2-3 emails, if there isn’t a response then it isn’t because the email wasn’t viewed, it is because the coach isn’t interested. Coaches don’t just trash emails of players that could potentially help them keep their job. Put races and times in the subject line. NiVo, you seem to be trying to come up with reasons (sometime elaborate reasons) to why a kid won’t get recruited - ultimately it is because the they aren’t good enough to fill a void in a program that’s I’ll help a coach win. Swimming for well know programs or coaches could help a student get a first or second look or be a tie breaker when all else is equal - but not because the College is doing a favor but because of if an athlete comes from a highly respected program college can safely assume they have been training with coaches who know how to prepare kids for college athletics.
Times sports is easy in the sense that it is less subjective - times get you noticed and then times get you phones calls and then the other factors start to come into play. Email, email, email and track responses (including no response because it is often a response).
4 Likes
Regarding your daughter’s email and no response…at this point and given the schools you are targeting it is very possible that the coach already have a student tagged for that spot so regardless of your daughter’s times and seemingly competitiveness within the current roster of that coach has a verbal commitment for that spot and therefor no longer needs what your daughter can provide. Ask the coach if they are still recruiting for her year and races and move on to other schools
1 Like
D24 is very much behind other athletes in the process, and may not be fast enough to contribute what many coaches are seeking, in which case she’ll apply to college along with other normal students, and her ED/EA/RD school list will just focus on academics and fit.
As many people have said, times remain a principal driver of which emails get picked by coaches, so we’re hopeful that coach(es) will find value in her times. at this juncture, there is little else D24 can do besides emails & phone calls.
4 Likes
Probably because coaches are less busy after conference championships, email traffic tempo is picking up. D24 hopes PBs at spring meets will accelerate her discussions
Actually, boys and girls lacrosse are both September 1st of Junior year.
1 Like