I think they previously mentioned using the Wall Street Journal /Times Higher Education rankings? Below is the 2022 list for LACs.
F&M is at #28 in this list, Trinity College is at #37, and Oberlin is at #41, so not a lot of big differences from US News. The OP earlier dismissed even considering Willamette which is at #52, so who knows what their cutoff threshold for perceived “prestige” is?
Interestingly, it states “While previously we have used results from the US Student Survey for the ranking, we were unable to conduct a survey in 2020 and 2021 because of the coronavirus pandemic. Instead, we have used data from the 2019 survey to inform this year’s ranking.”
the OP mentioned much earlier that there was a significant grant given from their country to students who attend “top 100” schools abroad…not sure if that is part of the reliance on rankings - especially when the difference between 50-75 and 75-100 is really splitting hairs, and even more so on a LAC ranking where the difference is truly minuet between 30-70. fit and programming is really much more important when distinguishing between schools
Setting aside any interpretation of the tone of @YoLo2’s comments, the content is valuable and I would appreciate it if it were directed towards me. As the OP is an international family, it is probably very helpful to get these suggestions of lesser known US schools. Perhaps there is still an opportunity to find a school where she can both swim and be challenged academically.
I do hope that OP’s D is taking a close look at schools with regards to major/vibe and gets past whatever notions of prestige she may have.
Another consideration for timing and the importance of casting a wide net early on, a recent post stated (see link below) “I don’t know how many prereads track and field gets; the Middlebury soccer coach told parents that he has 50 preread spots.”
Some D3 programs like Middlebury will be making official offers in early July right when pre-read results come back (and likely have already made unofficial offers to their top targets) and will wrap up recruiting with verbal commitments shortly after that.
Other programs that are ranked lower academically, athletically, or both will want to wrap up their recruiting on a similar timeline, but in reality may not get things settled until early fall. In that case they’ll still have a large pool of recruits they submitted initially for pre-reads. They might submit other recruits for pre-reads on a rolling basis later in the summer. But it’s unlikely they’d submit someone who wasn’t on their radar and in conversations for months beforehand unless their times are literally blowing others out of the water.
It’s still possible in early May to get on initial pre-read lists for some places (others are already closed out), but time is rapidly running out.
Yes, you stated that before. That wasn’t the point of my post. The point was to use the reported number of pre-reads for a specific sport there (T&F) as an illustration of the dynamics of the nature and timing of the recruiting process at selective D3 schools.
@shmom41: only the coach can tell if “closed” is a polite way of saying not interested, but D24 would be #1-#4 in several cuts amongst their current team. So they either had an exceptional recruiting season to make such a call before D24 completes her upcoming meets, or they may have taken some legacy candidates. again, only the coach would know the bottom of it. it’s all fine with us, at least it’s clear and we move on. Middleburry isn’t a school on D24’s non-recruit college list, so she will not pre-read, recruit, consider walk-on, apply.
@Lkunk498: new Wesleyan coach was announced, and then somewhat shockingly dropped out. In D24’s case, will pursue the school, but it would be significantly more difficult if they were to hire a NESCAC coach who comes with a bunch of his own recruits. As it stands, D24’s times are very strong amongst the Wesleyan team, and she would be expected to qualify for pre-reads & hopefully recruit slot https://twitter.com/swimswamnews/status/1653480243280134153
@Momofthree24 thanks for support and understanding where we’re coming from. Constructive sharing is what it’s about
To that point… did you see the announced Dartmouth class? I was quite impressed by their pick ups. The coach is well on her way to rebuilding the program. It will be interesting to see how they do with the 24s. And, yes, that explains the apparent “lofty” goals for 24s.
Please refrain from assuming that Schools that have already given all their pre read slots or have verbal commitments for 2024s are doing something strange or out of line like a group full of legacies or amazing stats kids dropped in their lap. The reality is there are hundreds of really talented and intelligent kids out there and when a coach finds a right fit for their program - a kid who will fill their need to be successful the next four years, they will commit to that kid and don’t wait around for another equally talented kid - they won’t swap like for like if they already have their word. Will they save a spot for a power 5 d1 talent that may drop to d3 in late summer or early fall, yes. But in this case, when you are hearing full it’s because that coach found their final group of players already, that’s it, nothing more and nothing less.
Does #3 or #4 even “count” much for recruiting attractiveness anyway? Aren’t those are usually swimmers filling out lanes for head-to head meets who aren’t swimming their primary stroke/distance?
My quick back-of-the-envelope analysis a few posts up seemed to suggest that current times in the top two in at least one event (maybe more?) based on current roster times would be the threshold for attracting recruiting attention. It may also be that it’s easier to find a lot of recruits with similar 100m freestyle times and that other stroke/distance specialists are consequently more “valuable”.
In order to better target programs that might have an interest, that type of thing should have been nailed down more firmly months ago based on conversations with coaches and people familiar with the swimming recruiting landscape. Again, I know nothing about swim recruiting, but I know what I don’t know.
@TonyGrace: definitely strong recruiting at Dartmouth 2023. Dartmouth was definitely in D24’s “not fast enough” category, together with Tufts, Chicago, JHU… Her friend is being recruited for Dartmouth '24
Anyone that “fills a lane” can score. The coach wants points. #3 could not be swimming their best event but they are the 3rd in that particular event, not just a random swimmer.
A recruit that is a top 3 in 3 events is the equivalent of a recruit that is a starter. That is pretty darn good place to be as a freshman.
Rather than using a crystal ball, you could use actual statements that colleges are making about their recruits that indicate where they fall based on current roster times, and also provide hints about what the programs value.
For example, below are two recent SwimSwam news posts from highly selective D3 schools that showed up at the bottom of the new Wesleyan coach announcement. One common thread: both recruits have current PBs that would place them in the top two in the current roster in at least two events. (The posts don’t bother to mention if they would be in the top 3rd or 4th).
Simons is poised to make an immediate impact when she arrives in Cambridge, especially in the 50 free. Her current best time in the event would have made her the team’s top performer, leading freshman Sonia Seliger by a tenth. She would have also been the 2nd-fastest performer in the 100 backstroke this season, with Augustyn leading in 54.23.
With her commitment, Simons joins Katie Kudela, Christina Beggs, and Camila Pierce in MIT’s incoming class of 2027.
And:
Merodio would have been the team’s 2nd-fastest performer in the 200 freestyle and 400 IM this past season, putting him in a good position to make an immediate impact when arrives on campus…
With his commitment, he joins Arizona native Adam VanLuvanee in the Stags’ class of 2027. VanLuvanee will be attending Harvey Mudd College, and swims IM and freestyle.
Don’t get me wrong, every coach wants a recruit that is better than what they currently have. That doesn’t mean the 3rd best swimmer has no value. I do, however, think that in that case they have to truly be 3rd across multiple events.
In the OP’s case, being 3rd or 4th is great since they are a sprinter, and therefore very valuable for relays (big points).
The challenge for the OP is that they are at a level where there are so many swimmers just as fast. Average excellent.
