Not the exact quote, but generally, whatever level you think your player is at…bring it down two notches and recruit accordingly.
Hardest things for me to accept during the recruiting process, going to ID camps, watching other recruits, etc…
that my player isn’t as good as I thought she was.
no matter how much you want the coaches to like your player and want to play at the school, if they are not into her, they are not into her.
With 1 & 2 in mind, target correctly and move on quickly with the 7 stages of grief. I am sensing a lot of grief here.
Btw, my D was offered a soft tip as a walk-on at a highly rejective school, but with an ED. Probably a small pebble added to the scale, but not worth throwing away full support at another equally highly rejective school. So, ask the coach if they are offering a soft tip to admissions as a walk-on and weigh your options. Good luck.
In years past, swimming was one of the easier sports for a coach to allow walk-ons. By walk-ons, I mean practiced with the team, and if they turned out to be better than guessed, they swam in meets and displaced a higher ranked swimmer on the team. (I don’t know anyone who actually displaced a higher level swimmer on the team, but it was conceivable. ) For their part, they had to attend all practices-- a commitment few recreational swimmers would make.
If they didn’t win a top spot, they’d occassionally swim in a second or third relay team at a home meet or exhibition heat at a dual home meet. They didn’t travel but were welcome to train and improve.
Obviously, easier at smaller schools and constrained by resources, but this happened in relatively recent history (anecdotally - friend’s kids) at NESCAC schools and an Ivy. Goes without saying, no recruitment or coach pull.
It’s possible that there have been rule changes that now prohibit this but it always struck me – particularly D3 - as very much consistent with the ethos of a sport that is all about PB and consistent work.
Does anyone with current swimmers know if this still happens?
My impression is that there are plenty of no support swimmers around, even at top programs.
It’s not as simple as just getting in and being willing to do the work, but if a swimmer is within a certain range of times - you still need to be able to keep up with the intervals - many coaches will have them.
There is more room to walk onto women’s teams than men’s teams. Most men’s teams have strict squad size limits due to Title 9. Women’s teams are limited by budget, pool size, coaching bandwidth, and coaches wanting to maintain high levels of quality, but in general an extra female athlete is usually thought of as a good thing by administration.
“It’s not as simple as just getting in and being willing to do the work, but if a swimmer is within a certain range of times - you still need to be able to keep up with the intervals - many coaches will have them.”
Of course. We’ve all had the experience of clawing someone’s feet (or being clawed!), and it gums up the works.
Agree, and confirming that there are plenty of no support athletes on many teams from D3 to D1.
No support can be quite different from being recruited. Many D1 programs are not fully supported with scholarships (some D1 teams do not have any scholarships) and depending on the school, often many student athletes did not require coaching support to be admitted to the school, and/or this school could have very limited or no coach support with admittance. This does not necessarily mean that they were not recruited, there was just may have been no coach support needed, given or available for admittance.
Thanks for your comments/, color regarding the availability/training requirements/race potential for walking-on a team.
If a swimmer isn’t recruited, he/she
will not participate in races as a team member (of course, there are exceptions of walk-ons who become core members of a team). The dynamic of training but not attending swim meets with the rest of the squad isn’t for everyone, and it certainly isn’t what D24 is seeking. Her primary objective in college is to develop in the academic field she’s passionate about, ideally as a member of the swim team.
There are only 3 scenarios which requires a decision for a non recruited athlete:
a college with a good academic fit, no walk-on
a college with a weaker academic fit with walk-on, and coach promised spot on the team
a college with a weaker academic fit with walk-on, no spot on the team
Everyone makes their choices, but D24 has zero interest in #3 over #1 or #2
Does participating in summer meets make any difference to coaches, besides showing additional times? (in past she would participate in her in country Nationals)
Would such meets be of value, given it would already be somewhat late in the recruiting season, certainly after pre-reads and right before submission of early applications for RD/EA, by which time most commitments have been made
13-16 Jul Speedo Sectionals, Roseville
26-29 Jul USA Swimming Futures Championships, Sacramento
2-5 Aug ICSA Age Group Championships, St Petersburg
Only as another opportunity to show time improvements. The coaches don’t care where it happens. It does not matter to them if it’s at the big championship or at a small local meet.
As for timing, pre reads do not equal offers. The slower teams on your list will still be working on their rosters through the summer. A breakout summer can also changed things. Early in the fall a swimmer change his commitment from Duke to Stanford. Just recently another ‘23 swimmer changed from GTech to Navy.
Most swimmers will focus on one or the or the other - you can’t peak for so many weekends. I don’t think summer sectionals are as big. Around here the focus is sectionals in winter and futures in summer. If you are not at that level you go to Zones (or in our case we chose to go to zones because it was overall a better meet for us - most of the training group went to NCSAs).
“Age Group” meets are for 14 and under. In the US you usually swim in these divisions.
Age Group: 8 and under, 9-10, 11-12, 13-14
Senior: 15 and over - it can be very difficult to stand out and make finals once you hit 15 and are going agains 18yo.
“Junior” meets are open to anyone 18 and under.
Some meet are “Open” and anyone can compete. This is the case with Zones and I think Sectionals and Futures. At some of these they will “protect” reserve the slowest heat of finals for Juniors only. Sometimes older swimmers can’t participate in relays.
Thanks for feedback, correction the meets would be 2 of:
13-16 Jul Speedo Sectionals, Roseville
26-29 Jul USA Swimming Futures Championships, Sacramento
25-29 Jul ICSA Summer Senior Championships, St Petersburg
Understood that these meets would be late in the recruiting season, at a stage when most pre-reads/support/commitment have already been locked. It seems that that the late changes made in late summer/fall by coaches/swimmers remain unique exceptions rather than the rule.
D24’s objective remains to follow the regular schedule of pre-reads, support, commitment prior to the ED application round. She has managed to find couple D3 teams where she would place at the top of the current squad, together with attractive academic fit.
Yes. There are some amazing D3 schools with great/fun teams that aren’t as fast. As we said, there is a swim home for almost every one.
I really can’t advise on the meets beyond what I already said. Maybe someone will chime in with their experience, but with our team those meet decisions are pretty much up to the coaches. For the most part we just follow their advice and the schedule they set for each group.
I’ll say one last time - the meet itself is 100% irrelevant. It’s the times that count.
ETA - a strong summer can absolutely help close the deal for a swimmer.
@nivo you may want to subscribe to an app called Meet Mobile. This is how everyone gets live meet results. You can follow specific swimmers or teams or check out any meet as it happens.
Thanks for flagging/clarifying, the question is not meant to be about a specific individual, so personal/school information of any athlete was removed.
The question itself remains of interest, and indeed collective feedback is sought:
"Would a University which is Top 3 in a D1 conference recruit an athlete whose times would not be Top 4 on its team, nor make the final 16 at the most recent 2023 Conference Championship?
Numerous knowledgeable comments in this thread specifically mentioned that coaches seek the best fit athletes, particularly in a sport like swimming where times are of critical nature.