OOHH – you’re CO, right? were you there when Missy Franklin was swimming?
No. But it’s always amazing to see talent like that when they are young!
That doesn’t make any sense to me.
Why would the AO say your daughter had passed their official pre-read in August and then suddenly change the decision less than 1 month later? I can’t think of any academic justification for the change of opinion. Nothing in her academic record could have changed in that one month period (August).
I have never heard of anything like that happening.
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Missy is the same swimming age (one school year ahead) as one of my kids, and every other year for my other kid. Let’s just say my kids never swam against her at the club state meets (she was at another club) as mine never made it to the state meet. These were just the little neighborhood swim (and tennis) clubs around town for the summer. She started her swimming career just like the rest, swimming Friday meets. Nothing like the big California swim teams. The most important thing at these meets was eating junk food and candy.
Several kids from our team and school classmates did swim with her in high school. My nephew (same age) was in the boys school and she was at the girls school. The coaches often moved MIssy around to different strokes and events to give others a chance to win, and she could swim any event and earn points for the team. As described above, the coaches move them around to score the most points for the team even if it isn’t their prime stroke.
And to add, I also think the OP’s daughter is at a disadvantage, with her best event being the 100 free. All the kids swim that event multiple times a year as age grouper’s, and many are really good at it. Better the kid specializing in the 400 IM or the 200 fly - as it is much more of a niche. Sort of like being an obscure tax attorney; no one else wants to do it!
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My D used to call it the 200 die! Fly was her stroke, but the 200 is a whole other level of toughness!
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Agree with this. And while both the 50 and 100 free are valuable for relays, most swimmers who specialize in either the 100 back or 100 fly also have really fast sprint free times. Thus the coaches have more flexibility with moving their chess pieces to maximal advantage.
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Exactly. Even a good distance freestyler can put down a fast 100 and round out a relay. Sprint free style is hardly even a gap that needs to be filled.
These are all nuances of swim recruiting that most international swimmers aren’t familiar with. Some of this was touched on early on, but OP did not engage/seemed dismissive of this information.
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LC 2 Fly is pretty much as miserable as it gets.
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Curious about why a test optional school would require a specific score.
I have theories but I don’t know.
Many schools require test scores as part of the pre-read and then advise the athlete to submit or not. TO is not all in the benefit of the student, schools useit to artificially increase the published average score.
Often the pre-read is based only on stats and test scores probably have value in legitimizing good grades. In the case of this particular school I believe the coaches are under pressure to bring in high stats athletes to average out their D1 athletes. I have no idea what the bar is there - are there any Lax folks here who know? - but it’s a reasonable guess that it is not the same. It’s not unusual for sports to have different academic requirements.
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They are doing pre-reads with a minimum of info - grades through junior year and ? No essays, no (final) class profile, no LORs. Requiring a test score at least gives them one more point to look at.
I don’t think JHU (if that’s the school you are discussing) has much lower standards for lax players. Most are coming out of very competitive prep schools. My friend who was an average student but a fantastic lax player couldn’t even consider JHU, Yale, ND.
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That’s true. But those too hold athletes to a different standard. At the end of the day everyone needs to keep up academically, I just can’t imagine it’s the 1500 or bust that other coaches require to give support. (To be fair, I only know this directly in two sports, but it was the first thing out CC said when the school came up)
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The other coaches may only have 3-4 slots to offer. The lax coaches probably have 10 each. they are also competing against Yale and Penn for the best scholars and the best players. They also have years and years of experience know the type of players/athletes they get in every sport and can require the 1500 in some sports but not others (if they want to be competitive).
And lacrosse is King at hopkins, so those coaches can probably do what they want.
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Agreed.
This is almost certainly worthy of its own thread, since there are so many experiences to share on it, and it’s such a moving target.
Our anecdote: our D25 (in another sport) is in active conversations with coaches at ~10 TO athletic programs - a mix of Ivies, other D1 privates, and D1 state schools. Several of those schools have explicitly said they won’t care about scores at any point in the process; several haven’t discussed it; two have said that we want you to test this Fall and we’d like to see a 1400/31 to have in our pocket if we can use it, but if you don’t make it, that is certainly ok (in one case) and maybe ok (in the other); one has said that we need a 1500/34 by this Fall or we won’t consider you. (I know that last school has recruited athletes in another sport with lower scores or no scores, so as @TonyGrace noted, it can vary within an institution.)
Basically, as parents, we can’t make any assumptions before starting to talk to coaches - school/sport/role all can make a difference.
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Also unrelated, but for all the other non-swimming parents who are reading this, one of our very favorite summer activities has been to go to a friend’s daughter’s club outdoor summer swim meets. It’s like a county fair, we only sort of understand what’s going on but we can stand by the edge of the pool, everyone seems like they’re having a great time, there are food trucks and lots of candy. Highly recommended next summer :).
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For many team sports (including Ivy League teams), D1 coaches give out verbal offers to recruits before there are any junior year grades. For some sports, offers go out as soon as 6/15 after sophomore year. In the not so distant past, verbal offers were given out as early as the summer after freshman year.
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Those are athletic offers, not academic (admissions) offers. No school gives out an admissions offer before their apps for the next cycle are available, or the common app, or the ED apps, etc.
For prereads, the admissions office is looking at the packet (not really an app at that point).
But yes, the coaches are making some decisions about the athlete and then sending the packet over to the AO and asking if that student will likely be admitted when they submit the full application.
We had a kid on my daughter’s team who had been on the recruiting list since sophomore year, but when senior year came along, she didn’t pass the pre-read. The coach didn’t have enough experience to know the the grades and score (and probably rigor) weren’t good enough.
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True. But our personal experience is that the vast majority of rising juniors who commit to verbal offers from high academic D1 schools end up matriculating there.
It makes no sense for a coach to give out verbal offers 1-2 years in advance to recruits and not feel confident that the vast majority will pass the eventual pre-read and actual admissions process. For many schools and for multiple sports, all of the team’s available spots for their recruiting class are filled long before the first semester junior year report card is released. Recruiting is like playing musical chairs. On September 1, all of the chairs are still available. By December, many of the best chairs are gone. A coach who loses a commit because the athlete didn’t pass the pre-read process will be hard pressed to find a similar quality replacement later on. Losing several commits because of unexpected pre-read attrition would be a recruiting class disaster.
Similarly, it makes no sense for a recruit to commit to a school in advance without any assurance that the offer is solid. Blue chip recruits have plenty of offers to choose from, including offers from less academically but more athletically competitive schools. Why would a blue chip recruit agree to an offer that isn’t a near certainty? Commits are supposed to shut down their recruiting process when they accept a coach’s offer,’which means they are giving up on all of their competing offers. If a D1 commit doesn’t pass the eventual pre-read process, it’s unlikely that those other formerly interested programs will still have a spot for that athlete. Commits are usually told in advance what test scores (if any), class rigor, and GPA are needed to successfully pass through the admission’s process.
College coaches at high academic D1 schools have a very good idea which rising juniors will get through their school’s admissions process (with their athletics hook). They usually won’t bother trying to recruit an athlete who is likely to have trouble getting in, unless that athlete is a potential superstar (top of their recruiting rank list). That makes the risk more acceptable.
This has been our experience. YMMV.