I know someone who did something like your plan, and it did not stop them from getting into elite schools, but it was more than a decade ago. Basically, the parents declared that they were homeschooling the child in the subject, and gave official grades. They drew from a variety of different curriculum resources, as homeschoolers tend to do, and the child did master the subject to an appropriate level. Since homeschooling is legal in our state, the high school had to accept the credit (it was a public school though), and the colleges apparently accepted it too.
A resource to learn more about exactly how to do this might be local homeschooling families in your area. Also I agree with a call to a few colleges.
It sounds as though your student is aiming very high for colleges and also wants STEM. Over the course of D21&23 application years, I have toured/attended live admissions sessions for the vast majority of T20s and top LACs too. These top schools say over and over that they want applicants who have challenged themselves in all areas in HS, by taking the hardest level courses offered by the HS, and many specifically mentioned they want you to challenge yourself in areas you do not favor as well as course areas you love. Most of them specify this on their websites too, under “what we look for” or “how do I prepare for ___”. But they really emphasized it in person. It is eye-opening, as sometimes on CC the general recs can be take what you are interested in and don’t worry about having the highest level all the time: which is great advice for the vast majority of wonderful colleges out there, but does not fit with what the tippy-top ones want.
They are not saying that it is nice and best for applicants to have this but they consider those who don’t just the same. They are saying that challenging oneself across all 5 core areas is the expected minimum bar. Even among the tens of thousands of students who hit that minimum bar and make almost or all As, and have all the rest (great LOR, impactful ECs,) very few will be admitted.
One Engineering school specified on their handouts at the tour that they like to see 6 core courses per year for some of the years, 5 is just the minimum. So they expect students to double up in core courses if possible within their HS curriculum.
If you want a serious shot at top20 type schools and especially for T10, take ForeignLanguage in HS all 4 years at the highest level offered every year. By all means consider continuing mandarin as an outside-of school intellectual pursuit if your kid loves it. , but also take 4 yrs in the actual HS.
Just as a data point of one, having attended one of these universities that request 4 years of a single language, and having had a unique situation, I asked AOs and my HS counselor, and they presented a wide variety of options for FL study that did not require 4 years. But none of them were to take no FL in HS or to “prove” proficiency through the AP test alone. Although the AP test alone does work for UC (although this bare minimum would likely be insufficient for UCB or UCLA).
Middle school foreign language is usually not considered equivalent to high school foreign language, unless a higher level high school (or college) course is completed.
Regarding outside high school (or college) courses that the main high school does not include on the transcript, they will still be included for college applications, since applicants have to report all high schools (and colleges) attended.
Why cant the student switch to another language? Surely Spanish or French is offered? As other posters note, 4 years of 5 core subjects is the minimum bar for most elites
Absolutely, and we have had one in the last 3 yrs from our school who did 3 FL and is at an ivy. It was also a very unique situation due to an extra science and an outside senior-yr opportunity that the counselor explained, and everything else was in line . I was just trying to point out that in general, to set oneself up best for these types, 4 yrs at the highest level clears the bar across the board.
He could take another language. He just really likes Chinese, and wants to master it. He could take another language at school and Chinese outside of school, but the magnet course load is significantly higher than our local public would be, and he doesn’t want to drop art or some other extracurriculars completely.
He’s still looking at all the options, and of course he’d have to get accepted to the magnet.
My S took FL in middle school and the standard is the kids go into Level 3 in 9th grade (some go into 2 and some go into 4 - no one goes right into AP). Also Algebra 1 in 8th and geometry for some. None of these courses or grades were/are on the high school transcript.
I have a cousin who attended a rural high school that did not offer FL, or else no one told her she needed to take it so she did not. She was VERY limited in college choices, could not go to our public flagship. At the time I remember telling her to take a summer course to get some proficiency. Not sure if taking the Chinese in the summer would work for you?
I’m not sure what you mean by going straight into AP. My assumption is that he’d test into either Chinese 3, or maybe 2 at CTY since their courses are more rigorous, and then take it every year of high school. So, eventually he’d get to AP. Not that he’d jump to AP.
Our county’s high school summer school doesn’t offer Chinese. The community college does, but only 2 years, and a lot of the classes are doing the school day. I could see him choosing to do something like an immersion camp, but I think if his goal is to speak/read/write well he’d need to keep it up through the school year.
Right. The Concordia Language Villages have Chinese, I believe. Maybe inquire whether it would count as high school Chinese 3 if he went for a month. if so, then you might have 3 years of FL which is pretty good for most schools. You’re right about the continuity, so if that’s the goal it wouldn’t be enough, but if it’s just getting colleges to accept the three years he would have taken, maybe it would count.
I’ve looked at that! I think that if we get them to accept anything outside of school, we’re more likely to get them to accept CTY than Concordia. Maybe because Hopkins is in our state and Concordia is far away, I feel like CTY is better known here.
Yeah, I have never heard of CTY, lol. Is that a camp?
Concordia is pretty well known but its location might not be ideal for you.
I bet admissions officers would be happy to tell you how they would address this. You’re asking in time to keep his options open. Maybe pick a couple colleges and ask them.
Another issue to consider is that some colleges/universities still require a FL in college itself (or testing out via the placement exam). Not sure what schools you might think your son wants to attend, but that, too, may be an issue.
D20 goes to a college that requires every student to get through two years of college level FL, or test out of that requirement via placement test. I know some colleges have a 1 year equivalent of college level FL requirement. She had friends and acquaintances who took 4 years of FL in high school who still had to take 1 or 2 semesters at her college to fulfill the requirement after placement exam results.
D23 didn’t want to continue a FL in college and had taken 3 years of Mandarin Chinese in high school. She definitely considered what the FL requirements were at each college she applied to, and how they could be fulfilled.
To be clear, we’re still at the point of making decisions about where to apply for high school. So, he could change his mind. He’s been pretty clear that he wants to be an engineer for a long time, and I think that means that a FL requirement is less likely in college. I know at my college the B.A. kids needed a language and the B.S. kids didn’t.
But if he decides on a different route, I feel as though sticking with the same language (Chinese) from 6th through 12th would make him more likely to pass a placement test than taking 3 years (2 credits) of one and then 4 of another.
CTY is Johns Hopkins University’s Center for Talented Youth. They have online and summer programs. They’ve been around for decades.
OP, my son had the same dilemma. He had taken Mandarin in 6th, 7th, 8th and 9th grades, but his new high school didn’t have Mandarin as an option. He was going to attempt the CTY course and did the course placement exam after 9th grade. Despite getting A’s and A+'s consistently in his school courses, he was assigned to level 1B by CTY. He did not participate and switched to one of the languages offered by the new school.
It sounds like you would have an uphill battle getting any outside courses on your son’s transcript. If you can’t that would endanger his high school graduation in his district. I’d recommend taking one of the foreign languages offered to ensure that he actually graduates. If he plans to apply to a top 20 school, he should take 4 years of foreign language in high school. He can always take a Mandarin course from CTY or another source if he wishes. Those transcripts can be submitted separately to colleges.
Yes…and our DD was very clear about majoring in engineering in college as well. She DID have through level 4 of FL in high school. BUT wait…she decided to pick up a double major….in biology which was in the College of Arts and Sciences…so FL a was then required of her…two years of college FL. She placed out of one year…then tried CLEP tests a couple,of times and was close. Her school agreed she could take on quarter of FL and waived the other two quarters. But she had to jump through a LOT of hoops for that.
My point is…things might change! Better to be prepared.
She said…she learned more in that ONE term of college FL than in all of her years of it prior to HS graduation.
Maybe I missed it up thread, but is there any community college in the state that has an asynchronous Mandarin class that would work. It sounds like you don’t need to meet any requirement for your high school, and my experience has been that universities will accept these Dual Enrollment classes to meet admission requirements. They may or may not allow you to waive the requirements once there, depends on the university.
I’m not sure why it would endanger his high school graduation. The school district is very clear that it’s 2 years and middle school courses count.
As far as college, if he does run into a FL requirement in college, and I agree he could change his mind or find an engineering school with a FL requirement, it seems like he’d be more likely to pass the assessment coming from CTY, not less.
With CTY once you are in you stay in. I agree with PP that he could place lower, and there’s probably some mechanism by which he could flunk out, but at this point he’s eligible to take it, and you don’t lose CTY eligibility.
I can’t imagine taking a language, particularly a tonal one that no one he knows speaks, asynchronously. It seems like he would need to have experience speaking the language to someone who knows whether he’s speaking it correctly. Maybe I’m wrong?
Our local community college has live online Mandarin classes, but they meet during the school day.