<p>@Bartlleby007 I think you are missing the distinction I’m making between studying early and registering early. I concur that students aiming for the top should certainly prep for the PSAT as if they want a 2300+. In fact, I think anybody should prep seriously for the PSAT and begin their overall studying process early Like I said before, I don’t advocate that anybody should procrastinate. </p>
<p>People want a top PSAT score all of the time, but they don’t actually get it. Maybe they think they did all the studying they should have, they get the PSAT score back and find out they were in the 1800 or 1900s. I’ve seen this a lot from people who had studied for months before they came to me. But then they had already signed up and taken the October or November SAT and scored roughly the same, when all along they wanted to break 2200-2300. </p>
<p>That doesn’t mean these people piqued at 1800 or 1900. They were just sorely misinformed about their progress in the fall of junior year, what the whole thing would feel like under actual testing conditions, and perhaps would have benefited from just more time and maturity. </p>
<p>I live in an area where early testing is now the norm. People do it at all score ranges and for all sortss of reasons. The <em>ONLY</em> reason that makes sense to me is like you described: someone who wants to break 2200, and can guarantee 100% they are already in that range. </p>
<p>How many people are in the National Merit range? Less than 1%, right? Isn’t that the definition of the award? My conclusion is thus that probably less than 1% should be taking the test early, if even that many. </p>
<p>Even some of these people who got into the NM range, it could have been a fluke. What is the cost of waiting until January or March? It’s just more time to continue studying and practicing, but mainly maturing and developing more confidence, vocab, writing skills, and so forth. And for a first go at it, it should not interfere with APs. And if you’re second go at it is in May or June, then you shouldn’t need to study much more for the SAT, right? </p>
<p>As I wrote to @Bartleby007, some people think they are in that range, but they are sorely mistaken. I see many students confident that they will get the National Merit Award, find out that they only scored like a 1900, they had already signed up for the October or November SAT and also scored a 1900 on that, and realized maybe their previous study plan was not the best one. </p>
<p>Can you please tell me exactly which type of students you feel would benefit from the early testing?</p>
<p>Op,
My D took SAT and PSAT in the fall of junior year. And it was based on info that I got here on cc.
We looked at the deadlines for midterms (jan), finals (end of May), AP tests (beg of May), PSAT (Oct) and SAT2s (May or June). Everything was so heavy starting in Jan.
D decided to take PSAT in Oct and SAT in Nov and self studied during the summer. Benefits are that you are studying once for 2 tests so it’s more efficient. Funny thing is that the SAT score comes back before the PSAT score.
SAT 2380
PSAT 228 NMF</p>
<p>Some will say that your skills will improve as you mature from Oct to Apr of your Jr year. It may be true depending on the level of math classes that you are in and the rigor of your english classes; you still may be learning the material that will be tested on the SAT. But I think that this maturity is counterbalanced by just not having enough time to study for SAT and for your classes as well (as opposed to studying during the summer mixed in with your part time job or whatever). Also, the “shooting for tippy top score” type of kids already have the smarts to do it in the fall of Jr year. The type of kid who wants to improve a 1800 score will be better served to wait until the spring when maturity of brain will help boost the score. </p>
<p>Another benefit for waiting until spring is if you are not in NMF range. If your PSAT is not in NMF range, you may be better served taking the ACT rather than SAT. Use your soph PSAT score as a guide if your are close. BTW: D soph PSAT was 222 so we knew she was close.</p>
<p>Son’s soph PSAT was 206, so I knew that NMF (220) would be a huge reach. I was not paying attention during the summer and forgot to get him signed up for SAT tutor in summer. So he self studied a moderate amount during Sept for jr PSAT and got 209 (self study scores ranged from 205 to 231, increasing every practice test). Switched to ACT and power studied with a tutor during Jan of jr yr and got 35 (equivalent to 2330 on SAT). It was definitely harder to power study for ACT and study for midterms. Did his score from fall to winter go up due to tutor, brain maturing, or different test (PSAT vs ACT)? I think it was the tutoring and the different test, but hey, it could be the brain maturing.</p>
<p>It IS much easier to study during the summer than during the school year when your classes and ECs are taking up much time.</p>
<p>@satteacher, it’s true you have to be above 99 percentile to make NMSF, but if you’re even close to that, you have a chance. It’s probably worthwhile for anyone in the top 5% or so to give it a serious try. I think there’s a lot of luck involved, not to mention which state you happen to live in. The sort of kid who comes on this site planning out their SAT strategy as a sophomore is fairly likely to be in that group. Also, as others have stated, kids whose math program isn’t advanced (and those are unlikely to be high scorers) will benefit from waiting to complete junior year math instruction.</p>
<p>Apparently early testing worked well for YoHoYoHo’s family as well as for mine. As far as SAT brain maturation goes, my daughter got the exact same PSAT score as a sophomore and a junior so I think her brain was already done.</p>
<p>As far as all that improvement from the instruction they are getting in school during those few months, I just don’t see how that makes such a big difference, except perhaps if they are doing focused SAT essay-writing practice. Actually, I know from the zillions of standardized tests our schools have given that my kids make more progress in reading ability over the summer just reading on their own than they do during the school year. </p>
<p>I think the most important thing really is whether the student feels ready or feels like they are still going to improve. I wouldn’t rush into it if you haven’t had enough time to study or feel like practice test scores are still going up.</p>
<p>Another reason to plan to take it in the fall is that might be motivational to prepping over the summer, when many kids have more time. Kids may be more likely to procrastinate if they feel they have nearly a year to go.</p>
<p>@mathyone I think we are somewhat talking circles around each other. I don’t think I’m disagreeing with you. I think you are confusing my position on early testing with early studying. </p>
<p>I’m trying to say that early testing is ok and early studying is amazing. Or more precisely, early studying is for everybody, but early testing may not be for everybody unless they are 500% confident that they are in the 2200+ range by the beginning of junior year and that very few students are at that point.</p>
<p>I’m just saying that most people are not in that range junior fall so they should continue studying. And some people think they are in that range but aren’t.</p>
<p>I think the danger is that I see a lot of people who think they are in that range when they really aren’t.</p>
<p>If someone is absolutely in that range, then great. Go for it as soon as you hit that range. I don’t care what age or month that is. Like you are saying, if you someone is absolutely convinced they piqued before junior spring and there is nothing possible they can do anymore then go for it. </p>
<p>All I’ve been trying to say is that the early testing (not early studying) trend seems to be doing a lot of damage in my neck of the woods to folks who get caught up in the hysteria and then feel the undue stress of a less than desirable score on their records. </p>
<p>@satteacher, yes, I agree testing early without being fully prepared seems like a bad idea. I’ve tried to talk several students on this site out of just walking in poorly prepared to take the SAT at an earlier than normal time. I agree with you about having the bad scores on the record. I just don’t see why people do this.</p>
<p>However, I am surprised you find so many students who think they are 2200+ and aren’t. Can’t they tell how they are doing from practice tests? </p>
<p>@mathyone You’d be surprised at how many students do not self-proctor before the real thing. I make my students sit for multiple practice tests that I proctor before I let them even register. But these other students who come to me after the PSAT just didn’t do it the right way. Either they were doing full tests in their bedroom in their PJs or they did one section per day or maybe they just did it all untimed. Regardless, it was nothing resembling an authentic proctoring. I’ve had so many students come to me this year telling me only after they fact that they truly thought they were 2200+ in October only to find out they weren’t. It’s just been making me wonder what’s in the water here to make them even consider early testing. It’s such a weird norm here. </p>
<p>Where did this early testing is great for everybody rumor come from? It must be the same person who’s also telling all the mothers around here that “the ACT is by far easier for everybody.”</p>
<p>In all seriousness, I had the sense that hardly anybody did early testing even 5 years ago. Now it seems the norm amongst people who shouldn’t be doing it.</p>
<p>" Either they were doing full tests in their bedroom in their PJs" That’s pretty much what my daughter did. I didn’t look over her shoulder when she was practicing. As far as doing it untimed, that might help some students when they’re beginning to practice, so they can focus on mastery rather than speed, but a kid who thinks an untimed test is a practice test that will give any indication of a score has no idea what they are doing. Isn’t it obvious that time pressure is a significant part of these tests and part of the prep is learning how to pace yourself and work accurately while under the time pressure?</p>
<p>My son sat for his timed practice tests in his sweats or shorts in his bedroom. I timed the first practice test and then he decided he could use a timer app on his phone. </p>
<p>I agree that far too many students use the first sitting as a practice test of sorts. Even assuming those students aren’t applying to schools that require all scores be submitted, I cannot understand the point of taking the SAT w/o having first completed enough practice tests that the scores are in satisfactory range. </p>
<p>I have two very different types of students in my house. One needed the tutor to point out to him how & what to study and once that was accomplished, he could sit and grind through the practice tests and Gruber’s for extra math work. The other will analyze the situation and figure out how to attack the studying. Only after he attempts it himself will I consider a tutor. </p>
<p>Oh the contrast to thirty years ago when we bought that Baron’s book and hoped that carrying it around would somehow transfer the information!</p>
<p>@mathyone @CT1417 Don’t ask me why it’s not obvious to people that they should take practice tests under actual conditions in advance. Students are shocked when I suggest this as if I’m a genius. I live in an area where people get into the 2200s left and right (why there exists some people who early test), but taking 4-hour chunks of time like that is just unheard of by and large. I think simply the idea of self-proctoring in a serious way is just too painful to be conceivable so it is not on people’s radars. I’m just more shocked that not every tutor in the area does this. My hunch is that these tutors don’t want to sit there for 4 hours either. People are just too busy with homework, extracurriculars, twittering, and whatnot to self-inflict testing conditions, and they think they’re in good shape to need it.</p>
<p>I think people look at the SAT like another school in that they don’t take a practice test for that either. They think to themselves “ok, I think I know the material on stochiometry well, I should be able to nail this chemistry test.” The analogue here, “ok, I know my grammar rules well, I should nail this test. I’ve seen a few questions–I’m good” But with the SAT, sometimes these students don’t know they haven’t studied all the grammar rules, or they they are not adequately used to what it’s like on the SAT under timed conditions in the SAT format. Various reasons why it doesn’t translate over despite the confidence.</p>
<p>Anyhow, for one reason or another, I encounter many folks who truly believed they were in the 2200+ range when they were far from it. Their prep was not adequate and they had no idea. </p>
<p>If we didn’t live in a culture of early testing as a norm, they would just take the PSAT and then find out that their score was not as good as they thought it was. They’d panic that they should prep in a more serious way, but without the negative consequences of a less than desirable score on their records. I’ve worked with people get that few-hundred point increase between December and March or December and May. But then they stress out all year needlessly about having that lower SAT score on their Yale application.</p>
<p>Again, all of this would have been completely avoidable if we were not in this early testing culture. I just don’t understand where it came from and why it won’t go away. I understand it’s ok for a few people, but only for very few people. Such few people that it should not be a norm.</p>
<p>@satteacher, I don’t consider oct of junior year to be early for anyone who is seriously preparing for the PSAT anyhow. My daughter didn’t do that much prep after she was done with the PSAT. We don’t get PSAT scores until late January so they aren’t much use in prepping for SAT. If you wait until then to start prepping or even to decide whether to take the SAT or ACT, well, it’s a busy time of year and I just don’t think that is the best idea for students like the OP who were already thinking about this as a sophomore.</p>
<p>@mathyone I think you keep missing my point. I never said to wait until after PSAT scores to begin prepping. I’m not even opposed to starting prep after freshman year. I just don’t see the need to sign up for the test for real until you are certain you are in your score range. </p>
<p>What I’ve been saying since the beginning is that I see people constantly take the test early just for the sake of it. Some trend has emerged where people think they should be taking it early or they will turn into a pumpkin some junior spring or senior fall. They study, take a guess they are ready, and many cases they really weren’t. Had they continued studying instead, their first test on their records would not have been as low as it actually was.</p>
<p>I’m not saying nobody should test early. But just that not everybody is in their score range by junior fall. And lots of juniors do progress rapidly over that year with all aspects of the test.</p>
<p>Perhaps that is seldom the case with folks who post here, which tends to be the upper echelon of folks. But I often work with folks who are trying for the National Merit Award, they fall short of it, but they still increase 200-300 points after that with continued studying. That lower score from October and/or November simply did them wrong by following this purported trend that I see at least locally.</p>
<p>@satteacher, “They study, take a guess they are ready,” I think the real problem is that they don’t study very seriously until they get real scores and that is a wakeup call and then you see some improvement. How do the spring scores compare for kids who did and didn’t take a fall test? Your kids who missed National Merit may also have gotten that same call.</p>
<p>@mathyone Of those who are looking at top colleges, I haven’t seen substantial differences in spring SAT scores between between those who tested early (and are retaking it) and those who did not and are taking it for the first time. Just that those who tested early tend to have that lower fall score on their record and seem more dejected about the whole process by the spring.</p>
<p>If anything, on average, the folks who took it in the fall but need to take it again in the spring seemed more overwhelmed with juggling APs, SAT 2s, ACTs, or any other exam in the same season. I think they thought early testing meant no spring testing at all, and they just have a hard time adapting to that.</p>
<p>When students work with from the get-go, I encourage them to not register for an SAT until they are at their score range, as long as we are talking before January/March junior year. And I tell them there’s no shame in planning for 2-3 tries at it. So they go into the whole process mentally prepared for steady increases over junior year, all the while they may take a slight detour for an SAT 2 or AP exam. I don’t see that their essay skills have eroded during the time away. If anything, just the general test-taking fluency seems to make them stronger all around. </p>
<p>I feel like you are finding this so hard to believe. That there can exist folks who can take the test fall of junior year, studied for it, and not score above a 2200. I think this happens to many people who want a National Merit Award.</p>
<p>@mathyone I said from the get-go that these students did not take practice tests under unrealistic conditions. I don’t think practice exams are as popular as you think, as disappointing as that is. The October or November test (and PSAT) is the first full-length test under proper conditions that most of these folks take. </p>
<p>But they did study. They went through prep books that they read cover to cover. Or they sat through lessons with another instructor. And those tutors also recommended early testing because that’s just the norm here. </p>
<p>Also the norm here is to be just a math instructor or just an english instructor. When many of them offer their students practice tests, it’s just one timed section in their subject, if they offer it at all. But that’s if they even make their students do anything as such at all. The whole thing floors me. </p>
<p>All I said from the beginning is that early testing is a norm here that is not appropriate for everybody because most students are not in the National Merit range in the fall. If they were, then the National Merit threshold would be even higher or they’d have to increase the percentage getting it. This is the case despite the amount of folks here who truly devoted the summer before their junior year studying hard. </p>
<p>These folks probably did not study how you or I would have suggested. But if the early testing norm was not a norm, then they would have gotten their PSAT score back and realized they need a kick in the butt that winter. Here, scores come back around the first or second week of December. They would then realize that while they did do some studying, clearly it was not as adequate as they had thought. </p>
<p>@satteacher, well I guess your experience says that pricey SAT tutoring is not the essential prep so many people claim it to be and that a little common sense and a good work ethic may be more important.</p>
<p>@mathyone It goes without saying, but expensive prep need not equate with effective. I just look at SAT prep as you’re paying for a personal trainer at the gym. Sure you can get in shape on your own, or you can have someone kick your butt into shape. </p>
<p>But I don’t understand instructors who are too lazy to give their students practice tests and still encourage early testing.</p>
<p>Anyways, we digress. I still stand firm that early testing can work for some people but can be harmful for most. </p>
<p>My goal in having my daughter test in Dec was to take advantage of the PSAT prep she’d done, to minimize the total amount of time she’d need to spend worrying about these tests, and to give her the chance to retake, if necessary, as a junior rather than an Oct senior year test. She was very busy that summer and would have had zero time to study for the SAT after junior year or during the fall of senior year. </p>
<p>I’m also wondering about the “bad” score issue. Most colleges say they superscore, and many accept score choice. With the inherent variability involved, the kids who take the test several times are going to get a higher superscore just by sheer luck, and most colleges seem more than happy to take the outlying scores rather than the average. I’m sure there are plenty of kids who got the same superscore as my daughter’s single sitting score. I view it as less of an achievement, especially when you at a very high score level where careless mistakes and pacing misjudgements are going to be as costly as any gaps in actual knowledge, but as far as I’ve been able to tell, the vast majority of colleges don’t care how they got those numbers. </p>
<p>To me it’s obviously a bad idea to jump in unprepared and get what you <em>know</em> will not represent your best score, but if you feel prepared and are happy with your practice test scores, I see no reason to put it off because it’s only fall.</p>
<p>@mathyone All I know is that these folks who tend to consider early testing dates look at schools like UPenn and Yale, which insist on seeing every score and say they do not superscore. There are also plenty of top schools who claim to superscore or only consider the single highest overall score. </p>
<p>If having potentially bad scores doesn’t matter, then why not just take it every month? If there is zero cost to a potentially less than desirable score other than the time and money, why not just go for it all the time. I think at some level, we can all acknowledge there must be some cost to less than desirable test scores. </p>
<p>In the model I have in mind, most of the prep happens before the PSAT. I’m hoping you are not implying having to spend 3 months from scratch relearning grammar rules from scratch, for example. </p>
<p>I think you keep mistaking me for thinking people should procrastinate the studying. I never once said that. I just said sign up when you think you are 95% confident you are in your score range or perhaps March of junior year, whichever is first. I’m not sure what is so terrible about this. </p>
<p>I’m looking at the whole process as more a marathon than a sprint. I think many of the skills need time to marinate, particularly the essay. I find it is a very different writing than most folks are used to, unless perhaps they had already taken AP History type classes as a sophomore.</p>
<p>If your daughter were piqued by December junior year, then just go ahead and sign her up for December, January, and March. Makes sense to me. </p>
<p>I’m just trying to argue that fewer folks have piqued by December of junior year than is implied by the amount of folks taking the test in October or November of junior year. </p>