The author (and Pieper, who’s writing seems to have motivated this piece) seems to have a fairly specific definition of leisure that doesn’t match my own intuitive understanding of the term. The author specifically states that “Leisure is not the same as rest from labor.” However, there doesn’t appear to be a careful definition of the word aside from the hint (with a nod to the great philosopher, Fezzik) that that word doesn’t mean what I think it means. It might have been more insightful if this definition were included and discussed.
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Are money and leisure the only two options? Tisk, tisk, tisk for the false dichotomy…
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You’re free to disagree with me and my “false dichotomy”. You seem to be offended by my opinions.
The average American is drowning in consumer debt and doesnt have $5,000 to their name. Financial literacy is a big issue in this country.
As I stated before, these articles never focus on how many kids struggle to make ends meet, cant pay off credit cards, cant buy a house, cant start a family, because they can find good paying jobs.
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I read this earlier today and have been thinking about it. I am generally in favor of a liberal arts education, by which I mean an education that exposes young people to a variety of subjects and ways of thinking, in part for professional reasons and in part for citizenship reasons. But I’m increasingly skeptical that college is a particularly important part of becoming an engaged thinker and moral citizen. I went to an elite liberal arts school followed by an elite law school, and there was a time I thought that those experiences were transformational to the way I thought. But 30+ years out, I think I have become a more engaged citizen and critical thinker through life, both work and being a parent and family member. Part of it is that many of the public school parents I wound up volunteering with with come from very different experiences, many didn’t attend college, and being part of this broader community has been more important than my much more “curated” college experiences in helping me understand the broader world. In some ways my work life as a lawyer doesn’t provide the same broad perspective, but I work with a non-profit and success generally depends on connecting with people across many lines. I think I have learned more about citizenship and ethics from my real world successes and failures than I did in my classroom experiences. Maybe in 30 more years, I’ll think differently again about what experiences are most important to a life well lived…
I guess I thought mostly that it seems self-serving (and not surprising) for professors to think that a liberal arts college education is the key touchstone to developing a thoughtful citizenry.
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But by your logic - that one must choose between pursuit of money or an irresponsible life of leisure - there would be no teachers, no social workers, no fire fighters, no flight attendants, and no other socially-useful but rarely high-paid professions. One can eschew the pursuit of money as their primary post-university goal and still perform work that has social utility (and sadly, social utility rarely brings in the big bucks, but that hardly makes it a life of leisure).
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And you think that’s because they graduated college with BAs in English?
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Interestingly, although there is a bit of a correlation between lower incomes and higher incidences of financial stress, higher incomes generally do less to reduce the incidence of financial stress than many people seem to expect.
That survey is typical. The overall rate was 70%, and among high income earners, it was 57%. This is consistent with general findings about the diminishing marginal utility of additional income or wealth. Past a certain point, usually the main factors in happiness are something else.
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Bit of an aside, but one of the contributing factors to that diminishing marginal utility of money I just mentioned in another post appears to be that humans, as social animals, often have a tie between their happiness and their status, particularly in their closer social circles. And some people imagine in advance that more money will bring them more status, but then they tend to end up around other people with similar money, and that doesn’t work.
Generally it is questionable to look to your job for status for similar reasons–you typically end up around a lot of people with the same job (see also looking to attending a certain college for status–a lot of people find the effect they were hoping for diminishes rapidly once they are surrounded by other people going to the same college).
But at least if you are also talking about a local community with diverse jobs, jobs with higher local social utility can have higher local status. Which is probably part of why they CAN be lower-paid. The compensation in the form of social status is making those jobs more competitive than the financial compensation alone can explain.
Anyway, the bottom line is we know there is usually a sharply diminishing marginal utility to higher incomes. Hence why a lot of happy people have not maximized income, but have struck a balance between work income and other things that matter to them, like job satisfaction, time with family, and, in fact, “leisure” in the broad sense.
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The bottom line is people should make educated choices and these articles dont factor in the potential econcomic outcomes of their choices. I’m not sure how many colleges give graduates a full range of financial information that could help them determine what major or profession they should pursue.
For example, my D24 just got a huge brochure from Vanderbilt. In this well made, glossy, 64 page brochure, they highlight all their majors: College of Arts and Sciences, Blair School of Music, School of Engineering, Peabody College.
The only major that mentioned employment was engineering - “More than 90% of students entering the workforce have a job within 6 months of graduation”. Presumably, the assumption is they found engineering jobs.
At the end of the brochure, they give a general statistic that 63% of students are employed - no time line, average salary by major etc,
It would be helpful for kids to know how many students who got a degree in X were employed after Y timeline, making Z amount. If they still wanted to major in ABC major, go for it.
Im not sure how many colleges give that type of transparent detail other than general statistics.
Hopefully I never get stuck in an elevator for an extended period of time with Mr. Malesic.
However, economics is often used as a substitute for business (with more business adjacent courses offered), and college prestige places graduates into college prestige conscious employers.
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However, sometimes a college student may not know what income level is “enough” for the future living costs that they may not know either. Uncertainty here can result in financial struggles or chasing the money beyond what is actually needed to be “enough”.
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It is very expensive to pay $85k year for leisure time.
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Probably not the only one, but when I see those ads for the technical degrees that are from the for-profit schools, I don’t think “college” but “run”. Not surprising that some of those students rack up a huge debt load and no job.
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It kinda sucks, but if all of your friends are doing it, it is simply part of life.
It also make university into a bit more business-like, “I’m here to get my degree and get out, not actually enjoy myself”. That can happen hen you start your undergrad at an age at which undergrads here are graduating, you’re required to take the same number of credits as college kids in the USA, but often in three years, and you generally need to be working at least part time, as well.
On the other hand, after military service, there is enjoyment in doing anything that isn’t military, and much of the less leisurely aspect so studying can feel like leisure, compared to military life…
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Well, there’s no denying that from my perspective something shifted in American society once the military became utterly dependent on an all-volunteer armed forces. A few years of mandatory service of some kind would make the transition to college a lot less dog-eat-dog; people will have developed empathy for the country as a whole; college itself wouldn’t have to do all the heavy lifting.
And serving an older student body might even have the salutary effect of bringing down the costs of higher education overall.
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I think you would also need to account for those going on to graduate or professional schools, and government, non-profit, or military service. You’d also need to adjust salaries for locational cost of living.
Of course you would also need a way of getting that data in a statistically significant way for each major, including lower-volume majors.
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Ssshhh… Don’t tell that to our son. Who is earning his master’s while serving. While deploying. While marrying. While re-posting (moving). He doesn’t need to be reminded of what he’s missing.
But most of the comments on this thread miss a key point made in the article:
He pointed out in his 1948 book, “Leisure: The Basis of Culture,” that the word “school” comes from the Greek “schole,” which means “leisure.”
Most here are making their points using leisure to mean what @momofboiler1 noted:
Instead, the author is using the term to mean the time spent in academia rather than in the work world. If you re-read the article and mentally substitute the word “leisure” for “school” or “college,” you’ll better understand what he means when he says that school is not a “job.”
College is a unique time in your life to discover just how much your mind can do… it requires time — time to allow your mind to branch out, grow and blossom.
Leisure being the time afforded to education, free from a job, is the definition used in the article. Too many students are looking at school (leisure) as a job rather than as precious time free from that particular focus.
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College is not “a job” not matter the major. One of my kids was in a preprofessional major (as preprofessional as it comes) and took it very seriously. Nevertheless they went abroad, volunteered, took electives, met students from a variety of majors, did all the good/fun stuff people do in college. They are working now in chosen field and it’s nothing like college.
Our son is a college athlete taking a science & lab heavy major/minor combo, and I still get pictures of him on the golf course with his teammates.
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