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<p>The departments I recalled being the strongest while I was there included:</p>
<p>History, East Asian Studies(Especially Chinese studies<em>), Politics(Especially Comparative)</em>, Math(Pure), Neuroscience, Biology, Psychology, Chemistry, Physics, Music Education, Art/Art History, etc. </p>
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<li>I knew of several classmates who transferred to Oberlin from other respectable/elite universities (i.e. Georgetown, Brandeis, etc) because of strengths in those areas.</li>
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<p>LACs in general tend to do very well at PhD production, far better than most state universities. Here’s one example, a 2010 list for science & engineering. Even my D’s tiny, never-heard-of-it college is here.</p>
<p>[Top</a> 50 Schools That Produce Science PhDs](<a href=“http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505145_162-37242954/top-50-schools-that-produce-science-phds/]Top”>http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505145_162-37242954/top-50-schools-that-produce-science-phds/)</p>
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<p>From the link:</p>
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<p>All that may well be true (or may not be, I’ve seen no data one way or the other for many of the assertions). But I think it leaves unmentioned a huge factor: liberal arts colleges, by definition, do not graduate people with professional degrees. Of course a university, with schools of education, business, nursing, agriculture, even engineering, is going to have a lower per capita percentage of students going into PhD programs, because a high percentage of non-LAS graduates have no interest in or reason to pursue graduate degrees (except perhaps graduate professional degrees) and instead go directly into entry-level jobs in their technical specialties.</p>
<p>^ My guess is that not many HS students are choosing their college based on this list’s ranking, nor on the underlying data. It seems like most kids first decide if they want a small or a large school, and then move on to other selection criteria. So in our minds maybe we should divide the list into small and large groups, and then discuss the ranking, if anyone wants to.</p>
<p>Re: [Top</a> 50 Schools That Produce Science PhDs - CBS News](<a href=“http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505145_162-37242954/top-50-schools-that-produce-science-phds/]Top”>http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505145_162-37242954/top-50-schools-that-produce-science-phds/)</p>
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<p>Why would that be a head scratcher? Just take a look at what majors NM Mines offers and does not offer.</p>
<p>My D went to Smith, graduating in '08. My thumbnail for a Smithie is “bright and quirky.” Contra Wellsely, “bright and more button down.” She had classmates who had (virtually) $2 to last a semester and she had classmates who were New England “old money.” One of the Smith propaganda pieces says “Four years where it’s all about you” and they certainly seem to try. </p>
<p>Small classes, the department head taught one of D’s intro class discussion sections. If you’re absent, you’ll likely get a solicitous e-mail and assignments. <em>Outstanding</em> multi-layered counseling from day one to three years after when applying to PhD programs. More than half the juniors spend time “Away;” D spent hers split between Washington, D.C. and Budapest, a friend between Rome & Oxford. (And many spend a whole year in one location.)</p>
<p>Academics are tough enough that visiting friends from Ivies said the Smith classes were more rigorous. (Assuming you don’t want Swarthmore, U/Chicago, or Reed…the three really “high rigor” colleges in my book.)</p>
<p>When D went off to Smith, we thought it was so great that I kept expecting a shoe to drop. Four years later it never had. In her senior year, an organization was suggested to her and she applied for <em>one</em> job and got it, spending three years working as a research associate at a think tank, doing things like giving a presentation on the estate tax to Bill Gates’ father. Three years later, the alumni association came up with a fellowship to support her first year of PhD work. </p>
<p>Can’t say enough good things about Smith. The biggest negative imho is some of the pervasive PC attitudes. And am still mumbling to myself about one classmate who told my D, “You can’t be Catholic, you’re smart.” Well, it was only one and it could happen anywhere I suppose.</p>
<p>Since there seem to be a lot of Oberlin experts on here I was wondering if I could pick yoor brain a bit. My DS14 wants to major in Physics but also has a passion for the theatre and music. He is a tenor in his HS’s top choir and has numerous theatre kuddos. Do you know if it easy to get involved in the theatre and music programs at Oberlin if you are not in the conservatory? I have heard that it may be. My S would like to go to a LAC that has a great Physics program and a thriving theatre program where he could either minor or try out for productions.</p>
<p>student here, snooping in the Parents Forum, throwing in my two cents to 5boys. I understand why he’s looking at Oberlin and it could be a good fit. But, please suggest Carleton to your son, too. We’ve got top notch physics and lots of music, theater and other performing opportunities for non-majors.</p>
<p>Ok… sounds good griffen…my DS 12 was originally looking at Carleton but I couldn’t get him to bite on Minnesota… hopefully my DS 14 will be more open. Love that they have the music, theatre for non-majors, that is exactly what he is looking for. He decided against a conservatory theatre program because he doesn’t want to give up physics. I think it is a strange combo, but apparently it isn’t after talking to a few people. He doesn’t have SAT scores yet, so that may dictate where he will look, but thanks so much.</p>
<p>A plug for Bryn Mawr: It’s quirky and has fabulous professors, small classes, and really cool dorms. The best traditions ever. Attracts very independent, smart women. Very liberal. I graduated in '90 and actually lived at Haverford for one year (Haverford had gone co-ed by then). Did about half of my coursework at Haverford as well. Many of my classes at Bryn Mawr were also co-ed – and we even had a co-ed dorm on campus at that time (lots of going back and forth between the two campuses thanks to the Bi-College “Blue Bus”). Had a really good time and met tons of interesting people from all kinds of backgrounds. Close to Philadelphia (easy train ride).</p>
<p>@5kids</p>
<p>My D has a number of friends who are involved in all manner of singing groups–of which there are a lot on campus. I know less about theater opportunities, but am very confident your S could sing as much has he wanted to at Oberlin.</p>
<p>Thanks qialah!! That sounds awesome… for some reason he is really into slam poetry too…loves, loves it!!</p>
<p>5boys–while you are at Carleton you might as well look at St. Olaf (across town from Carleton)…sorry Griffen :). It’s another outstanding school that has a VERY strong music program and a pretty good theater program, all available to non-music majors too. Carleton is a great school but their music program is no where near the caliber of St. Olaf’s. Olaf also has a very strong science program to go with that. Both are beautiful campuses too. Luther in Iowa also would be something to consider if he wants both a strong science program and a strong music/performing arts program.</p>
<p>St. Olaf does have an outstanding music and science programs… just wondering if my “artsy”, loves diversity in every form kid would fit in. He likes to make and put together clothing… that is interesting but cool. He is incredibly outgoing and likes all types of people, not into sports at all, but is a competitive sailor, and rock climber. He thinks he would like to go to NYU… but I know better. It’s just that he is attracted to that type of environment… tons of stimulation and energy. I think he could get that type of feeling on a smaller campus that is thriving. But will check out St. Olaf for sure because of the science/music facilities.</p>
<p>5boys–Olaf is a little more homogeneous than Carleton but there are still plenty of artys kids there–you will find that anywhere there is a strong music/arts program. Sailing, in MN, isn’t going to be much of an option most of the time he is in school. Olaf has a rock climbing wall :). You would have to go to northern MN to get any “real” rock climbing though and that is very limited. St. Olaf and Carleton are busy campuses. They are in a small town, 15,000 people, but, they have a lot of out of the area students so most kids are on campus all the time. There is a lot of “outdoor” stuff to do in and around Northfield. He may also want to consider Macalester in St. Paul. It would probably be a better fit for his artys side as well as being basically on the St. Paul/Minneapolis border with a lot of “urban” attractions.</p>
<p>5boys:</p>
<p>Fiske guide has a nice summation of the neighboring schools…St Olaf and Carleton…</p>
<p>St Olaf…Minnesota nice.</p>
<p>Carelton…grunge.</p>
<p>The local students from our HS that go to Carleton (quite a few) would not even consider St Olaf a possibility. Mac yes; Grinnel yes; St Olf no way.</p>
<p>Ds is at Carleton. I have never gotten a “grunge” vibe from it – at all.</p>
<p>Fiske doesn’t use the term grunge to mean dirty, stinky, whatever. It is in the book, take a look.</p>
<p>Just that it is different from the clean cut, Minnesota nice, Lutheran at St Olaf.</p>
<p>Our local HS sends multiple students to Carleton and St Olaf each year. There is a clear difference.</p>
<p>Haystack–yes, there is a difference in the overall student body at both, however, if you have a musically inclined student that wants to study physics, Carleton isn’t a name that pops up on most radars for that where as St. Olaf will be the first school out of everyone’s mouth. Not all of the Carleton students wear black and Birkenstock, but a lot of them do. Not all of the Olaf students are clean cut preppy types either. You will find a mix at both schools and you will find students from both schools mixing.</p>
<p>I have spent many, many hours on both campuses, we have a lot of kids that consider both schools for different reasons, it isn’t a one or the other proposition for most kids I know.</p>
<p>D is in the “loved StO” camp and applied, and wasn’t much interested in Carleton. She was a little concerned about the Lutheran part - we are nominally Episcopalian but not very active and she is in teen “no-religion” stage. We went to chapel at St. Olaf when we visited to get the sense of it and see if it would be too much for her. There were maybe 100 kids out of 3000 in attendance and format was what she was used to from our tradition so comfortable enough and not mandatory. She is fairly mainstream but looks like a rocker chick now and then. They have a radio station and stage / night club facility to book bands etc. Great art museum space as well. Loved the science building! She also applied to Grinnell and Willamett, so less quirky or still quirky but not advertising it quite so much.</p>