<p>I am considering applying to Duke next year, I have many EC's with a strong emphasis on politics (volunteering for local politician, invited to be a counselor at political camp I attended last year (only male out of 46 people to be invited back), have attended other political camps, Princeton Model Congress, etc. My GPA, however, is not strong. I have never worked my tail off like many people at this level-my GPA is around 3.6 UW, although I have taken an AP-level math course for two years (very, very hard), and am taking more APs this year and next. My GPA freshman year was around 3.65 UW, Sophomore year (messed up badly that year) a 3.4, and this year around a 3.75 UW (I am a junior). HOWEVER, I have read that Duke places large emphasis on test scores, and I consistently scored 35 on practice ACTs and am expecting 35-36 when I get my scores back from the one I just took this Saturday. If I can pull off the 35 (or possibly 36, <em>fingers crossed</em>), do I have a decent shot at Duke University?</p>
<p>First off, most schools of Duke's caliber, when asked: "Do you want your candidates to have strong grades, or test scores?" will answer, "Both". They have enough strong candidates that they can select kids with good grades AND test scores, and those with one or the other may find themselves on the outside.</p>
<p>Second, a rising trend in your GPA is good news and will go quite a ways in redeeming a few bad grades. Your grades are not stellar, but from what I can tell, they aren't close to atrocious enough to rule you out based on those alone, especially if you go to a strong high school.</p>
<p>Third, Duke places - and I have this straight from the admissions department - LESS emphasis on the SATs and ACTs than many comparable institutions, not more.</p>
<p>Thanks for the quick reply! I had read at collegeboard.com and in Princeton Review 361 Colleges that Duke places a much higher emphasis on test scores, but your source is certainly much more reliable. Thanks for the clarification.</p>
<p>I suppose, if you are comparing Duke to 361 other colleges, we might place more emphasis on SATs than, say, Iowa State (I don't know this; I am making up a school randomly).</p>
<p>But relative to the schools that are often considered our "peers", we care less, not more. Or so says our admissions department.</p>
<p>Collegeboard listed "GPA" and "Class Rank" as "Considered" factors when accepting students, and test scores as "Very Imporant" (on a scale of considered-important-very important), and Princeton Review had a small blurb that said Duke looks strongly at test scores, moreso than GPA. Did you recieve this information from someone at the admissions office or through a press-release/write-up on the Duke website, etc.?</p>
<p>OK, thanks a lot. If you don't mind, (I know it's at least reach), do you think I have a decent shot with a 35-36? I DO go to a very strong high school-it's one of the three best here in Vermont, and our class is VERY competitive. I'm only top 20% with that 3.6-top 10% is reserved for those with a 3.85 UW or higher.</p>
<p>Brenny, I don't know anything about the ACT, but the internet is telling me that that correlates to basically a perfect score, or within thirty points or so.</p>
<p>If so, I believe you have a shot - and not just a shot, but actually quite a reasonable one - if:</p>
<p>1.) You score as you are hoping to on the ACT
2.) You finish off your junior year AND your first semester senior year with very strong grades (think nothing lower than an A-)
3.) You write good essays that explain SPECIFICALLY why you are interested in Duke; Early Decision probably would not hurt, either, if you feel you are capable of that.</p>
<p>Even if you can't pull off the above, I think you still have a shot - but I'm not sure. If you can pull off the above, I would feel comfortable telling you that you have a not-unheard-of shot.</p>
<p>Thanks again for the replys. BTW, What is a good amount of community service for a year? I haven't been able to get in a whole lot because of a lot of other commitments, but my schedule should be pretty open after AP tests in May and of course in the summer.</p>
<p>Don't think of it in terms of hours - think about it in terms of the actual impact you have. The more, the better. Try to remember things clearly - write a journal, if you can. Make a note of people who were special to you.</p>
<p>Haha - that wasn't the kind of person I meant! I meant a child who became very attached to you while you were playing Go Fish in his leukemia ward or something like that.</p>
<p>Hehe yeah, it was more of just a story. Would starting a Young Democrats or the like club at my high school next year look good on my apps/if yes, how good?</p>
<p>Good to colleges, yes, and I have no idea whatsoever how good. Probably moderately?</p>
<p>If you want to do it - then do it. If it's something you feel strongly about, then absolutely do it, and that sort of passion will show through. If it's something you do just to pad your resume, then I'd recommend against it - these sorts of things are huge timesucks for somebody who doesn't enjoy them.</p>
<p>EDIT: I had lost track of which forum this thread was in and mentioned a comment about medical schools down the line. Sorry.</p>
<p>I think Duke certainly has very high admit rates for students with stellar SAT scores. Valedictorians are extremely common, and hence Duke accepts more students with a 1550+ score on CR+M than valedictorians. The thing about GPA is that while it's very important, colleges really can't say that your 4.6 is any better or worse than someone elses 4.2 without knowing the actual courses both people took, the highest GPA possible at each school, and the persons relative rank. Even then, being number one from Hickville High can't be directly compared with someone who's top 10% at Exeter. As a result, I think that colleges evaluate GPA more as a way to get a general "flavor" of the student, and since most applicants are at the tippy top of their class, there's really no way to count most students anymore in or out based on a few tenths of a point GPA wise. </p>
<p>On the other hand, SAT scores are directly comparable within a known range, and due to rankings, colleges have a strong incentive to admit very high scorers.</p>
<p>So while both GPA and SAT scores are very important, it's unlikely that being number one or top 5% will really make or break your application, however +-200 SAT points really could.</p>
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On the other hand, SAT scores are directly comparable within a known range, and due to rankings, colleges have a strong incentive to admit very high scorers.
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<p>I'd be more inclined to believe you if places like Harvard didn't brag about rejecting 50% of the 1600s that applied. High scorers are more plentiful than you think.</p>
<p>Well, I mean, nike is talking about swings of 200 points.</p>
<p>Yes, that really can make or break your application. A 1350 is very different from a 1550.</p>
<p>There's no such thing as a good SAT score, really - there's no score that can get you in if everything else is "average", but there is definitely such a thing as a bad score...</p>
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There's no such thing as a good SAT score, really - there's no score that can get you in if everything else is "average", but there is definitely such a thing as a bad score...
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<p>That was more my point. A lot of people seem to think a stellar SAT makes up for a average/mediocre GPA. If anything adcoms tend to interpret it as a smart student with a subpar work ethic - not someone elite colleges are clamoring to admit.</p>
<p>That's the frustrating thing about SATs - it isn't possible to do "well" on them, only poorly.</p>
<p>I wish they could write a test that - like the MCATs, for example - got progressively harder/more spread out as the results got higher. That is, if the gap between a 2340 and a 2350 was much, much larger than the gap between a 2220 and a 2230.</p>
<p>That would allow the test to legitimately separate kids at a high level from kids at an astonishing level... but alas, 'tis not to be.</p>