The 3.3 to 3.6 (GPA) Parents Thread

Parents Forum
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<p>5boys - my oldest son was the same as you’re describing your son when it came to the college search and the application project. I led, he followed. I know every kid is different, but if it makes you feel any better - he’s just starting his sophomore year in college and he’s totally on the ball. He sets up meetings with profs, he’s got spreadsheets planning out all four years in school, he’s got a better GPA than he had in high school, he applied for a TA position and told me AFTER he’d submitted everything. This is not the same kid I pushed through the college application process! The way I look at it, it’s the first big project of it’s kind they’ve ever done. Some kids embrace it and drive the whole thing - that’s great. The way it worked out in our house is that I think he learned by watching how I organized everything, made spreadsheets, set deadlines, and he saw that it was well worth the effort. So don’t tear your hair out - maybe you can view it like he’s apprenticing with you on how to organize and drive a big project!</p>

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<p>May be our kids learned that we’ll fill whatever void they left behind ;). Seriously, my D is a bit like this too. She’s like an outsider to this process most of the time, but every now and then, she’ll surprised me with a short spurt of involvement. I just hope these short spurts quickly turn into a longer lasting drive for she doesn’t have much time left.</p>

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<p>Thanks guys… I have somewhat calmed down… yoga breathing…LOL!! I know he will step up to the plate… and it is encouraging to hear about your older S PN… My DS can run a meeting for 100 people but this is just NOT a priority right now… I was thinking at one point to let him apply to the state school and just forget it… He does have spurts of interest and will talk about it, but more time than not he just tunes me out. I just don’t think they can understand how important college is now a days…</p>

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<p>So…mom of 5 boys and paperchase…I can relate!..My son (HS '10) is pursuing a fine arts degree at Carnegie Mellon. He had mediocre grades (3.3 UW), very good scores and a very strong portfolio. He is in heaven at CMU–the perfect fit (art major and robotics minor). They don’t care much about scores there for art, more about hte portfolio and a rigorous curriculum with OK grades (don’t want arts majors flunking the courses required for breadth of study). PCP, you should take a look at the arts forum for other suggestions for your daughter. My S was not very involved in the process other than developing a strong preference for the most expensive option (CMU)–even preparing his portfolio–I signed him up for a course at a local art school that helped him fill in the gaps and organize. Now back for his second year at CMU, I also see him a million times more mature (although still somewhat disorganized). He actually finishes his work on time, documents his pieces, and attends class consistently. Grades are good, particularly for CMU. He was awarded a small scholarship for this year. HE TOOK the initiative to find a job on campus and has not asked, even once, for money??? and he pays all his entertainment/spending money and books/supplies. So for mom of 5 boys…take heart…make sure they make it through this college search process if it takes bribes, nagging and you doing too much …I would never have guessed that S would get through freshman year without major issues and suprise…he thrived and returned more mature, more enterprising, more ambitious than I ever thought I would see.</p>

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<p>My 3.6 kid made it through freshman year at Tufts. He’s working on applications for next year’s summer internships! :eek:! They do grow up.</p>

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<p>Congrat’s to your S mathmom… gosh do those applications EVER stop?</p>

<p>Fineartsmom…Love to hear success stories about boys who DO finally get it all together. I have seen tremendous growth in my over the last year… now just helping him through the final push. My DS 14 sounds very much like your S at CMU and I was thinking that may be a fit for him as well. He is actually VERY interested in theatre, but loves Physics. How does your S like CMU for such diverse interests? On one hand I think my S would really like the Engineering stuff…as he is very creative and loves invent and work with his hands and is just plain brilliant when it comes to Physics, but I think his creativity may also keep him out of it. He also may decide to just be a plain theatre major. How easy is it for them to take classes outside of their school at CMU if he did decide to both majors? Do you think it would be impossible?</p>

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<p>My daughter is a freshman at a tier 1 university who graduated with a 3.44 W academic GPA. Her athletics helped her get in but one piece of advice I like to share with friends is the option of improving ACT scores.</p>

<p>My research and personal experience suggest that intensive tutoring for the ACT can lead to significant increase in results that are more dramatic that typically possible on the SAT.</p>

<p>We invested about $1000 in three private ACT tutors over about ten weeks leading up to her test. The results were spectacular, an increase from the 60% to 91%.</p>

<p>Prep classes don’t get the same results, in my opinion. They just level the playing field when you’re really looking for an edge.</p>

<p>The reasons to favor the ACT over the SAT include that fact that it is an achievement test, whereas the SAT is a achievement/IQ test. </p>

<p>In addition, the mix of students taking the ACT is more favorable to high achievers because the test takers includes all students in many states that are, shall we say, less competitive educationally. </p>

<p>In comparison the SAT is the test of choice in more competitive east and west coast living areas. </p>

<p>Lastly the numerical scaling of the test, 1-36, is more favorable to the SAT’s 2400 more granular approach.</p>

<p>As parents there is only so much we can do about our child’s grades, which are a product of years of work.</p>

<p>In contrast, a hands on approach to arranging a rigorous private tutoring program over a couple months can potentially lead to a significant boost in options for attendance at top notch colleges.</p>

<p>BTW, I benefited tremendously from advice gleaned from these boards over the last couple of years. Without it, my daughter may not have achieved her dreams (and mine too!) of going to a top college. </p>

<p>Hope some of you use this advice, it’s from someone who it worked for.</p>

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<p>5boys, I can answer that: CMU’s theatre degree program is quite separate from other programs there, and it is audition-based. There is a BFA/BA (I think it’s a "BHA) option, but it’s very difficult to do, and you have to get accepted into both of your schools separately. I don’t know how much your S has thought about a theatre degree, but if he’d like to get a diverse experience, I’d recommend a school with a strong BA in theatre (or a theatre minor) rather than an auditioned BFA. On the other hand, CMU does have great EC theatre opportunities, so I’m not recommending he rule that school out. Once he’s got a good idea of how he personally wants to balance theatre and other subjects, then he’ll know if it feels right for him.</p>

<p>Good luck to you, and to everyone!</p>

<p>We just moved our D into Adelphi University, to start her BFA Theatre/Honors College experience. I think I’ve told her story a few pages back, but for her this was the best of all possible worlds (aside from her dream schools: she was rejected by CMU’s theatre program and also BU, both of which are ultra-selective, way below 10% admission rates). </p>

<p>She is finding her arts/honors peers to be very exciting and interesting, and is enjoying the school. Give us some time, and we’ll be able to tell our story of “what’s it like to be in the top group at a less-selective school’s honors/auditioned arts program.” She did turn down several more selective schools to get this exact mix of what she wants: she did not want to double major, definitely wanted the BFA Theatre experience, but she wanted strong, compelling liberal arts as well, and location and personal fit also mattered a lot to her.</p>

<p>PaperCP: Best wishes on your fine arts journey. It was a complex balance for us, particularly with a very-good-but-not-tippy-top stats kid (3.6 UW, 31 ACT). It took until the 11th hour (including a WL acceptance) for her to dig deep inside herself and understand just exactly what she wanted. Having a broad list and lots of acceptances to choose from ended up being very helpful, even though it was a lot of work applying and then deciding. In the long run it was best for our D.</p>

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<p>I’ll chime in on the ACT. I definitely agree that some kids just are better suited to it. Coming from the midwest, I do think our schools “teach” to it more. Both of my kids did way better on ACT-type tests than PSAT or SAT2 (neither took regular SAT for that reason).</p>

<p>BUT I will say that an ACT practice book and a steady practice of 20 minutes a day on her own took my D from a 27 to a 31. Also I think in the fall of senior year she just was finally ready to nail the test, after being disappointed twice. Some of our less-than-4.0 kids just need that time and maturity to reach their potential, on tests and in grades. </p>

<p>This D is not the greatest test-taker - her APs also were very disappointing. She did not want to take an ACT prep class, but studying TO THE TEST (instead of trying to “master” the concepts better holistically) really made a difference for her.</p>

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<p>Our S2 is also headed back to Tufts for his soph year. Has done very well academically, despite having his heart broken over winter break. Still working on healing, but has a lot of plans for the fall (including a project your S2 may find interesting, mathmom) and is excited about all the classes he’d like to take.</p>

<p>IB really made a difference in being able to crank out big papers. Was worth the struggle in HS to see how easily and well he tackles those assignments now.</p>

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<p>Emmybet… Thanks for the info!! My S 14 is only a sophmore so who knows what he will decide to do when he is a Senior… I am trying to talk him out of a BFA… he went to a very prestigious summer conservatory program this summer and now he is totally in love with the whole BFA thing… AHH!! I think it is a little easier for boys but he loves Physics as well, so I want him to keep all of his options open. Adelphi sounds great! We live in CA so USC is God around here for theatre and they have a BA. but my S said that if you want to do live theatre you need to go to NY… so we will see. He LOVES Shakespeare and also done a great summer shakespeare conservatory program last summer.</p>

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<p>Emmybet is right; audition theatre majors and musical theatre at CMU do not allow students to dual major and is the most competitive program. Still, there are many theatre interest groups and some courses are open to non majors. What is most attractive about the university is how the music/art/engineers/math/computer geeks/biochem majors all interact. Sure there are the kids who live in their rooms studying and playing video games but the majority interact in the most creative and interesting ways. For example, my son and some other art students helped make a music video for some kids who invented a new dance (the two dancers, I think, are both non-music/theatre majors) and it was lifted by saturday night live…they were interviewed by rolling stone magazine. The video is really good and you see some bits of campus (including the laundry room of my son’s dorm…the pile of clothes is suspiciously familiar). [‘Saturday</a> Night Live’ Digital Short Echoes College Freshman’s Dance Video | Rolling Stone Culture | Video Blog | Music Entertainment Videos](<a href=“http://www.rollingstone.com/culture/blogs/rolling-stone-video-blog/saturday-night-live-digital-short-echoes-college-freshmans-dance-video-20110131]'Saturday”>‘Saturday Night Live’ Digital Short Echoes College Freshman’s Dance Video – Rolling Stone)</p>

<p>My son made good friends with theatre majors in his dorm and one was in a film he made for a class. My son also animated a poem written by an English major and entered it in a film competition. Engineers help him with special effects and sculpture challenges and he provided welding assistance to the go-cart team that won the annual downhill derby. Trust me…it is CMU and those go carts are very high tech! He loves the interaction of the scientists/artists/musicians and that is what makes the place so special. I think it is heaven on earth for the intellectually curious/quirky/artsy/musically inclined/scientifically oriented kid.</p>

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<p>i think i may fit in here. my D14 had a 3.2 uw freshman year. our goal for her is to get it to 3.5 sophomore year. I don’t think she has started to look at schools yet but she has mentioned Ohio University and Kent State and many of her friends will go to Akron so probably that too. The thing is, I would like her to not rule out LAC. We have so many in Ohio that I believe would fit her well. I also thing she needs a smaller atmosphere to excel. But who knows… </p>

<p>She is immensely different from her sister - much more stubborn with very strong convictions. A natural leader and very outgoing. Just wish she had that drive to do well in school like her sis. sigh.</p>

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<p>Here we go again…EA/ED time is upon us. </p>

<p>I thought we would be better prepared and have more time to spare by this time with D1, but her recent (about 6 month) shift (not a wholesale change) in interests completely threw us off our timeline. Rather than working on her essays this summer, she had been feverishly developing her art portfolio for studio art colleges. She had only a handful of semi-portfolio quality pieces before the summer, now she has over 20. </p>

<p>The good news is her effort was rewarded recently at a SAIC admission info and portfolio review session. SAIC accepted her portfolio on the spot and will nominate her for merit scholarship! She was the only one to receive such nomination that day. It was true happiness for me to see D1 beaming with joy that her work has been validated by one of the best painting/drawing schools in the country. She was so unsure of the quality of her pieces because she only started serious drawing/painting a year ago. </p>

<p>Now the bad news: we are only couple weeks from the EA/ED deadline and her essays are nowhere near complete! Am I a little worried? No, I’m very scared!</p>

<p>But, at least our application plan has emerged. D1 will apply ED (still choosing between two), and EA to a few schools, including our flagship. She will then finalize the list for RD based on the ED/EA decisions. </p>

<p>She felt good after the last SAT; soon we’ll know if she needs to do any last minute adjustment to her list.</p>

<p>In the meantime, S2 is gearing up for the PSAT this weekend. His practice results teetered on the NMSF cutoff line. It’s gonna be a nail-biter.</p>

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<p>PCP, I’ve seen another parent deal with the sudden change in interests, with the rush to investigate a new set of colleges and programs and majors and the student racing to put together the requisite portfolio. Everything worked out beautifully in the end. It’s the kind of situation where it is very, very useful for the student to have an involved parent helping out.</p>

<p>I’m surprised to hear that your D1 is going to apply ED even though she is trying to decide between two ED schools. If she’s not overwhelmingly in love with one school, why not just wait for RD?</p>

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<p>^She is agonizing over two top choices…she would be happy with either one.</p>

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<p>This thread seems to get a lot less traffic than the 3.0 – 3.3 students one. And certainly much less than the 3.7+ student thread (aka Parents of the HS Class of 2012). Nonetheless, this is where D2 falls so I’ll post her good news here. Hopefully it can provide some encouragement for those students who work hard, challenge themselves, but struggle to get top marks.</p>

<p>D2 spent her high school years under the shadow of her older sister who was one of the prototypical CC high stats kids. More than a handful of teachers compared her unfavorably to her sister as a student and graded her accordingly despite her obviou effort. She received more than her share of 89s (balanced by excellent grades on her NYS Regents exams). She could have rebelled and figured “why try” but she kept plugging away. She challenged herself, taking primarily honors, AP and college dual credit courses, even if that meant a B+ instead of an easy A in a basic college prep class. She has taken at least 4 courses in all five academic cores, although she could not take physics or Spanish V her senior year because of scheduling conflicts resulting from budget cuts to the school district. Her “friends” told her she could never get into a good college without physics and a fifth year of foreign language. In addition to the hit to her GPA and rank caused by taking the more difficult path, she never really got comfortable with the SAT and, to a lesser extent, the ACT. The best she could do was a few hundred points below her sister.</p>

<p>My wife and I were more than a little concerned when she fell in love with Franklin and Marshall College, becuase based on stats alone, it seemed an incredible reach. I think we tended to underestimate what else she brought to the table: a passion for her preferred academic discipline and her ECs, her leadership abilities, her ability to connect with people of all ages (including admissions officers), her perseverance and willingness to take on a challenge. </p>

<p>Yesterday, she received her acceptance letter from F&M. She applied ED so we’ll probably never know how she would have fared with admission to the other schools on her list. My guess is that she would have done quite well. </p>

<p>For the past six months or so I’ve kind of laid low on CC because it is too easy to get discouraged (even as a veteran of the college admissions cycle) reading about all the exceptional A+, 1590 SAT students who are fretting getting into a Top 10 school. The fact is, however, there are a lot of great schools out there and a lot of kids getting into them who are statistically imperfect. And a lot of these A-/B-something students are going to make as much a mark on the world (or more) than their more accomplsihed HS peers.</p>

<p>Good luck to all those parents of the less than perfect college applicants. I hope your kids receive the fat envelope they are looking for; regardless of where they end up I am sure they will end up just fine.</p>

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<p>I originally posted this info in the NHRP/Hispanic thread. Here is my son’s stats and his acceptances so far.</p>

<p>Objective:[ul]
[<em>] SAT I: READING (610), MATH (660), WRITING (640) {did not use SAT scores}
[</em>] ACT: COMPOSITE (30), ENG (30), MATH (30), READING (29), SCIENCE (32)
[<em>] SAT Subject Tests: MATH2 (740), PHYSICS (700) {only submitted SAT2 scores to Fordham & Boston College}
[</em>] Unweighted GPA (out of 4.0): 3.59
[<em>] Weighted GPA: N/A
[</em>] Rank: N/A
[<em>] AP: WORLD HIST (3), US HIST (3), PHYSICS B (3) {did not submit AP scores}
[</em>] IB: N/A
[<em>] Senior Year Course Load:
AP CALCULUS, AP PHYSICS C, AP BRITISH LITERATURE, AP PSYCHOLOGY, AMERICAN GOVERNMENT, WORLD RELIGIONS, WIND ENSEMBLE, JAZZ BAND, PHOTO 1, PHYSICS T.A.
[</em>] Major Awards: NHRP, NATIONAL HONOR SOCIETY, AP SCHOLAR
[/ul]Subjective:[ul]
[<em>] Extracurriculars:
-Wind Ensemble; Jazz Band; Marching Band; Private lessons; Grades 9,10,11,12; 16 Hrs/Week;
1st alto saxophone position -Wind Ensemble; 1st tenor saxophone position -Jazz Band; Varsity letter/pin in Marching Band.
-Coordinator / Leader
Faith Formation; Lector Society; Urban Plunge; Junior Encounter; Grades 10,11,12; 5 Hours/Week;
Assists in planning and leading faith-based freshman activities and 9th, 10th, 11th grade retreats; Lector and altar server at Mass.
[</em>] Job/Work Experience:
Lab assistant, Grade 11; 12 Hrs/Week, Total Hours: 192
[<em>] Volunteer/Community service:
-Helped rebuild homes for the Katrina victims in New Orleans, Louisiana. Grade 11; Total Hours: 40;
-Helped distribute food and other necessities to the homeless street people. Grade 11; Total Hours: 12;
-Executive board member/Student Environmental Grant Appropriations; Grades 11; Total Hours: 30; Assisted in decision-making on the distribution of grants going to local environmental projects.
[</em>] Summer Activities:
-Day camp volunteer; Summer Grade 11; 14 Hours/Week; Total Hours: 56;
-Summer Youth Leadership Program, Grade 9; Total Hours: 120; Learned leadership skills, community building, and diversity issues from community and business leaders.
[<em>] Common App Main Essay: Picked an important EC and wrote a heart-felt and revealing essay.
[</em>] EC Short Answer: Music
[<em>] Teacher Recommendation 1: ENG TEACHER - Very Good
[</em>] Teacher Recommendation 2: PHYSICS TEACHER - Very Good
[<em>] Counselor Rec: New counselor, but probably very good rec
[/ul]Other[ul]
[</em>] State: WASHINGTON
[<em>] Gender: MALE
[</em>] School Type: JESUIT CATHOLIC COLLEGE PREP
[<em>] Educational level of parents: Father/BS Engineering; Mother/some college
[</em>] Income level: 120K
[<em>] Other hooks: Music, URM {Filipino /Hispanic}
[/ul]Colleges[ul]
[</em>] Major: PHYSICS - College of Arts & Sciences
[<em>] Accepted:

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<p>Good news to report: </p>

<p>D1 was accepted to Washington University in St. Louis on Friday. Better yet, she is in both School of Art AND School of Arts and Sciences, a perfect result for her.</p>

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<p>PCP. Congrats to her! HudsonValley glad to hear your good news too. I am not surprised given the way you described your daughter. :slight_smile: windowstoheaven, glad to hear your child already has lots of good choices.</p>