The Campus Rape Myth

Student Lounge College Life
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<p>I agree with 1of42. There are nights where I remember being completely sh-- faced, and I've got the entire night photocopied in my brain, and other nights where I drank the same amount or sometimes even less where I said and did things I have no recollection of whatsoever, or I only vaguely recall it (like one night I sort of remembered falling off a seat but didn't know why I fell. apparently someone pushed it out from under me while I wasn't paying attention.) I also sometimes do things that, even though I remember them later, are uncharacteristic of me. For a while, I went through a phase where if I was even slightly upset by anything while drunk, I'd burst into tears, literally for no real reason. Do I normally start sobbing if I stub my toe or spill my drink? um NO.</p>

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<p>Ah I just checked back on this thread and Whoa!… lot of opinions here. I was just trying to clarify the point of the article that was pretty grossly misinterpreted. I don’t think this issue is supposed to be some sort of battle of the sexes or comparing tragedies.</p>

<p>The article was mostly focused on exposing the utter ridiculousness that is campus orientations explaining that 5,000 women of the 20,000 women on campus will be raped by graduation. A quick stock of your own closest female friends will immediately reveal that this statistic couldn’t possibly be true. So great, right? Who cares if they exaggerate a bit? If anything, the heightened paranoia will encourage female students to be more aware of and safer in their environment, right? Well, yes, probably, and that’s all good, but - it has lead to some serious consequences  a culture where girls throw around the word rape when it nowhere near connotes the criminal act most people think of <em>and</em> having university administrations/ organization armies jump unequivocally to the accuser. The article mentioned universities wanting to get their reported/ convicted sex crimes rate up in order to make it appear they are “catching” more of the crime that is happening. To hell with preventative measures or getting the number down, right?</p>

<p>Here’s some of my own opinions, bearing in mind I’m still relatively young and stupid:</p>

<p>As for the issue of consent, although it may be somewhat tricky (hence problems/ our discussion), I personally think it is a lot simpler than everyone makes it out to be. For instance, some people here are saying a verbal “yes, you may have sex with me” (has anyone here ever actually said that?) is required. Let me just say, without alcohol or with moderate alcohol, it is obvious to both parties (man and woman) if the woman wants to have sex or not. Okay, you both somehow ended up alone together in one party’s room, there’s heavy petting, clothes are coming off, no one’s freaking out, the girl is assisting you in the process, looks horny/happy, etc., etc., etc. There are about 10,000 different moments in the process where the girl – effective gatekeeper of all hetero sex – could derail the situation, and she knows it. Men know whether there’s consent or not – now some may choose to proceed without it – but education of/ defining “consent” to men isn’t the problem.</p>

<p>The 5% conviction rate for rape accusations interested me because it was so low. It’s actually similar to murder conviction rate and this link explains why---
Legal</a> Beagle: Panic over rape conviction rates</p>

<p>But you are missing the point—
First, this refers to the criminal court system, not universities’ private “judicial” systems where I’m sure the rate is much higher.</p>

<p>Secondly, IT DOESN’T MATTER IF YOU ARE CONVICTED OR FOUND GUILTY, IF YOU ARE ACCUSED, YOU ARE ALREADY ROYALLY SCREWED. Even if you are found not guilty.</p>

<p>There will always be people; probably even your close friends who will wonder “but did he really do it?” and have doubt lingering in their minds. Family and friends will never look at you the same. Employers won’t hire you because even though you were found innocent, you’re still a liability – and why not hire the next guy, you know, the one who hasn’t been accused of rape?</p>

<p>Prime example already mentioned in this thread: Duke Lacrosse Players.</p>

<p>Do you know how many people in this country still ardently believe they actually raped that woman? Even after there was not a shred of evidence and the prosecutor was found to be a psychopath? After that, how many people would you say still think they might have raped her; they’re still unsure/ don’t really know the details? Exactly.</p>

<p>Rape is a serious crime but it’s a lot rarer than made out to be, and frankly I’m tired of the straight up male-bashing at colleges by ultra feminist baby-boomer women. The patronizing “no means no” and “rape = bad” orientations given to males as if you were a rapist by nature and had to restrain yourself from mounting passed out girls. Demonizing your sexuality at every turn while celebrating a girl's freedom to do what she wants. Girls being told every man will rape them; that if a man touches your shoulder unannounced he just “raped” you… I think I speak for the majority of my classmates when I say, “Yes, I’m male, but I’m not a criminal and I’m sick of being treated like one by the rape groups, and being lectured about rape by female acquaintances, and what that implies.” </p>

<p>Do I lecture you about murder statistics, as if you may commit a murder in the near future and I’m helping define to you what exactly “murder” is, so that you don’t accidentally commit one?</p>

<p>Then girls cheat on their boyfriends or get ****ed at their ex or are embarrassed to rationalize to their friends who they slept with so they accuse guys of rape, knowing full well the university will back them 200%. There’s a difference between a stranger holding a knife to your throat, an Uncle forcing himself on you, or a friend inexplicably getting violent and forceful…///// and a girl getting naked and gleefully jumping on a guy’s member… only to surprise him with an accusation later. Because she really didn’t want to… or she was slightly inebriated… or whatever… and never decided to say get off me, push him away, or show any sign of disinterest… maybe after he finished she would make a comment or stop actively participating. I mean how can someone unknowingly commit rape, honestly?</p>

<p>You want to hear some real surprising statistics, one’s not fabricated by feminists in the 1960s for political reasons?</p>

<p>Twice as many men are raped each year than women. </p>

<p>Well, that’s if you include the sexual assault that occurs in prisons. But society thinks prison rape is funny, right? Huh, you don’t hear that statistic thrown around a lot. Anyway, I’m just glad this article exposed some of the BS stats that I personally had to listen during orientation.</p>

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<p>Peter Parker, you are amazing.</p>

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<p>If you look at the three major reasons for false rape accusations, they are generally irrational decisions or decisions made while woefully underinformed.</p>

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<p>From what I can tell, it's the best study out there in terms of controls and in taking a conservative approach to a study. It also appears to me to do a very good job in weeding out bias. I've seen the FBI studies which involve far more people but the study relies on statistics gathered by local police agencies. I used to work in data mining and you see all of the problems when you have a lot of people doing data entry in systems that are not well-defined or where there is insufficient training on the systems used for collection.</p>

<p>I believe that the military study (it might have been an academy) found a higher rate of false accusations - that may have been due to the harsher penalties for both parties in the case of consensual.</p>

<p>I think that it's pretty hard to argue against even-handed justice. When you get the scales tipped to one side, the other side can take advantage of it. We have a problem with the balance of information between the prosecution and the defense in that the prosecution has best access to lab testing. In the Duke Lacrosse Case, Meehan and Nifong agreed to not disclose the exculpatory information but they did provide the raw lab data. Brad Bannon, one of the defense lawyers, taught himself enough about DNA analysis to question Meehan on the stand to extract the bombshell that they agreed not to provide the exculpatory evidence.</p>

<p>[One of the charges cited by the bar said Nifong kept from the defense details of test results that found none of the players' DNA matched material found in and on the accuser.]</p>

<p>ESPN</a> - Testimony: No conspiracy to hide evidence in lacrosse case - College Sports</p>

<p>If the prosecutor and the lab can hide information or lie about results, what then no one is safe from false prosecution.</p>

<p>Perhaps you recall the case of Cynthia Sommer who was convicted of murdering her husband by arsenic poisoning and then using the proceeds of the life insurance policy to get cosmetic surgery. She went to jail over lab tests that indicated huge amounts of arsenic in his system. Of course there were problems with the lab reports but her counsel was incompetent and she went to jail and her children were split up from here.</p>

<p>[As prosecutors prepared for a second trial, ordered by a judge who ruled that Sommer received inadequate representation, they asked another lab to analyze previously untouched specimens. The samples had been embedded in paraffin wax and sealed in a drawer at a military morgue for six years.</p>

<p>The tests showed no traces of poison.</p>

<p>"This is a major forensic foul-up," said William Thompson, chair of the department of criminology, law and society at University of California, Irvine. "It's CSI gone awry."]</p>

<p>If you want to get a feel for the problems, read Until Proven Innocent by Johnson and Taylor. It should be mandatory reading for all college students.</p>

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<p>[I think crying rape when you regret doing something while drunk is pathetic. Everyone's done something stupid they regret while they were drunk (I said some dumb stuff while drunk that I totally did not remember saying the next day but it apparently ****ed off one of my friends that I said it); just because you did something a little more stupid than most (have sex with a stranger, etc) doesn't mean you were anyway forced into it. Just means you were being a stupid drunk. Ruining someone else's life isn't worth it to make yourself feel better about it.]</p>

<p>1) There are lots of people that have never been drunk (I've never been drunk and don't understand why people drink).
2) Pathetic behavior is common. Look at the police logs in any city on a regular basis or sit in court on a regular basis. Sometimes it must be pretty hard for judges to keep a straight face in proceedings.</p>

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<p>[Where are the Duke kids who were essentially kicked out of school? Still recovering from things that they didn't deserve.]</p>

<p>Finnerty is at Loyola. There's a nice picture of him with his former team after a match between Duke and Loyola at </p>

<p>k0osj7-11dukeweb.jpg</a> (image)</p>

<p>Seligmann is at Brown.</p>

<p>I've heard rumors that they received 8-figure settlements from Duke. There's nothing official of course. There are several lawsuits against the police department and other individuals by the indicted players, and the unindicted players. The unindicted players went through a really awful and undeserved persecution too and they were all under the threat of indictment.</p>

<p>Evans graduated and is presumably working for a Wall St firm.</p>

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<p>glad to know they are doing well, even after having their lives uprooted.</p>

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<p>let's not forget most victims of rape never tell about it, especially men</p>