The FAFSA is a joke

Paying for College
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There certainly are people whose needs deviate fairly significantly from the mean. However, they are a small minority. In general, the advice that is given here regarding in-state publics is good advice. I live in a very low-population state with only three state universities. Would I dream of attending any of them? No. Could I do so if it were the only financially feasible option? Yes. Is this also true for most of my peers? Yes.</p>

<p>You are doing an excellent job of beating up a strawman. I’ve never seen anyone arguing that an in-state public is the end-all solution for every single student in the country. My position is simply that - until more specific information about individual needs is provided - the best assumption we can make is that a student’s in-state public university system will provide their best option if costs elsewhere are prohibitive.</p>

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<p>*There certainly are people whose needs deviate fairly significantly from the mean. However, they are a small minority. In general, the advice that is given here regarding in-state publics is good advice. I live in a very low-population state with only three state universities. Would I dream of attending any of them? No. Could I do so if it were the only financially feasible option? Yes. Is this also true for most of my peers? Yes.</p>

<p>You are doing an excellent job of beating up a strawman. I’ve never seen anyone arguing that an in-state public is the end-all solution for every single student in the country.*</p>

<p>Agreed!</p>

<p>The bottom line is that this argument that “fit” is over-rated is based on the majority of students. Of course, the small number of students who have a unique situation or rare major are exceptions…however, exceptions do not change the fact that “fit” is largely over-rated for the majority of students.</p>

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<p>This can’t be true. My cousin has about 10k in savings and property, which is effectively her only retirement although she’s thirty, and they wanted her to use all of it to pay for school. She and her kids get state medical insurance and WIC (since you are allowed to have savings and access those programs) and I repeat, she filed and got nothing, went in to the financial aid office and they told her to take that money off the FAFSA and lie.</p>

<p>She can’t put the money in a 401(k) because, again, they are poor. They might genuinely need that money someday soon. I think her insurance has something like a $5k deductible so when they happened to invest in that they were actually figuring they’d save on insurance. They can’t have nothing in the bank.</p>

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<p>Nope. Like the vast majority of lower-middle class people, we were not within commuting distance of a university. However, I suppose in the end they were right: it was possible to get a four-year degree at a good regional college in four years without borrowing too much. A great GPA was out of my grasp, since I was working so much, and no, college was not a barrel of laughs, but then I’d much rather have my fun when I’ve reached the legal drinking age :wink: It was totally possible with a grand total of $1500 ($1000 for not being white, and $500 from my high school) in grants. Yay me. :D</p>

<p>And incidentally, the tuition at that great college is only 1.5k more now than when I graduated, and the minimum wage has increased proportionately (from 6.5 to over 8) so I still think it is possible for most kids to do it, if not entirely on their own, then certainly with minimal support.</p>

<p>Did I mention I’ve managed staff from Harvard and Yale? So I really saved a lot of money. Mwah, love ya, public education.</p>

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<p>PS… how can you be poor and save $10k? You inherit $5k in a land plot and you save up $100/month for your kids’ college every month, which is only $30/kid, for as long as your first child has been alive, and voila.</p>

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<p>*Your mom’s savings would NOT have counted if it was under a certain amount (certainly under $15k). </p>

<p>This can’t be true. My cousin has about 10k in savings and property, which is effectively her only retirement although she’s thirty, and they wanted her to use all of it to pay for school.*</p>

<p>YOU are mixing apples and oranges.</p>

<p>In YOUR case, YOU were the student, NOT your mom. YOU were your mom’s dependent. So, if she had $10k or $15k in savings, it would NOT be considered because that amount is below the limits for parents (who aren’t going to school).</p>

<p>In your COUSIN’s case, the cousin (with the savings) is the one going to school. Totally different situation.</p>

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<p>Going back to the OP, why aren’t you considering more affordable schools? As someone stated earlier the EFC helps those who are lower income get funding to attend college. In many cases that just means enough to attend a CC. If I hadn’t found an alternative many years ago that is what I would have had to do.</p>

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<p>In Wa , a family of four can qualify for WIC even if they make more than $40,000-( & to receive state medical ins you are allowed to make 250% of federal income guidelines for childrens health ins.</p>

<p>That’s commendable that your cousin was able to save $100 every month, but for many low income families, especially those not receiving subsidies , they would be hard pressed to pay their minimum bills, let alone save money consistently.</p>

<p>When our family was having a tough time- we cashed out our savings - because that is what it was for.</p>

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<p>What I’m trying to say is that we were both expected to use retirement and emergency savings for college.</p>

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<p>“When our family was having a tough time- we cashed out our savings - because that is what it was for.”</p>

<p>Exactly, but that’s why they don’t want it in a 401k or whatever and why they don’t want to spend it on college. It’s in case something major happens.</p>

<p>Anyway, I didn’t realize people were going to try to defend the FAFSA because though I come from a lower-middle/working-class town with a lot of poor people and almost nobody gets aid. I don’t know… maybe we’re doing it wrong? LOL Obviously. The high school guidance counselors aren’t that great there. But my point was not to malign the system, just to say, you have to be so incredibly poor to get a Pell Grant that it would be a miracle for you to graduate high school.</p>

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<p>Perhaps it depends on an individual’s definition of poverty. A lot of people get the Pell grant. Millions of students a year. They all graduated high school. Well most of them, some probably have GEDs. The 2011 budget request for Pell funds was $34 billion. That represents a lot of students.</p>

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<p>10,500 incredibly poor, can’t-believe-they-graduated from high school students at my school this year. Guess we should rename it Miraculous U. ;)</p>

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<p>MmeZeeZee…</p>

<p>Your mom was NOT expected to use her savings when YOU went to college. Her savings were below the protected amount for a parent (who isn’t going to college).</p>

<p>However, since YOU (the student) earned a lot of money, YOU were expected to use a good portion of THAT money towards your education. </p>

<p>You were given a highish EFC because YOU (the dependent student) earned a lot of money.</p>

<p>If you would stop confusing apples and oranges, this would all make sense. </p>

<p>Also…you may have been going to a school that didn’t meet need. Most schools cannot meet need. That’s why many choose to start at a CC and then commute to a local state school.</p>

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<p>This thread brings up the interesting question of how many people might not be getting aid because of filling out forms incorrectly. Are there any estimates on this?</p>

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<p>"
Your mom was NOT expected to use her savings when YOU went to college. Her savings were below the protected amount for a parent (who isn’t going to college).</p>

<p>However, since YOU (the student) earned a lot of money, YOU were expected to use a good portion of THAT money towards your education.</p>

<p>You were given a highish EFC because YOU (the dependent student) earned a lot of money.</p>

<p>If you would stop confusing apples and oranges, this would all make sense.</p>

<p>Also…you may have been going to a school that didn’t meet need. Most schools cannot meet need. That’s why many choose to start at a CC and then commute to a local state school."</p>

<p>I’m not confusing apples and oranges.</p>

<p>I’m talking about two different situations.</p>

<p>My freshman year, I did not have any money at all, and I was told that I did not qualify for any need-based grants. After that, yes, I decided to work and earned about $8 - 12k/year mostly over the summers which I did indeed put into school. Would I have liked to study more during the school year? Yes. But since I didn’t get grants my first year, I knew it was far too risky to count on grants based on need.</p>

<p>And when we asked why, they did tell us, that my mother’s assets (part of a house, savings in the bank) counted against us.</p>

<p>The same for a person going on their own.</p>

<p>Again, I am NOT trying to say, “Therefore, this is the same situation.”</p>

<p>What I am saying is, “Here are three different situations of people that really have to sacrifice to go to school, and we got denied need-based aid in every instance. This leads me to believe that need-based aid is only for the poorest of the poor, because if you had any less, you would truly be on the brink of homelessness.”</p>

<p>That is FINE with me. However, I think it’s silly to say that somehow, someone could get need-based aid with two working parents. There’s just no way, unless they had a lot of brothers and sisters in college.</p>

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<p>MZZ - was your mother part owner of a house aside from the house you lived in? Sounds like this is where the not qualifying came in.</p>

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<p>When you were first in college, what was your EFC?</p>

<p>Did your mom own a piece of property that was not your primary home? If so, what was its worth?</p>

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<p>No, she owned part of HER OWN HOUSE. As in, she had paid off part of her mortgage. Probably about 5% at that point. I remember that was on her taxes. I have no idea whether that counted or not, but my only guess is that they would have expected her to pay from that. Where else would the money come from?</p>

<p>I have no idea what my EFC was, as that was 15 years ago. I do remember that after sending out about 20 scholarship and grant applications, doing the FAFSA, and everything, I got what I posted here, which was one minority grant (that I didn’t even apply for, I didn’t realize I was entering that sweepstakes checking “Hispanic” as well as “white” on the form), and one merit for a total of $1500. No Pell, no need-based aid. I think my mother’s income was about $35k, sister still living at home. She did that by working nights while we stayed alone, and not taking weekends off.</p>

<p>We were actually quite proud of that, and laughed that if they could only see that she’d been on welfare less than a decade earlier.</p>

<p>My sister got no aid, and we were both in college at that time. Of course, she made the “mistake” of working for a year or two before she decided what she wanted to study.</p>

<p>And I repeat… this was a typical situation in my town. I don’t know anybody from that high school that got need-based aid, though most of us had single-income households, and many people were quite poor, some living in trailers, etc. etc. Not a lot of kids went to college but those who did, worked. And the people I met in college who got those grants were really, really poor.</p>

<p>Look, I just think that the hype around the availability of scholarships and grants is overblown. That’s all. People think there’s a lot of aid available and there really isn’t. It’s for the poorest of the poor, not the working class. That is fine. But I agree that for most people, it’s an exercise in futility if you expect anything other than loans.</p>

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<p>The debt owed or the monthly payment of the family residence is not reportable on FAFSA.
It only comes into play with the PROFILE or private schools which want to know more about your assets.</p>

<p>When I first went to college- I didn’t even * know* I was eligible for financial aid.
I was living on my own, paying rent & receiving SS survivors benefits for attending school. I didn’t know about loans or grants available, because frankly I felt lucky to receive the couple hundred bucks a month for classes. Of course some of it had to go to tuition & books at the community college & I had to quit in the first year because I needed to work, but I always felt like that was my fault for not doing better.</p>

<p>Even though both my mother & father had attended college, neither one had gotten any aid. My father worked full time while attending the local university & my mother dropped out after a year because she wasn’t really interested in it anyway- apparently, but her parents had paid for while she did.</p>

<p>When I was in high school, no one ever said a thing to me about college, about required classes, financial aid or grades. I expect that there are still a great many kids with that same experience. It’s pretty difficult to feel like further education is a possibility or even worthwhile, when you are in what feels like a dead end high school.( Even though it was in a fancy suburb)</p>

<p>& obviously even if they know about finaid, if they have mistakes when they fill out the forms, they may be denied aid erroneously.</p>

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<p>If I end up with only $20k in loans out of $220k, I’ll be pretty happy.</p>

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I didn’t think FAFSA counted home equity? aside from that, your numbers are probably a little off, as even if one manages to buy a house with $0 down payment, it is unlikely that you could borrow ANYTHING against a home already mortgaged to 95%, not to mention that 5% of what had to be a modest cost home (based on the income) would not have been much anyways.</p>