<p>It’s quite easy to be a first-generation immigrant with very limited financial assets. I’ve seen it done.</p>
<p>
No, it’s very common. In the last couple of years, my typical high-tech company has hired many foreigners who arrive with little money, but because they are highly trained, immediately earn more than the U.S. average. There’s no reason to doubt her story; she is having trouble accepting the situation.</p>
<p>With a EFC of $29K, I think her parents must be earning well above $100,000. I figured an EFC for $90K for a family of three, $20K in parental assets, $1K in student assets, and no student income, and got an EFC of just over $16K. </p>
<p>Maybe JadeLi would prefer that her parents were earning one-third their current salaries, and that therefore her family’s lifestyle was reduced accordingly?</p>
<p>token & vrosson:</p>
<p>As you surmise, and I suggest in my second sentence, the family was likely sponsored by a corporation to come over, i.e., with a nice paying job. Much better than many college grads, with “little money.” After three years, the job is paying six figures, or twice the US median income.</p>
<p>vrosson: think about your tech company. For a job to be in the six figure range after three years, what do you think the starting salary might be?</p>
<p>So, maybe, as a somewhat “recent” immigrant, Jade should be grateful she is applying and accepted as an instate applicant at instate tuition. Her parents may not have tons of assets accumulated, but they got her in the easier applicant pool and at the lower tuition rate.</p>
<p>Or would she rather be back in the country of origin attending school there? The attitude is just sad here, and I know we can all vent on an online forum, but I hope she is more gracious with her parents. I also wonder if there has been any discussion of them paying off any of her loans? Maybe, with her entitlement attitude they want to see some production, good grades and a degree and then they’ll consider paying on her loans?</p>
<p>I just visited with my Ds friend last night. One parent has been in and out of jail and not in the girl’s life much, the other parent is a low income, irregular and physically demanding work. This girl has worked for years, 2 and 3 jobs at a time, paid for her own orthodontia, her own computer, her own car, her own everything just about.</p>
<p>She is in at a far away public with no aid- why no aid? They are low income? Because she made almost $20k last year herself and she needs to keep doing that to pay for her own college. She does not think she will need any loans, already has one job lined up and will pick up another. It may take her five years and summers, but she will do and do it herself.</p>
<p>The difference between her attitude and Jade’s is stunning and who has it more unfair, a student where the family income should merit a $0 EFC, but does not because the student is working almost full time in HS or an obviously 6 figure immigrant income with a high EFC, and she is unhappy that the govt is not giving her more money?</p>
<p>Wow-some, that is what is unfair! Without the immigrant twist, we are in a similar situation to Jade. Income recently increased, didn’t save enough to make a dent. Do I wish they looked over the whole body of work for the last 10 years, sure, but they don’t. I can understand why and the OP seems reluctant to accept that this is the system. Bottom line it is tough on almost all families to sacrifice to send kids to college. What fries me is when some people think it’s OK for other families to make the finanacial sacrafice but since mine didn’t I need cash/grants/freebies. No one chooses to be poor. Be mad at your parents or get a job, but don’t wine about a system that does it’s best to accomodate the families that truly need the help.</p>
<p>Ok, How much do your parents make??? They got an EFC of 29K based on their income and savings. </p>
<p>My AGI was 50K and I had modest savings, my EFC is 11K. </p>
<p>SO I am assuming your parents make as much as 3x as me. </p>
<p>How long have they been in this country and where does their income go??</p>
<p>if you are going to be rude, I’m going to ask personal questions</p>
<p>Sure, Sue.</p>
<p>First of all, I don’t know how much my parents make but its probably a combined income of 100,000+, each making around 50-60k. This is a middle class wage, in CA, with the very high costs of living.</p>
<p>Before this my parents were making barely any money (foreign, recent immigrants), the only savings we had were to be able to pay for a move here and a down payment on a home (so we can have a place to live).</p>
<p>I have two sisters, 8 and 12, who are attending school now, but they are still an expense. </p>
<p>There is the house payments, a car payment, plus the cost of gas, food, etc, and whatever else my parents need.</p>
<p>We are in a very tight financial situation and we can not afford any luxuries. We have one Honda Civic for the whole family, always buy food from Costco, etc. We’re not poor but my parents have absolutely no money to spend. Essentially my family lives from paycheck to paycheck.</p>
<p>There have been no savings for my college for obvious reasons. </p>
<p>No one in my family even expected that I would be going to a UC or the costs entailed, but needless to say I did work my butt off in high school and I know this is the right choice for me.</p>
<p>It would seem your situation is rather unique for your family to make that much money and still have to live paycheck by paycheck. Sounds like theyve overextended their expenses and have not planned properly. Nonetheless, you’re able to qualify for loans (a luxury many poor people can not attain) and still attend your school of choice. Good news for you. However, your situation hardly merits changes to financial aid as we know it. Good luck in college.</p>
<p>[FinAid</a> | Calculators | Expected Family Contribution (EFC) and Financial Aid](<a href=“Your Guide for College Financial Aid - Finaid”>Your Guide for College Financial Aid - Finaid)</p>
<p>I played with this. family of 5, 1 in college, living in CA, oldest parent 49(a guess obviously).</p>
<p>I did this using 0 assets, and you would need to have 2 parents earning 135K to get an EFC of 29K, that isn’t chump change. </p>
<p>Yes, your situation isn’t optimal. But you are directing your anger to the wrong people. Unfortunately, it’s your parents that created the situation. They chose to come to the USA and make high wages in a high cost of living area. and You should have been able to foresee what your EFC was going to be using this calculator before you started applying to schools. You might have had better FA at a private school.</p>
<p>This is not the fault of the state of California or the US government.</p>
<p>I could ***** about the fact that as a single parent I get less than 1/2 the asset protection allowance as a married couple. But there is no point in doing that.</p>
<p>Jade, I understand your frustration. Your particular situation is unfair. Unfair in that your parents’ priorities are such that they cannot/will not pay for your college costs but are deemed able to do so on the income they have. There really is not enough money allotted to pay for everyone who feels they need it for college. What we give to families who make under $20K a year is not a whole lot more than what you are getting. The PELL which is all that is guaranteed is not even $5K And you are not even close to getting that amount given your family income. </p>
<p>Your anger is truly misdirected, however. How on earth can you begrudge the kid whose family makes less the 1/5 of what your family makes? That is really truly all they are guaranteed.. Others who get more are higher in the pecking order in terms of merit/aid or pure merit. There kids who get full rides with their parents making 5X what yours are, because of MERIT and because they picked schools that recognized their resume as worthy of MERIT. I don’t doubt that if you got into UCLA, you could have done the same. UCLA does not feel that you are what they need to pay for. There are plenty of other schools that would pay for you. </p>
<p>Savings is not the only way parents pay for college. They have to tighten the belt a LOT when a kid goes off to college. We have had to tighten our budgets a LOT when our kids go off, and I am looking for other ways to cut as well. We may well sell our house for something smaller as we have fewer people here full time. We will save on some food and other things not having our son home. That money will go towards paying his college costs. He is also working his rear end off this summer with 4 part time jobs since he could not get one full time one, trying to come up with enough so that he can pay a portion of the cost. He has been in touch with folks about a part time job during the year so he can pay for his needs. He was elated to learn that he could borrow his books at his school. He intends to work full time during Christmas and spring break. He is psyched to pay as much as he can and is borrowing as well. We too are borrowing. Though we have some savings, it is not wise for us to deplete ourselves of it, given some particular home situations that we do not expect the college or the FA system or anyone to subsidize. So we will be borrowing too. Out of the $40 of costs that he needs, son is taking care of a quarter, we are paying a quarter, borrowing a quarter, and all of us are working like mad to get the other quarter somehow.<br>
Other son who is at a state school is foregoing all vacations this summer and working a multitude of jobs too. He is hoping to pay for a third of his costs this year which would really help us out. My oldest son worked 90 + hours a week during summers and whenever he could during breaks and school year to cover his costs at college, even as we paid the tuition and board. </p>
<p>In this area, a number of my son’s friends regretfully turned down first choice, even 2nd and 3rd choice schools for financial reasons. All of these kids are what anyone would call upper middle class. Due to events and potential situations, it would not be wise for the families to spend the type of money needed for their kids to go some of the colleges that accepted them. But they do not meet any definition of need which they fully understand, and the kids did not get merit or enough merit money to pick their first choices. THis nearly happened to my son. One of his choices was a full pay state school that even paid him an allowance each month with a good chance of him making a tremendous salary when he got out. Yes, he turned it down, but nearly took it. He considered it heavily, and only turned it down after long, painful negotiations with the college of his choice that (painfully, tediously, very painfully and slowly) came up with barely enough money that it made it doable for him and us to send him there. It was very close, and it hurt my heart that my child could not just go where he pleased, but I know in my mind and heart that this is not the worst or even bad situation. It is a GOOD situation compared to the predicaments life can pose. A wonderful situation. As you get older, you may see this perspective, but hopefully not without the painful experience that some us underwent to fully realize this. You and my son, and I along with most of the kids and families posting here are the lucky ones to have the privilege to suffer financially to have the opportunity to go to a “sleep over” college of choice or to any college what so ever. Those choices are the good ones in life, believe me. This comes straight from the heart of a mom who does feel for you, but also has suffered terribly other types of choices in life that have so little good in them.</p>
<p>JadeLi,</p>
<p>Going to college in the U.S. is a privilege, not a right. If there is no way to pay for college, then you do not get to go. But you can always find a way to get a college degree by working and attending part-time or night school. Good luck.</p>
<p>Your family makes about 2x the median income for the state of California. </p>
<p>[Income</a> - Median Family Income in the Past 12 Months by Family Size](<a href=“http://www.census.gov/hhes/www/income/medincsizeandstate.html]Income”>http://www.census.gov/hhes/www/income/medincsizeandstate.html)</p>
<p>California Estimate Margin of Error<br>
Total: 64,563 +/-413<br>
2-person families 60,032 +/-524<br>
3-person families 64,766 +/-854<br>
4-person families 74,801 +/-868<br>
5-person families 64,132 +/-1,356<br>
6-person families 61,348 +/-1,096<br>
7-or-more-person families 68,030 +/-2,050</p>
<p>Sueinphilly, you do have the right to complain how single parents are treated by the financial aid process, as does Jade to complain how her predicament has put her in a tough spot. It is unfair. And those injustices need to be aired. I have sent out letters on the inconsistencies and outright unfairness that occur a lot in the FAFSA situation. To me it is an absolutely ridiculous situation that a famiy making $20k and an EFC of zero is guaranteed nothing but a Pell of less than $5K if the kid goes full time and a bunch of loans, that such familes and kid are going to have a terrible time repaying. Not a lot of options there. We pay more to send kids to jail. </p>
<p>Where I have a problem with Jade, in addition to the mean tone of her posts, is that she seems to feel that the those kids who come from lower income families who are truly getting far, far less in opportunities than she has, are getting a windfall in financial aid. Yes, there are those who do hit the financial aid jackpot, but it is few and far between and need is not the only thing in the equation to get the money. To dump on a group that is far, far less fortunate is ludicrous. Especially when a family can, if it pleases, to divest itself of income and assets to take the chances to get the “privileges” of the lower income folk. Not a choice most will take. There is too little out there for everybody. No need to try to take from those less fortunate. </p>
<p>The whole concept of merit aid is one that comes under a lot of attack because that is where many better off kids make out. Alot of unfairness there. A kid from a wealthy family can enjoy full merit money whereas with kids who are on aid most often have it offset so that they are going to get exactly what is considered needed. I know in my day, we were able to double dip and government aid was more generous. </p>
<p>But then when we look at other social programs where the needs are even more, it is tough to make college funding the top priority in ones campaigns. Both on a personal and political basis.</p>
<p>[2008-2009</a> On-Campus Housing Rates](<a href=“http://map.ais.ucla.edu/portal/site/UCLA/menuitem.789d0eb6c76e7ef0d66b02ddf848344a/?vgnextoid=cd6024df52071110VgnVCM200000ddd76180RCRD]2008-2009”>http://map.ais.ucla.edu/portal/site/UCLA/menuitem.789d0eb6c76e7ef0d66b02ddf848344a/?vgnextoid=cd6024df52071110VgnVCM200000ddd76180RCRD)
most expensive dorm and meal plan is just over 15K. </p>
<p>[UCLA</a> Undergrad Admissions: Fees, Tuition, and Estimated Student Budget](<a href=“http://www.admissions.ucla.edu/prospect/budget.htm]UCLA”>Tuition and Fees | UCLA Undergraduate Admission)
if you substitute 15K for the 12,890 listed here, that is still ONLY 25K for Tuition, fees, room and board and books.</p>
<p>WHATTA BARGAIN for CA residents.</p>
<p>Not really a bargain, sueinphllly, whent you look at COA at the southern schools or even NY. It is very expensive to go to “sleep away” school in CA. I think I suggested to the OP that she go to a local school if she is too far away from UCLA to commute. SOme of the UCs such as Irvine (I think), Riverside and some lesser known ones have some great merit scholarship packages as well where full costs can be covered. To get the sort from UCLA is very competitive and difficult. But when should college include the cost of room and board? OP could probably gotten a much less expensive option as she seems to be a very qualified student. It’s just not going to be at UCLA. Hurts, when she as a young person feels she has earned the right to go there as she has earned the acceptance for performing well academically. It’s a tough thing to realize that in this country, higher education is not guaranteed. In many countries, no education is guaranteed and money is absolutely needed for even kids to get schooling. Here we ensure free education up through highschool, but beyond that money is needed with a lot of places to look for the money, but no easy one way for all the possibilities. Enough to drive anyone nuts.</p>
<p>25K a year is a bargain when you compare it to the COA of many private schools at over 50K. Parents earning 130K should be able to afford and finance that without breaking the bank. Nobody forces anyone to buy a house. They surely could have rented and used the cash to pay for college. </p>
<p>Agreed that the OP is being ungrateful and unrealistic.</p>
<p>I agree that 25K is good compared to private schools. But the UCs are not private. That is a hefty price, especially since it makes no guarantee nor does it meet all need. </p>
<p>There are flaws in the fin aid system, and OP has hit on some of them; the situation of kids whose parents won’t or can’t pay EFC, cost of living in high rent areas not taken into account, and prior years’ of income not taken into account. I have complained about those items myself and sent that and a list of other “flaws” to several places, in hopes that if reform or change is done that those discrepancies are addressed. </p>
<p>What is particularly frustrating is the complexity of our financial aid, affordable college process. I know as a kid I had no idea of how it worked; nor did my parents. It was a fluke that I found some schools that would pay my way as I did not know the ropes. My GCs were useless in that regard. My father who should have known more than he did, did not. And when my kids applied to schools, I found that I had a lot of misconceptions and did not know how things worked either, despite the fact that I was more informed than most parents. The GCs, considered top drawer, at S’s school was not helpful in that regard either. The information sessions did not help either. I don’t know how parents who have to do all of this on their own, much less the kids, can figure all of this out, until too late. With S1, we ended up with just one scholarship, when we had thought his way would be paid (national level athlete). S2, we really bungled when he wanted to get into a difficult to get accepted program. S3, we finally kind of got it right, but still surprises along the way. For us the results were not disasterous as we have the income to pay college costs, and had enough options so that low cost alternatives were available, but we did not do the best we could have. For first generation kids in this country, it is truly difficult, and many of the GCs do not give adequate help. The woman who does my hair got horrible advice to the point that I felt I had to get involved, from her school GC regarding her kids. This is considered a good, top 100 high school. When it comes to financial/merit, the schools here do a lousy job. THe catholic schools here seem to do the best job in that regard.</p>
<p>I think the most expensive public school in PA, Penn State is about the same price for instate students. They are also not known for great aid.</p>
<p>The flaw is that there is no way to give everyone who thinks they ‘need’ ‘deserve’ money for whichever college they want to go to. The flaw is that is that it costs 15K to go to one of the cheapest state schools. The flaw is not that a family earning 130K a year doesn’t qualify for need based aid. Like you said earlier, full Pell is ~5k and freshman stafford is 5500 (or more if your parents can’t get Plus loan) and that 10.5K isn’t going to pay for most ‘sleepover’ colleges. I have no idea how Cal grants and Regents or other state grants work. But even if you get them all, college costs can be a stretch for most people.</p>
<p>The flaw is that they don’t tell parents that the day their children are born, they should start living like paupers to save every penny. They don’t say “hey that 3K you are spending in 2008 for Disney world would be worth a semester of state tuition in 15 years”. The flaw is that nobody would listen to them even if they knew that to be fact. The flaw is that those same people might be crying foul when they don’t the meager free funds that the govt does ‘give out’ when those kids are ready for college. </p>
<p>My son’s school is now nearly 52K a year. Even with a 30K scholarship, and my EFC of 11K this year and 2400 Perkins and 5500 stafford, that still doesn’t add up to the total cost </p>
<p>I figure on paying out of my pocket, from savings, about 65K over 4 years, my entire life savings earned from a job I started in 1991 at 13.5K, topping out today at 67K (AGI is much lower because of pre-tax retirement that FAFSA adds back anyway). </p>
<p>And my son will have ~30K in federal student loans.<br>
Let me know when ‘fair’ kicks in…</p>