No idea, but I imagine NYU would be a security nightmare.
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Would you be comfortable sharing what state uni your DD goes to? There’s a sizable difference in opportunities for UMich vs say UAlabama.
She’s since graduated, but UGA. Foundation Fellowship.
I recently helped a student on a full ride at a school ranked much lower than Bama get a full time offer at MBB. The summer before he interned at a tier 2 consulting firm. Just took more hustle.
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Wow, that’s amazing. I really wish prestige wasn’t so huge at consulting firms. Some firms would rather a B.A. major at a state school work 10x as hard to get to where another student at say, harvard is. Also so many of the target schools are $$$. This made me feel better about applying to schools I truly want to go to that aren’t target. Thank you.
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Is there a link to UGA Terry’s career outcomes?
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You are humble, it also took the support of someone such as yourself. Nice of you to mentor and help bridge the opportunity gap!
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Thanks, I couldn’t find it. Nice detail by Terry. Four graduates in 2020 went to MBB. Probably a down year for consulting hires with COVID. Three went to Bain and one to McKinsey. Two finance, one economics and one MIS.
There were others; just not in Terry.
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A related topic in Wall Street Journal recently:
“Is College Worth the Cost? That Depends”
“…One of the nation’s highest-return programs is the computer-science major at Harvard University. This degree has an expected value of more than $3 million. But attending the nation’s most elite school is no guarantee of financial security. Harvard’s ethnic and gender studies program leaves its students worse off by around $47,000 on average, according to my estimates…”
I imagine for ethic and gender studies it is either their cost of attending is zero or money is no object. Its also curious that the not so good Harvard CS still manages to have a big payoff.
Ignoring issues with the often small sample size of students in the CollegeScorecard database used for such estimates and issues with extrapolating lifetime earnings from new grad salary <2 years out of college, CS starting salary has a strong dependence on location. Very high cost of living areas like Silicon Valley, Boston, and Seattle tend to be associated with very high salaries. I expect the higher average starting salary among Harvard grads largely relates to having a talented group that tends to ace technical interview questions and chooses to work in very high cost of living areas, rather than CS employers being wowed by the Harvard name.
Along the same lines , GeorgiaTech is usually ranked far above Harvard in CS. GeorgiaTech is sometimes ranked as high as #1, depending on ranking criteria. GeorgiaTech is also big on co-ops, so GT grads often have great work experience at the companies that hire them. Yet compared to Harvard and other similar selective colleges, their CollegeScorecard listed salary is far less impressive. Some specific numbers are below. I expect GeorgiaTech grads are more likely to choose to stay in the southeast and/or Georgia area ,often at the company where they did their co-op. This area has a lower cost of living (compared to SV and Boston) and is associated with a lower salary.
CollegeScorecard Salary for CS Majors
Brown – $154k
Harvard – $129k
Berkeley – $125k
Rose Hulman – $112k
Bowdoin – $104k
GeorgiaTech – $91k
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With Brown and Harvard within 60 miles of one another to what do you attribute Brown’s near 20% premium vs Harvard’s starting salary?
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Mostly issues with small sample size not be representative of the full student body, but portion that chooses to work in high cost living areas also contributes. A summary of location in the Brown post-grad survey is below. Note that nearly all Brown CS grads choose to live in one of 4 high cost of living areas – Silicon Valley, NYC, Boston, or Seattle. Harvard many not be quite as high for these 4 areas, or may be weighted more towards Boston and less towards SV.
Most Common Brown CS Grad First Job Locations
- Silicon Valley – 44%
- NYC – 18%
- Boston – 16%
- Seattle – 15%
- Local Rhode Island – 2%
Other – 5%
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Exactly. The rhetoric on this topic mirrors that we see on the LAC vs. Big Research debates. Then it becomes the war of anecdotes.
It’s really simple when you boil it down: some people/organizations will give a kid with an elite college degree the benefit of the doubt over a kid from a college that was ostensibly easier to get into. This could happen in any number of social/employment/other contexts. Many won’t care one way or the other. A tiny fraction may even hold it against the kid assuming that the kid will be a prima donna or something.
Most clear thinking people are not of the view that the Ivy League promises a long life of wine and roses, as one poster put it. I don’t know why that rhetoric ever makes its way into these discussions.
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A couple years ago, I hired an Emory grad who had some nice jobs out of undergrad. The other post-grad applicants were a mixed bag and none had the academic pedigree she had (i.e., top 40). She didn’t disappoint but wanted to present to the c-suite within a few months and left for a private equity job.
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Or it could be that kids who choose those fields of study are drawn to jobs that present a different ROI analysis. Not everyone goes to Harvard to make money. Of course, if they have to borrow 100s of thousands of dollars to get that degree, then of course they need to re-think what they’re going to do when they graduate. Every elite school poster I’ve encountered here agrees with that point. I’ve yet to read anyone post, “Do whatever you have to do to pay for Harvard.” Most people are aware that debt is dangerous. It’s just a question of how much.
Related question: does the Harvard ethnic studies major fare any better than the directional state U ethnic studies major? What do ethnic studies majors tend to want to go on and do? Why do they major in those courses of study?
And, where are all these people who are saying, “If you go to Harvard you’re financially set for life.”? I literally have never read anyone write that or heard anyone say it. Not even when this topic comes up among the relatively ill-informed. I’ve never heard anyone go that far and sound so ridiculous.
Why, then, is the discussion always thus framed?
Meaning she expected to appear before the c-suite and make a presentation before she was ready?
Well, she was certainly capable but not patient enough to just lead certain parts of a presentation. Always asking for more. 28 year old senior analyst.
It’s a complaint I heard recently from a Big 4 partner about UT-Austin grads vs. another large in-state university. Always wanting the big projects and spotlight. There’s definitely some value to the chutzpah.
I also had another senior analyst who attended a regional university. The CFO said he had a big head. Like the Emory grad, he also left our company for a $20K+ raise. In one year, he’s now onto his second company and got another $20K raise. He started out with much less prestigious employers than the Emory grad but they’re basically in the same place now. He also needed a Masters in Finance while she did not.
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This has been an issue for over a decade. The participation award generation believes they are so important that they should be heard. They don’t care about your experience, they have the answer.
That can be a very powerful career propellant, but those who can’t back it up with both subject matter and political expertise often crash and burn into another job at another firm. The trick is to “sell” someone else on your accomplishments before anyone can measure them.
I think that these dynamics lead older firms to fail now. The younger folks have good ideas about innovation and change (both business and culture) but don’t know enough not to break things. They’re great at startups, but don’t do well in large, historically stable environments.
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You seem to be saying this is millennial rather than school driven. That’s a generalization that I can get behind.