<p>My D just finished the process (ended up getting in ED) and was in touch with coaches from UAA, NESCAC and other top LACs. They all pursued her to one degree or another. My impression is that only NESCAC has actual slots, but the other schools have “the list.” A smart coach is going to woo good athletes who will be admissible for academic reasons; if he can get a similarly admissible candidate who is a great athlete, he’ll hustle even harder to get that person to apply. Those applicants will be at the top of his list.</p>
<p>At the school she applied to, my D was told she was a top recruit and almost certain to be admitted ED. In her case, this clearly had much to do with her strong academic and extracurricular accomplishments - not just sports. The coach was very candid about RD being much harder to predict. Coach still gives input on the recruits in that round, but that input is just part of the candidate’s overall profile. How much interest the coach has at that point will depend on how many got in ED and EDII. If the team’s vacancies are largely filled, admissions is not going to give a ton of weight to a coach request at that point.</p>
<p>I know of 2 examples first hand of a UAA school that accepted an athlete whose stats were waYYYY below the norms of that school, but both outstanding athletes. One was in 1999, and this school did win at least one NCAA chamiponship while she was there, the other is now a senior there, and the team is doing very well. The coach must have had some pull.</p>
<p>Also, when D was going through this process 3 years ago, the coaches from two different Californi schools in the same conference a Pomona called to let us know when the coaches were going to meet with the admissions office, and what the happy outcomes were. This was RD. Overall I found the process to vary by conference.</p>
<p>Regarding coach pull. These are what my observations:</p>
<ol>
<li>Discussion with a coach while school visiting - “All based on academic” , UAA</li>
<li>Email from a coach “If you were in, we would take a look”, UAA</li>
<li>Email from a coach “We are looking for speed and agile players, maybe you can play at JV”, UAA</li>
<li>Some emails from other than UAA “We want you”, top LAC schools</li>
<li>No response from Ivies at all</li>
</ol>
<p>What do I learned from these:</p>
<ol>
<li>This is a myth and where is a balance between athletic and academic that depends on schools from schools.</li>
<li>Bottom line is your athletic ability that puts you a better position if your academic is within their norm since they are recruiting athletic/student not student/athletic. </li>
<li>There are pulls from coaches otherwise there is no team except MIT and CalTec maybe.</li>
<li>Stronger academic schools are toward athletic since they will get a ton of stronger academic students anyway and vice reverse.</li>
</ol>
<p>KafkaDream, it’s important that you know where you rank with a coach, and just as a coach may ask you where his program/school stand among your college choices, it is entirely appropriate to ask where you are on a coach’s list.</p>
<p>The way my son was made to understand it, at a selective school, being an athletic recruit is basically and extra “+” on an applicant’s file, not a whole bunch more. Basically, the coach explained that he has absolutely no pull to get a candidate admitted if he is not already well within the pool of academically admissible. If, however, the applicant/recruit is in the pool of those who receive serious consideration from the admissions committee–the coach’s request will carry some (varying) weight. My son’s academic qualifications placed him at the bottom-end of the top 25% of applicants (e.g., he was academically desirable) at a school with a less than 30% admission rate. Son knew that with his grades and scores the school was not a sure thing because it’s basically a reach for everyone----however, the coach made clear that his request would probably be enough to get him admitted. However, life dealt S1 other cards and he decided that he did not want to play his sport in college.</p>
<p>anyone have any experience with amherst college or top LAC’s? im waiting to hear from admissions, have been assured by the head football coach face to face that i am a “no brainer” and that im academically strong enough to get in without a slot based on only my sat scores (1490). ive heard that they take football pretty seriously at amherst and williams but there is a whole lot of pressure this week. Ive been lied to already by harvard penn and brown i cant take nemore</p>
<p>abstract17 – My S has dealt with coaches at NESCAC schools in a different sport, so I can’t speak to football from personal experience, but from his experience and from what I’ve read and heard about football and admissions at these schools, I have some observations. First, football tends to be a sport in which it still is difficult to find enough student athletes with the academic credentials necessary for admission to the schools you’ve mentioned, so I suspect a 1490 is a very good score from that perspective. And, it’s a terrific score also for college admissions generally. But, for these schools, even students with perfect 800s aren’t “no brainers” for admission. These schools could pretty much fill a class with applicants like that. Fortunately, they don’t want to. In my son’s case, though, with scores like yours and no slot, he has not been told by the coach that he’s a “no brainer” for admission even though he is on the coach’s list. With there being so many more football players than there are players in his sport, the coach you’ve been talking to may not just be feeding you a line. I hope it works out for you.</p>
<p>DS was deferred from EA to RD at probably the least athletic school in the country where he was being ‘recruited.’ Coach told him this weekend that as soon as he found out DS was deferred, he rushed over to admissions and demanded to get him “un-deferred.”</p>
<p>Wonder if he realizes that could well mean an outright rejection :)</p>
<p>^ Which of the nerd juggernaut schools was this, ihs? Either way best of luck to your son. Needless to say, that would be, as we say in teenage vernacular, a really dick move for the school to “un-defer” him just to reject him.</p>
<p>My S is wondering what to do. He was an athletic recruit and was told to go EAI by the coach. Unfortunately he was deferred, told they wanted to see his mid term grades, particularly in his 2 AP classes. Everything else on the application etc. was fine. However another coach/school now wants him to go EA II . Midterm grades come out next week after midterms and his grades have definitely gone up. SO what to do? Are his chances in RD at the first school so significantly diminished that he should take the ED II or does he just go RD at both and see how it all works out?</p>
<p>misswan – If it were my S, the first thing I’d do is find out very clearly from each coach what level of support he has from the coach (like where he ranks among the coach’s recruits) and what the coach’s support means in the admissions process in both the EDII and the RD scenarios. In other words, for School 2, how will applying EDII improve his chances over RD, if at all? Unless it’s significant and it’s obvious to you from the school’s admit % and your S’s stats (and certainly if financial aid is an issue) that your S needs the EDII boost, I’d just let the RD process play out so he can have all his options. Another factor: have these coaches guaranteed S a roster spot for the first year if admitted? At one of my S’s schools, everyone has to go through a preseason try-out, even if on the team already or a recruit, so for him there was no reason to apply ED and give up all other schools recruiting him. Every school is different, so it’s important that you have as much information as possible before making an EDII decision.</p>
<p>royal73 Yes thanks for the insights. I think for my S his credentials at school 2 can get him in without coach support. However, the question is will the coach think he is less serious about attending there if he does not go EDII?
At school 1, I think he was also getting in mostly on his own merits because if he had a slot or tip from the coach he would not have been deferred ED1. I’m guessing coaches use up their slots or tips in ED1 on the most desirable players who may have lesser credentials.
The comment about a secured roster spot is interesting because so far we assumed that all recruits had a spot. However, in speaking with coach 2, we heard mention that he would be cutting current players in order to meet the number allowed on the roster.
Does this mean there is an official try-out? Did not seem so. But even it it’s unofficial I guess it’s still happening.
Just wanted to say both coaches have been extremely professional , helpful and encouraging.</p>
<p>A similar situation here last year… school was pressuring son to go EDII but his stats suggested he was a very strong applicant on the merits of his application alone without playing at all. Question: Would the EDII school be a likely 2nd choice? As this was not the case for son, so it wasn’t that difficult to not go EDII. It would seem that the coach for the ED school is supporting your S’s application… not sure if that will translate into an UNdeferred, but will probs not result in a rejection because of it. Our son spoke directly to the school where they did not have EDII (that was really high on his list) and explained the situation and was told that it was highly likely he would be accepted regular decision to the EDII school RD and even though he had no more tips or slots or whatever, he also felt S was a very likely candidate to his school. As it was, we let the chips fall where they did and he ended up living happily ever after (one semester). :)</p>
<p>I also wondered about the guaranteed roster spot and did a little digging comparing the recruited lists on a website that lists such things. Every year for the past four, there have been “recruited” freshman who were not on the year’s roster and it has since been confirmed that the entire team has to try out each year. No spot is a given. Would hard to stay competitive if there was no incentive to keep getting better to stay on the team.</p>
<p>This recruiting situation differs by gender and sport, gender being most important for female athletes who hope to attend a university that has a football program, which opens up more scholarship money for girls (due to title 9 laws mandating equality). If an athlete is a revenue sport athlete (i.e. Division I football and men’s basketball), then the coaches have more pull and the athletes they really want almost always get in.
Coaches will lie. They will. They do. They are, like you, keeping their options open. No matter who gets accepted and sends a letter of intent, a coach never knows who he will have until the first day of class, so the coach will carefully disclose or non-disclose certain facts to leave certain impressions with recruits so he has back-up plans. However, if a recruit (and their parents) directly ask a coach about where the coach sees them in the program (or on a depth chart for the sport), the coach will generally not want to be caught in a lie so they will tell you the truth. Every sport has a place like college confidential where one can find out who has committed or is being recruited by whom. It isn’t hard to figure out where you might be on the coache’s priority list if you are ranked number 50 in your sport nationally and they have a verbal commitment from someone at your position ranked number 25. It’s okay for recruits to ask direct questions and it is okay for their parents to be there teaching them how to do so.</p>
<p>missswan–For my son’s sport the rosters range from 25-30 at the schools he’s applied to. Financial aid is an issue for us, so last year when coaches raised the subject of ED application, he was able to say quite honestly that he might have to take his chances and apply RD so we could weigh FA offers. At one school where he definitely would be admitted RD and was guaranteed a 1st year roster spot if he committed last fall, he had to accept that all roster spots might be filled by spring if he went the RD route. He still could try out with upper class players, but the coach wanted to fill his roster through the ED process if he could and most of his recruits needed ED to improve admission chances, so there was a good chance S would have to fight for a spot on the roster if he ended up there.</p>
<p>It sounds as if the coaches you’re dealing with will be open with you, so they should be willing to answer your questions. We have been fortunate in that, too. S ended up applying ED II to the school that was tops academically and athletically for him (we’re keeping fingers crossed on financial aid). He let the other coaches know he did and no one has cut him loose. They have been gracious and professional.</p>
<p>It’s important to know what the process is and what the opportunities are at each school. Certainly there are horror stories about outright lies and deceptions, but the more direct questions you and/or your child ask, the better, I think.</p>
<p>Royal, I think your son plays same sport as my son. So maybe you can help?</p>
<p>DS is applying few top LAC schools but there was only one replied yesterday and his package sent two months ago almost. Rest of them just ignored him. DS is applying RD. Does he contact coaches now or wait for admission out since he is not recruited? </p>
<p>My son has been told at a number of colleges that he is their number one recruit for his position, he applied EA at those schools, he was told he would be supported by the coach at his number one school (good quality LAC). He was extremely surprised to be notified that he had been waitlisted (on the bubble academically 1500 SAT, 85.5 weighted average, attends a Prep School). The coach was away when the admin decision was made. The coach discussed the situation with Admin., and confirmed that they will review his application again and get back to us in a week. What do you make of this ??? We are very confused ??</p>