<p>I guess the AD's public support of Charley Weis proves that the "too big to fail" doctrine is being practiced at Notre Dame. Charlie with his hefty size and salary is apprarently "too big to fail" no matter how bad the team's results are. </p>
<p>I really fear the USC game. USC needs a real blowout to have any hope of getting to the BCS championship game with their one loss, and we stand in the way with our genius coach leading us. It would break my heart if USC then decides that BYU or Oklahoma or even Boise State could better fill the seats in the Coliseum in the future.</p>
<p>Coach Weis has got to start getting it together.</p>
<p>I agree with you, but you have to look at the differences between Willingham and Weis. Willingham didn't try to recruit his last several years at ND, which is what hurt last year and is hurting some this year. Yes, this team was recruited by Weis, but many of the current seniors (if not most) would not get a scholarship offer to ND today. We had to take them to fill massive holes caused by Willingham's recruiting, we couldn't be choosy. </p>
<p>I think Weis deserves one more year. As the talent builds and gets experience I think we will see great improvement. If we lose to Navy again, however, all bets are off. That can never happen again as far as I am concerned (though don't get me wrong, I respect that team more than anything. This is a great game because both sets of fans like each other!)</p>
<p>Thank God we were playing 240 lb. bordeline FBS players this afternoon. Navy should not be a competitive game for the players on the ND roster. My opinion is unchanged.</p>
<p>USC would never end the ND rivalry, and vice versa. There is a longstanding respect between both administrations (e.g. - Dr. Sample,the USC president, received an honorary doctorate from ND 4 or 5 years ago) that goes well beyond one team having a sustained downturn in quality play. This rivalry means too much to both schools to ever end; ND and Rockne helped put SC on the map many years ago, and over the years SC has been the only one of ND's traditional rivals (can't count Michigan; they play ND sporadically) that approaches ND in football prestige and tradition. This rivalry will always survive.</p>
<p>Yankees1-Notre Dame football strikes me as a lot like General Motors. It was once the greatest industrial corporation and one would ask -how could a firm with its reputation ever fail. "It will always survive." Even a year ago it had a share price of $35, but has suffered through a "sustained downturn in quality" economic results. A small upstart that had less than 5% of the market in 1975 named Toyota is now bigger than GM.</p>
<p>Notre Dame, the team I grew up with and remember whipping Texas in the Cotton Bowl and Alabema in the Sugar, cannot live on reputation forever. We are looking at a 20 year sustained downturn that includes no national titles or major (or for that matter any) bowl victories. The Toyota in the analogy is Boston College, with whom we cannot play a competitive game any longer, and who threatens to steal ND's niche. ND even looks like it is now afraid to schedule them.</p>
<p>If we get ripped by USC like we have been the past 2 years, the whole thing can come crashing in. I am not comforted that Jenkins is handing out honorary degrees to everyone who can help to hold together the dam on Notre Dame football-Immelt of GE/NBC got one last year I think and as you point out Sample did as well. While these guys probably deserve to be honored, they have economic interests and pressures they must address as well, no matter how much they love or respect Notre Dame. </p>
<p>Notre Dame simply does not look like a top 25ish team. With the level of talent on the roster, the answer lies, in my view with the coaching. You may disagree and you may disagree that the consequences are as serious as I think they are. But I think change is needed.</p>
<p>Change may be needed; however, many people (alums, boosters) have lost a LOT of money in the stock market. And, unless the economy turns around quickly, I personally don't see any change coming. Plus, Who would replace CW? There are several colleges looking for head coaches these days. I may be wrong, but I just don't see change coming any time soon!</p>
<p>PS--as far as Alabama, (ranked #1 right now), Nick Saban walked into a loaded, full house that had been recruited by the previous coach, Mike Shula. Shula just wasn't coaching; however, he knew how to recruit. Nick Saban is also being paid an exhorbitant amount of money for his coaching abilities as well, and so far, he seems to be earning it!</p>
<p>Don't you think Charlie Weis has a lot harder job recruiting athletes to come to ND than Pete Carroll, Nick Saban, or the BC Head Coach? ND refuses to sacrifice its academic integrity, and admit athletes that have academic credentials well below the credentials of the general student-body population. I think that both BC and USC are wonderful schools, but I think their administrations are far more liberal in the admissions standards that their student-athletes are held to than ND is.</p>
<p>In my view of purgatory, there is unsalted popcorn and Ivy League football on the big screen. </p>
<p>In my view of heaven, there is big time BCS football on the big screen with shrimp cocktail, beer battered fish, t-bone steaks and homestyle ribs.</p>
<p>I hope Notre Dame does not aspire to purgatory (Ivy or Patriot League) level football.</p>
<p>Yes, yes and yes! Can't speak for the other schools, but I know Nick Saban (and previously Mike Shula) have much more relaxed standards for recruiting when it comes to academics. IMO there is far more emphasis placed on football than academics at Alabama. But, I have been called out about your statement yankees1 regarding admissions standards and ND football. I doubt that half of the players at Alabama could even pass ND's admissions standards much less maintain a minimum GPA to play football at ND. And the last I checked neither USC or BC were ranked in the top 20 academically; but, how much stock do we want to place on academic rankings?!? I'm for giving our ND Irish some more time--the talent is there and I believe it will shine soon!!</p>
<p>There are 2 or more levels of college football, as well as 2 or more ways of interpreting exactly what a football team means to an institution. Is the team a reflection of the university, with a roster of players whose academic acheivments and moral virtues mirror that of the rest of the student body, or is it merly a team with the university's name or logo on its uniform, whose mission is solely to beat other schools? If it's choice #2, then it should be a level playing and recruiting field for all, with the same acceptance standards for all athletes, no matter the institution they attend. Maybe it's also time to pay athletes, since the schools are making money off of their athletic prowess.</p>
<p>However, right now, I think Charlie Weis has a tougher job than that of almost all of his peers, and I also think his love of ND keeps him from attempting to change the standards set by his superiors, as Lou Holtz often tried to do during his tenure (remember when he tried to recruit Randy Moss?).</p>
<p>Yankees1 and AL-We are in enough trouble with USC on November 29th without doing an intellectual snobbery number on a school that has something like 220 National Merit Scholars in its Freshman class. While I am sure none of these folks play football, the ones who do play can get really ticked off. Please, lets not do anything more to make things more difficult than they are on 11/29. </p>
<p>If they are on the calendar we need to be competitive and occasionally beat them. Or we need to retreat. I hope we don't retreat.</p>
<p>vienna man- I happen to have a daughter that is a sophomore at USC; I'm fully aware of what a great school it is. I'm thrilled she's there. I just happen to think that USC is not as strict on its acceptance standards for athletes as is ND. I also think they are more willing to "turn the other cheek" if an athlete gets in legal or academic trouble. </p>
<p>I don't think Pete is going to use this site as bulletin board material. I think he's always ready for this game, not just because it's ND, but also because Weis was Belichick's right hand man at New England, and Belichick was the reason he lost the New England coaching job. I think the SC defense is too much for Clausen (who I don't think much of), and SC will win handily.</p>
<p>Viennaman-not trying to sound intellectually snobby; just looking at the facts. Here's hoping for some true football spirit on both sides and honest football playing from both sides.</p>
<p>Actually, when Carroll was fired, the Patriots had no idea they would hire Belichick. Remember when Belichick refused the Jets head coaching job and turned around and signed with the Patriots within the week? Yeah, nobody knew he was going to do that.</p>
<p>I have made my case against Weis, but if the buyout cupboard is bare, ND needs to face facts and make a couple of immediate, drastic changes in its program:</p>
<p>1) It cannot continue to play USC. When the Irish are only capable of four mercy first downs courtesy of the second team USC defense and 96 yards total offense, it is clear that Charlie cannot coach his five star athletes at a level competitive with serious teams on the USC, Oklahoma, Texas, Florida (BCS) level. Year in, Year out slaughters do not help our NFL bound guys get there and are dispiriting to everyone. These kind of games lead to the unseemly extracurricular stuff we saw late in the game, which hurts the image of both teams. With Charlie in charge, we should acknowledge that we are no longer relevant at a big time level. Lets do the honorable thing and withdraw from the battle.</p>
<p>2) We will need to do some kind of major outreach with our current NFL guys to keep our most talented players from transferring. I just don't see how the guys who want NFL futures are going to put up with the schedule we have next year and Weis' continued erractic coaching. I also don't see how we recruit new talent as well.</p>
<p>Or, we could recruit a real coach that could take a team that has an 80,000 seat stadium and its own television network to the National level where it belongs, (and stay within two touchdowns of a BCS caliber team.)</p>
<p>
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Willingham didn't try to recruit his last several years at ND, which is what hurt last year and is hurting some this year.
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</p>
<p>Please - recruiting under Willingham was still better than at schools like Northwestern (which crushed Syracuse this season), Cincinnati, Navy, etc.</p>
<p>
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ND refuses to sacrifice its academic integrity, and admit athletes that have academic credentials well below the credentials of the general student-body population.
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</p>
<p>While ND's recruiting standards are higher than say, SEC schools, it's not that much higher than a school like Michigan.</p>
<p>The whole ND FB academics is mostly a myth (just like Duke BB - where Duke players had an average SAT score in the mid-900s in the 1990s).</p>
<p>And, k&s, an SEC school is ranked no. 1--Alabama--! And yes, their athletes could probably NOT gain admittance to ND much less graduate. Does ND want to be ranked no. 1? Florida is ranked no. 2 in some polls and is also an SEC school. Seems to me that ND may need to make some adjustments if football is what they want, and I hope it is not football over academics. Our student is there for the academics. But, in recent years, the SEC seems to have dominated in part because they accept students with much lower academic records. These schools also, as I mentioned, do not have the athlete graduation rates that ND offers. ND needs to make some decisions!!</p>
<p>^ Uhh, PSU came close to playing for the national championship (also came close a few years ago) and they graduate 80% of their FB players and they don't have as low standards as many SEC schools.</p>
<p>Northwestern, which has a bit higher standard for recruits than ND, easily beat Syracuse this season.</p>
<p>Other schools w/ decent academic standards (like Wake and BC) for recruits have also found recent success on the gridiron.</p>
<p>This whole "academics thing" is just an easy excuse (even if academics prevents ND from beating the no.1 SEC school, it still shouldn't prevent ND from making it to the national championship game, much less a BCS bowl or achieve the level of success that BC, Wake or NU have achieved in the past decade or two).</p>