<p>My son and I met up with the shacherry family at Montclair, and we liked the campus too–really different from anything I’ve ever seen. The mainstage theater building wasn’t open, but we were able to walk around the arts classroom building, which felt lively and interesting and well-used. Montclair’s proximity to NYC is a bonus. And yes, shacherry, we’re looking forward to hearing how you guys enjoy the arts day (November, right?). My S will probably audition at Unifieds for Montclair and visit in the spring if it turns out to be an option for him.</p>
<p>On the other hand, my daughter had not even gotten out of the car when we arrived on campus at BU and said she loved the place. We did get to do tour and then ran to a Theater School tour taking place 20 minutes following and her heart strings were singing.
There is such thing as love at first sight, we are a visual family…</p>
<p>When we visited Marymount Manhattan, our student tour guide talked about the extensive training in the classics (Shakespeare, Moliere, etc) and told us it was really the focus of the program–don’t even know if that is right but my s wanted a little broader experience so he crossed it off his list…</p>
<p>When we visited Boston to see Emerson (which he loved), I insisted we see BU. He totally changed his mind about BU (favorable) based on the student who toured us! Shows the power of the students who do the tours!</p>
<p>Glad you insisted on the Boston University visit, abtsmom. When my son visited BU following acceptances (he was trying to decide between it and another school), he shadowed a freshman for a day and attended several classes.</p>
<p>I still remember the text he sent me after he had been on the campus for a couple of hours: “BU rocks!!!”</p>
<p>When we were touring drama programs a few years ago, we visited Purchase on a day when no one else was there. We walked around the campus on our own - and also came to the conclusion that its architecture left much to be desired. On another college trip, we visited Ithaca and Syracuse. It was mid-April and it happened to be snowing. School was in session and we were able to take a tour of each facility, including a tour of the drama department. My S was emphatic that he had no interest in Purchase or Ithaca, but was very interested in Syracuse. Initially, we thought that this was simply because he had the chance to see a Syracuse Stage production that included students and really enjoyed it. Only later did we discover that his disinterest in Purchase and Ithaca stemmed from the fact that he didn’t want to feel isolated by being on a campus where getting to amenities, such as non-campus food, required a car or bus trip!</p>
<p>Hmmm…nansan, interesting information about Purchase. It has been high on my daughter’s list. However, we are from Georgia, and she won’t be bringing a car. Is it really a bus trip or car trip to get to off campus amenities? What else can you tell me about the actual city/town area? We crossed Western Carolina off the list because it is just too rural for her. This might be a problem with Purchase, too.</p>
<p>My S also lost interest in Purchase after we visited, although that isn’t the program’s fault. The Soviet style architecture is hilarious but true–that was one problem. Really depressing architecture, except for the theatre area. But my S isn’t the sort to spend 24/7 immersed in two or three theatre rooms. So the overall environment matters a lot to him. Not only is the campus itself isolated from any amenities, but the other negative is that although Purchase touts itself as ‘close to NYC,’ it is not if you don’t have a car. You have to walk to a bus stop then take the bus to the train then take the train into the city, which takes about 45 minutes (just the train). By car the drive is about 40 minutes without traffic and it is not an easy drive (I speak as a seasoned NJ driver!). </p>
<p>That is not enough to deter many students, particularly students who are focused and can take advantage of all the positives Purchase has to offer. But for my son, it was enough and he turned down their offer. This actually makes me sad even now, years later, because I think the program would have been a good fit for him and I often wonder if his college experience would have turned out better had he ignored the depressing architecture and the relative isolation…But who knows.</p>
<p>Purchase feels like it’s on the moon, to me. But it might be a trade-off worth making for the training. It was the most rural place D applied to…an endless walk to get to the campus Starbucks, never mind anything else. Really beautiful landscape, fields and stone walls… really great training, or said to be. But incredibly isolated, especially as it’s so close to NYC.</p>
<p>Purchase is one of the top destinations for anyone who wants to study the arts. The programs are supposed to be rather grueling, with lots of hours put into performing or stage productions, etc. </p>
<p>I would imagine that weekends would be the time to mosey around outside of campus, and a bus trip to a mall, or a train ride into NYC, would seem fun and a nice break, even though it would take some coordination. And kids are kids - if they want to get into the city, or nearby towns, they’ll do it.</p>
<p>I guess I’m saying - and I know everyone is different and everyone has things that are important to them - how can you cross such a great program off your college list because you don’t like the buildings, or you can’t get non-campus food?</p>
<p>I agree with Marbleheader. For many - if not most - students, the fabulous training at Purchase would far outweigh the relative undesirability of the location.</p>
<p>No offense to anyone, but to me the objections to the campus architecture just seem silly. When we visited, we were expecting it to be horrible, based on comments here, but we thought it was really not all that bad, and the theatre/dance building is beautiful.</p>
<p>Students may feel frustrated at not having easy access to the city, but they do go in on weekends very regularly. And more importantly, Purchase faculty members have strong connections to the professional theatre world of NYC.</p>
<p>The training, plus the reasonable cost, plus the proximity to (if not the easy accessibility of) NYC, make SUNY Purchase’s BFA Acting the program with perhaps the most competitive admissions in the country. (A Juilliard acceptance would be harder to score, but I imagine that far fewer even apply.)</p>
<p>If someone did have the luxury of choosing among acceptances at Purchase and other programs, they might want to think about other “fit” issues, such as the extent to which they would feel comfortable in a very tiny company of theatre students doing very intensive work on a campus that is strongly oriented toward the arts and not very strongly oriented toward academics.</p>
<p>If my DS was lucky enough to get into Purchase, he would run, not walk as fast as he could to get there… and would not even bother to look at the buildings. I mean… come on!!</p>
<p>I very much agree with NJTheatreMom re: the issue of fit. Purchase has a great reputation, but the school culture is not for everyone, and you have to think about whether you would feel at home with the people (buildings? yeah, not as big a deal for us either). Part of our strategy for putting together a balanced list involves finding reasons to eliminate all but a few of those highly competitive programs–you can’t apply to all of 'em, and there has to be a reason to say “no, this one doesn’t feel right to me.” </p>
<p>Re: rural schools without access to “non-campus food,” this has definitely been a non-issue for my older kids. Even in regular old vanilla BA programs, there wasn’t time to go hang out in town that much–when they did, they got a ride, no big deal. But they both gravitated toward schools where there was a lot of student-generated activity, and they were very engaged in campus life. </p>
<p>It was also interesting to try to find out how much the college or university itself made use of–and contributed to–the surrounding community. Kenyon, for example, has a very cool program involving integrating academics with the local farming community, studying everything from organic farming to Amish life and its environmental impact. They make the most of their Ohio village setting, not just its so-called “cornfield location” but also its proximity to Columbus and Cleveland. And Wittenberg, where my older S attends, requires each student to take a service-learning course that involves community service in Springfield, a less-than-picturesque city that is battling a tough economy. There’s a lot to be learned there.</p>
<p>We’ve visited several theater programs in smaller cities/towns where the department was very involved with the community. So if you’re lucky enough to visit a school, it might be interesting to assess not just the location and appearance of the buildings but the extent to which the school and theater program make the most of their community. Hope this doesn’t sound sanctimonious–I just think it’s another aspect of “fit” that might be overlooked! :)</p>
<p>UArts was a standout in our visits. There were only 3 families on the tour. The guide, very smart and personable, first took us to some buildings used by everyone in the school. Then she took each student to a few classrooms that were used in the program that the student was applying to, outlined the curriculum of that program, and answered questions. On a later trip, we met the head of the program, talked to students in the program, and my D visited classes. But on this first trip, we were both so impressed with the individual attention we were given. This struck us as the opposite of the assembly-line school.</p>
<p>In fact, when I look back, those guides were important. It mattered if we got someone who could explain the program clearly, and answer questions knowledgeably, and was reasonably friendly. They weren’t all that way. At Eugene Lang in NYC, we got a tour guide who could not have been more ignorant about the school or less interested in giving a tour. She seemed to be there for the work-study money and very little else. We wondered if the school administrators ever dropped in on their tours or took an interest in who was representing them.</p>
<p>To 5boys–I realize Purchase is a top program and I said I often wonder if my son made the wrong decision. However, I do have to say that no matter how good the program is, if you feel that you don’t belong, for whatever reason, it is a huge impediment. You are spending 4 very intense years in a very small program with a handful of the same people. There really is something to ‘fit’ and ‘feel.’ I once moved to subsidized housing on the outskirts of Madison–the apartment itself was fine and clean, the neighbors was nice, but from the get go, I found it SUPER depressing. I hated the lay out of the place - windows only on one side - and the view to the parking lot with a view of a giant Coke machine that glowed at night. It was 20 minutes into town. I grew more and more depressed there even as I knew rationally it was a perfectly fine place and was what I could afford. I finally moved. And that was just housing, and I was an adult, and I was there for a year. There are other things besides reputation and logic that matter. Some people are more sensitive to environment and feel than others.</p>
<p>For a program that has a depressing environment (for you), some students are able to extract the good out of any program they are in even if it’s in Antarctica; these students are focused and mature. But not all students are like that. This isn’t meant as an attack on Purchase at all–it’s obviously a fabulous program anyway–only that there are many considerations besides reputation and a student absolutely should feel he can be there for 4 years without going out of his/her mind.</p>
<p>It does depend on temperament - some people just don’t need the “niceties” of life, and they can be focused solely on their work, or they’re just so easy-going that they really don’t have strong opinions about location, food, or even the people they spend time with.</p>
<p>I have said many times that program was the key for my D - and it still is. I don’t think we’d change her list much now, even with 2 years of hindsight. She did care about location and people, and checked as much as she could about them; all of her schools met her bare minimum, at least. She said that dorms and food really didn’t matter, but I’m not surprised that once she got to college she did find herself bothered by things like limited food choices, poor storage options in her dorm, lack of hot water, etc. Lots of this you can’t really prevent - college is often just full of those kinds of frustrations. </p>
<p>She didn’t apply to schools where she felt a negative vibe, no matter what the reason. There are so many schools, so why bother? In the end she didn’t have among her acceptances that “perfect package” of location, program and everything else that she’d envisioned (if it ever really existed). She had to compromise on something, and she decided what seemed like less-than-perfect campus life would be made up for by a program that provided the opportunities she wanted. At this point, I think she did the right thing - while the compromises were a little hard to swallow (sometimes literally!) last year, by this point she has so many friends and has found a life pattern that she loves, that the campus deficits are negligible, while the program continues to be extremely rewarding and exciting.</p>
<p>Sometimes you just don’t know. Lots of college kids transfer - I was prepared for either or both of my Ds to do that - and there is no shame in it whatsoever. I think a kid who can figure out what’s wrong with a situation and make changes to move forward is an amazingly strong and mature person. But you can’t know these things until you get there and give it a try. No college freshman is doing anything but taking a risk when they arrive for their first semester. Nothing we do can prevent that - all of this is an “educated guess,” at best.</p>
<p>I totally agree about the fit. There are so many different types of programs out there and it is going to be interesting to see what my DS likes. I was half way joking in my last post because Purchase is SO hard to get into that it is usually a mute point…LOL!!</p>
<p>This weekend I was invited to go to the first USC football game with a friend. It was an exoerience like no other. To make a long story short I just got the feeling that my DS would hate it. It was just not edgy or quirky enough. I have to say that the Cinematic School of the Arts, which has George Lucas’s name all over it is beyond anything I have ever seen. If any of your kids are into TV or movies… have them APPLY NOW!. OMG… UNBELIEVABLE! The thing is my DS is interested in live acting… not movies or TV… so …USC…ah… I am thinking not.</p>
<p>I agree with the poster that said seeing shows seems to be an important part of their process in choosing schools. For my D, that was a huge part of her final decision. For us, we wanted to make sure that the entire university was a fit, not just the drama program, so we chose to do school tours, as well as tours of the department when possible. While she is very committed to a theatre education right now, I wanted to make sure that she was in an intellectually challenging environment, regardless of major. For her, the “feel” of the university (beautiful campus, surrounding city, etc) was important, although it might not be for some. </p>
<p>Bottom line, every kid is different. AND every family’s ability and resources to do endless college visits, auditions, tours is different. We were lucky that her two final choices were close enough for an additional visit to sit in on classes, see a show, and visit with faculty and kids in more depth. In the end, the one that was a last minute addition to her list of places to audition ended up being the best fit. </p>
<p>She is a very happy freshman at American University in Washington, D.C. and is in rehearsal tonight for her first production. An exciting theatre town with lots of opportunities, a beautiful intellectually vibrant campus and a responsive, excited and busy theatre department was hiding right around the corner from our northern VA home. And now I’m close enough to get to go see her shows!</p>
<p>Best of luck and break a legs to all of your kids who will be doing the audition process this year! We saw some great schools and had a wonderful (although occasionally stressful) time last year.</p>
<p>We’re taking my son to see CMU next month. He’s decided it’s his dream school, though he has never seen it. It feels a bit cruel to start with a school that is so hard to get into and so expensive. But I have to trust that he’ll land in the right place if we show him all sorts of options. How did you all feel about visiting schools that you knew would be big reaches for your kids?</p>
<p>Funny you should mention Carnegie Mellon, dcsparent. My D auditioned there and did not get in (no big surprise…super reach, as you mentioned.) However, she was actually fairly relieved because she HATED the campus. Granted, we were there on a cold, ugly day, but I agreed with her that it is one ugly campus (apologies to those of you who love it. 
</p>
<p>Anyway, to answer your question, it was actually good that we went. She knew she would regret it if she didn’t audition at one or two super reach theatre programs…she would always wonder “what if?” But knowing that she gave it her best shot and that she really didn’t care for the campus or the surrounding area anyway, was actually very helpful when the “no” came. In her case, I was glad we went.</p>
<p>As you suggest, I think the key is seeing all kinds of options. A few good non-auditioned safety schools, a few good matches and a couple of reaches. Our kids are, in my opinion, extra brave to throw auditions into an already competitive college search process. Good to make sure they will end up with several great choices at the end of the process. Best of luck to you guys!</p>
<p>I’ve been on one million (forgive the hyperbole) college visits with our four kids. Now it’s over! Huzzah!</p>
<p>Over the years, our visits did have a profound effect on how we perceived schools, but we were never particularly systematic about it. We never in fact visited most of the schools our kids applied to (with the exception of D3, who applied to music conservatories, so she auditioned on-campus.) The main reason for this negligence was lack of time for travel. I also felt that, from the many schools we did visit, the trips were so wearing that it would be ineffective to try to absorb any more experiences. So, some schools were dutifully applied to, and some accepted my kids, but we never managed to set a foot on campus. </p>
<p>Each of my kids did have revelatory experiences at some of the campuses she visited. D1 had grown up being told that U Chicago was the place for someone of her temperament. She hated it on her visit and never applied. Same with Wesleyan, which looked like a perfect match for her on paper. Hated it. By contrast, Swarthmore was supposed to be a practice interview, since it’s nearby to us and she wanted to travel farther for school. She fell in love the moment she set foot on campus, and that is where she ended up.</p>
<p>Everyone told D2 she would love RISD. Perhaps it was just our tour, but no one even wanted to show her the glass studio. She decided not to apply. She ended up going to a small, private art school (where her high school teacher had studied) where the studio seemed welcome and open. After two years, it was too small, so she transferred sight unseen to a larger program, which she loves: a much better facility, stronger colleagues, mentors, and teachers, and more opportunities. </p>
<p>When D3 was looking at music programs, we were told repeatedly that IU is one of the happiest campuses around. Everyone loves the place. She hated the town and the campus-- found it uncomfortable and confusing. Then she won a large scholarship and we traveled back to take a second look-- again: the campus felt too big; the system hard to navigate. She chose a smaller conservatory in a much bigger city. </p>
<p>D4 grew up thinking she’d go to NYU. She visited several programs and liked them all, but for whatever reason the time she spent at NYU felt uncomfortable-- like a bad fit. It was hard to articulate why-- the school did not feel like right to her, at least not on those days when we visited. We went back twice, but the vibe was the same. When we first walked into Fordham, the school she came to think of as a perfect match, she didn’t feel a strong pull. It was a massive Q and A session for prospective applicants in a large auditorium. But after the Q and A she met with the son of a current CC member in one of the theaters. He is a double major in the two disciplines that she hoped to major in, and was able to tell her personally about the program in a way that made it real for her. That night we went to a production at the school. After that, she felt it was the best fit for her. </p>
<p>Who knows: if circumstances of weather, tour guide, travel, and parking had been different, those other colleges, rejected for “vibe” might have felt great.</p>