<p>Something that has been eating at me for a few years is the difference between Theater parents and parents of athletes in the mid-late High school years (10-12). </p>
<p>A student that is a legitimate D1 prospect in a major sport will switch schools, attend an incredible prep school for their sport, perhaps even "re-class" (drop a grade to improve recruitment). </p>
<p>You rarely see that in theater students. They attend their High School, and a good percentage of the time participate in the best local theater program. I know that transferring to Interlochen or a Performing Arts high School can be tough - and I know that an Independent School with strong Arts Funding might be a tougher sell...but isn't the payoff there?</p>
<p>Where is the disconnect? I would love to hear some thoughts of parents. </p>
<p>We considered moving to a different HS, but D was against it. In the long run, the investment of time (on her part) and money (on ours) at an independent performing arts studio gave her what she needed. Arts students are not trying to be seen by recruiters, so it’s not as important to be in a certain “program”. We also lucked out in that a new advisor for the drama club was hired her freshman year, and she turned out to be amazing… And what was once a poor to mediocre HS theatre program now holds it’s own against productions in the area with much more established programs. (Including the Sutton Foster’s alma mater HS, which is only a few miles from us). </p>
<p>I don’t believe it is necessary at all if there is good training to be had in your area. I think the disconnect is in the way sports are recruited. </p>
<p>I think what others pointed out is one of the main differences since college athletics do recruiting and arts programs don’t. </p>
<p>For those heading to college theater programs, I don’t think it is so important WHERE you go to high school. It is important to find ways to get training in singing, acting, and dance, and to have production experiences. These can be through school or outside of school. </p>
<p>On a personal front…
One of my daughter’s was on a varsity sports team all four years of college but was NOT a recruited athlete. In fact, throughout high school, she was on three different varsity sports teams and heavily involved in performing arts as well. For one of her favorite sports, ski racing (her high school winter sport), there actually is an elite private ski academy in our town and conceivably she should have been a day student there (it is also a boarding school). But not only could we never afford it, but she never would have put all her eggs in one basket, as she loved her other sports, performing arts, and academics too much. Even so, she was on the varsity ski team at her Ivy League college, which was a top team in its league. My daughter even made it to Nationals three of her four years in college. Many of her teammates had gone to elite ski academies for high school, but not all of them. Just pointing out she did well without doing any of that. </p>
<p>For my kid who went onto a BFA in MT program…we had no performing arts high schools in our state. The option to send her away to a boarding school in the arts (even if she would have loved it) was not an option due to both cost and the fact that we wanted our children to grow up at home. Our high school did put on musicals and plays and had a great music program, but it had NO drama classes! We did not rely on school as the sole place for training and experience. D took private voice lessons outside of school (50 miles away), as well as piano lessons and guitar lessons locally. She danced at a studio about 25 miles from our house. She did not have any acting classes. She was in productions both in and out of school, including community theater (there were no youth theater programs in the area at the time), and some regional professional theater, and some professional experiences out of state. She did go away 8 summers to a theater camp where there was both training and where she was in 16 different musicals and 16 cabaret troupes. The latter also exposed her to a wider group of talented peers from all over, compared to the rest of her experiences in our rural state.</p>
<p>In the end, I am a firm believer that it is the student him/herself who gets into competitive colleges or arts programs, and not so much what high school they attended. Talented high achieving kids are everywhere!</p>
<p>You also mention “re-classing”…dropping a grade level to help with recruitment (for athletes). My D who went into musical theater did just the opposite! She made the admissions process likely more challenging for herself as she chose to graduate school early at age 16 and go to college after junior year, thus with LESS years of training under her belt. </p>
<p>I offer the personal stories above as examples of no one clear pathway!</p>
<p>Get training, do theater, see theater, work hard, be motivated, and you can make it no matter where you grow up or go to high school. </p>
<p>There is also no system in place for determining who is a legitimate prospect. It’s developing. but at this point aside from a few national competitions a couple of prominent coaches it doesn’t exist. Anecdotally, we do know a student who left our local high school to attend Interlochen (since the OP mentioned Interlochen) and landed at the same mid-tier MT school as graduating classmate only to drop out a year later. So, there you go. Another kid we know who just booked his second national tour never even finished community college.</p>
<p>Another difference in this area with sports and the arts…
A sport is ultimately a hobby and will not be the college applicant’s major in college and more than likely not their career as well. It will be an extracurricular activity in college. For an arts applicant, particularly to a BFA degree program (a commitment to the major ahead of time), theater will be the college major, not just an extracurricular activity, and the aim often is to make it one’s career if possible. </p>
<p>My S did three and sometimes four varsity sports a year and as much theater as he could fit in. It wasn’t easy getting him to all the places he had to be and ironing out conflicts and dealing with physical exhaustion. Still I do think that athletic competition got him to a place where he could really focus and where he could try his hardest when it counted and go onto the next thing if it didn’t work out. It also made him really, really strong – which is more important than you’d expect at theater conservatory. Though I do notice that he’s making a lot faster progress now that he’s focusing all in on theater. </p>
<p>I agree with soozievt that there is no ONE path, but here is another anecdote. My family chose to move to a different county (of the same general metro area) so that our D would have the opportunity to attend a performing arts magnet HS. I have said numerous times- it really was a game changer. Not only did it help her learn, grow and prepare- but for the last 4 years she has been treating the arts as a profession rather than a hobby, and that is huge.</p>
<p>I think that a major difference is recruitment. Athletes in many (though not all sports) are “commodities” for colleges- those kids will make $$ for the school- so you want the ones who will make the most- and there are specific skill sets that teams need etc… Now there are certainly more athletes than there are scholarships, and I don’t pay attention (is there a college confidential forum for parents of prospective athletes- that would be a whole other world!) but I don’t know any stories about the “amazing” athlete who won all the big games and has all the right skills who didn’t end up at a college program. I don’t think that is true of BFA kids…our kids are recruiting the colleges (via the audition process) Wouldn’t if be fun if there were college scouts sitting in HS auditoriums all over the country in the spring to find the best Harold Hill or Millie Dillmount out there?</p>
<p>I think it is a very individual decision for each family and theater kid. It depends on the quality of training available in the area, the family’s values, the performing and academic talents of the kid, the strengths of the schools available, and so forth. As a family, we value academics highly and are not yet ready to decide in 9th grade that a BFA program will be the best fit for our D. Therefore, we choose to pay for a private college prep school even though there are 3 public performing arts high schools in our area. We think our D is getting one of the best academic educations available in our area, and she is able to get high quality training privately outside of her school (and at her school for drama). As parents, we believe that the path we have chosen will offer more options for college and a career that is satisfying for our particular child. However, I absolutely believe that a different choice could be better for other kids who have different skill sets, personalities, families, financial situations, etc. </p>
<p>The two things that would mostly appeal to our D about a performing arts school would be 1) having dance training during the school day, and 2) attending school with many peers who share her love of MT and acting. We are trading those features off against greater academic rigor and better academic college prep, attending a school closer to home, having both our children attend the same school, and exposing our D to a group of peers with more diverse interests and skills. </p>
<p>Also, the kids who attend the performing arts high schools in our area are not cast in better roles or at a higher rate in the community and professional theaters in our area, so I’m not sure that they offer clearly superior training over what is available privately. Plenty of kids who do not attend the PA high schools in our area are accepted at BFA MT and Acting programs, and plenty of kids who attend the PA high schools are not. Also, we see many extremely talented actors in shows at our regional theaters who have liberal arts degrees. There is value in a broader education, even if it “slows” down the pace at which one develops MT skills.</p>
<p>@elsacc - every school is individual, and like you, strong academic rigor was a priority for us. The school my D attends (for another week anyway!) is ranked top 100 in the nation (US News) academically in addition to supporting the arts. She has taken 8 AP classes - they offer 17 at the school. Interestingly…what you won’t find at the school are sports- or at least what you do find are “club” only, no resources there are split between athletics and arts- the gym is used for dance, yoga, and an alternate rehearsal space. (since more than one show is often in production) My D would be the 1st to admit herself to be the stereotype theater “no sports knowledge gal”. And yet she is a strong athlete- she will be running a half marathon in 2 weeks (she wanted to get in shape for college) and of course can dance for hours at a clip! Education is the most valuable thing a person can get in their formative years- but a PA school doesn’t have to mean that they are “lesser” in academics. I am pretty sure people don’t assume schools with strong athletic traditions are not scholastically rigorous.</p>
<p>@toowonderful - I was speaking only about the particular choice of schools we have in our particular area. Your school sounds like it would be a great option for our D, but I’m pretty sure it is not the PA HS in our district. You are lucky. </p>
<p>The OP asked why more parents are not choosing to move their performing arts students to PA high schools. For some people, depending on the available options in their area, academics may be a deciding factor, or cost, or keeping their kids at the same school, or distance, etc. </p>
<p>Awesome - you all are very helpful. </p>
<p>I understand the recruiting aspect of it. I know that the top high school programs do get contacted by some of the major BFA players, and often serve as unofficial feeder schools. Recruiting is happening more and more - but they happen at things like Thespian Conferences, and State One-Act Competitions - but professor jobs are increasingly including the ability to recruit. And with more and more Mid-Tier BFA’s being able to offer Full/Close to Full scholarships for talent, it might increase even more. </p>
<p>I got my BFA 13 years ago, and my MFA 7. Students today are LIGHT YEARS ahead of where they were when I was in college. </p>
<p>@TheaterHiringCo - That is very interesting to hear about an increase in recruiting. Juilliard recently did an info session at a center that houses some of our top community-based youth theater, dance, and symphony groups. At least in our area, they seem to be casting a wider net. It does seem to me (but I am NOT in the theater business…) that recruiting students after seeing them perform at festivals or competitions might be a good complement to the largely audition-based admissions system.</p>
<p>This happens. But, the vast majority of applicants have no idea, nor do the drama teachers at most public schools. Unlike sports. Right now it’s this weird system where top kids and their parents know what’s going on and hundreds of other hopefuls are trying to do it on their own based on information on the schools websites. CC is helpful but a lot of people are not even aware of CC. And, really CC is not a system, either. The number of kids who show up unprepared is amazing and the just don’t have any way of knowing how unprepared they are until it’s too late. They may be plenty talented but they are untrained and uncompetitive at all but a few of the lesser known programs, which of course they have also never heard of. Sorry. I think I may have started ranting in there somewhere.</p>
<p>We don’t have performing arts high schools in our state. However, it sure sounds great to be able to get things like dance during the school day! My kid got all the training privately outside of school and we lived in a rural area and so the travel distances were great each day. Things like festivals, thespians, competitions…were foreign from our experience as well. My kid auditioned at colleges who never heard of her before and got in. I do agree with someone else that it does take knowledge of the process and CC is sooooo helpful, but many do not even know about it. We got no help from our high school when it came to anything to do with this. We even learned about NFAA Arts Awards on CC and my D auditioned and won an award and nobody in our state won any awards in any of the categories. I don’t think our school even knows our D won one! </p>
<p>I sorta hope that BFA programs do NOT recruit because there is no way they would ever come to our state or our high school, etc. and I did wonder about kids from well known performing arts high schools that may have some contact with BFA programs ahead of time and no colleges would have ever heard of my kid until audition day. Still, it worked out just fine for my kid and many others I know, including other talented kids from our rural state. </p>
<p>@elsacc- no offense taken. Probably knee jerk reaction to all the people who DID think a PA high school was a waste of D’s “academic potential”. (of course some of those same people continue to think that a BFA is a “waste” as well…and they can go milk a duck!) </p>
<p>I agree with the comment made earlier about the numbers of kids who don’t know how unprepared they are until too late. I am SURE that there are plenty of kids with the raw skills, but didn’t get the prep, or get noticed as a “diamond in the rough”. Someone on cc mentioned an article where Kyle Dean Massey talked about how he did everything “wrong” at his 1st round of BFA auditions- and got NO acceptances. He kept going, but not everyone does</p>
<p>My S has a friend whose family moved 3 hours away so their D could attend a performing arts high school rather than the public school my S attends. Now she gets dance, acting and voice training as part of the school day, and a number of the MT faculty at colleges discussed regularly on CC attend their performances. The teachers at the PA school have been able to put her in touch with and personally recommend her to a lot of heads of departments, which I have no doubt will give her a huge leg up when it comes time for college auditions. The girl is very talented, so who knows if the result would have been the same regardless of where she went to school, but this definitely shows that it does happen that families will relocate just like in the sports world.</p>
<p>That was the gist of my question. Preparation and access to people. I anticipate a major shift in the way theater recruiting is conducted VERY soon.</p>
<p>The University of Buffalo (SUNY Buffalo) jumps to my mind. Lynne Kurdziel Formato (sp?) turned that program into a TOP 15 program, easy, in the early 2000s. They didn’t give her tenure because of scholarly pursuits (what?!), and she went to Elon - where she has turned them into a Top 10 program. SUNY Buffalo thought that the talent would come with or without Lynne…BZZZZ, wrong…they have been shuffling leadership since. Lynne was a MASTERFUL teacher, but Lynne is one of the countries most BRILLIANT theater recruiters. She gets the talent.</p>