Thoughts from a recent grad

Colleges and Universities A-Z Vanderbilt University
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Hey guys,

I graduated from Vandy last year. Although this is my first post, I’ve been reading this site for a while, and found it helpful when I was looking at colleges in HS and researching grad school options. Even though I’ve graduated, I have many friends who still attend Vandy and have been up there recently, so I think I have a pretty good sense of what it is like currently. I will be glad to answer any questions that any of you might have.

I’ll just give a few thoughts on issues that I’m sure many are wondering about.

Social Life: Vandy is associated with Greek Life and a work hard, play hard mentality. However, I’d dispute the accuracy of this. Recently, the administration has been cracking down hard on Greek Life, with fraternities being placed on probation or even kicked off for offenses that I’d consider minor. There is also talk about making the houses, which already only house officers, non-residential in the coming years. Compared to other SEC schools, the social scene is much weaker. I’d say it’s probably on par with other top 20 schools, with the increasing regulations stifling it. Some may believe that this is in the best interest for the university. However, I strongly disagree, as it will make Vandy a less attractive place for many students.

As far as if it is necessary to go Greek to have a social life, the answer depends. If you are a girl, the answer is no, although most girls are in sororities. For a guy, if you want a traditional college social life, then you should absolutely rush.

As far as how hard it is to get into a fraternity/sorority, the answer depends on what house you want to join. Basically any guy/girl can get into one, although they might end up in a lower-tier sorority house or a newly colonized fraternity. Getting into a top house is much more difficult. I can go into greater detail about any of this if anyone is interested.

Reputation: As most of you probably know, Vandy is a top 20 school, currently ranked #15 by US News on their national universities list. However, I’d say the reputation is more regional than other top 20 schools, although most employers and grad schools know that Vandy is a top-ranked school. Saying this, Vandy is still not a target school for some Wall Street and technology firms. Furthermore, I’d say Nashville is not the best city to try to find a job in after college. Although there are some startups and large companies based there, it can’t compare to New York, Boston, Atlanta, or Silicon Valley. The location also limits opportunities for internships during the school year, although they are available.

Academics: This is a mixed-bag. I’ve had many great professors, but also many awful ones. I was dissatisfied with my advisor, but I’m sure there are several great advisors. Mine simply wasn’t one of them. I could talk about specifics if anyone is wants to know.

I hope this was helpful. If anyone has any further questions or wants to know about something I wrote in greater detail, please feel free to ask.

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What’s the attitude on Wall street for recruiting at Vandy. Are they considering recruiting there or is there absolutely no interest?

What about applying for internships/jobs? Is a good GPA at Vandy enough to be considered for an interview (and with a good interview, an offer for a position), or do Vandy applicants need something more on their resume?

Also is there any issue with going to Vandy, and then moving to a better location for a job?

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Some, such as Goldman, do recruit there. Others don’t. I honestly can’t say how, or if, their attitudes are changing.

For jobs/internships, it depends. Connections, like at any school, are very important. So is your major. A straight econ major won’t attract much interest without a double major in a STEM field or at least a minor. I’d say that Vandy students have to work harder than those at target schools, but it is by no means impossible.

There’s absolutely no issue with moving to a better location for a job. I’m almost positive that most Vandy grads don’t stay in Nashville. My point was that Nashville’s location isn’t the best for someone to base their job search from.

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Thank you for sharing your experience. @Vandy93 Your thoughts will help make our decision easier.

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Nashville is actually a pretty hot job market. Quite a few of my friends stayed in the area, particularly those interested in healthcare. That said, grads from top 20 schools should expect to move. A big advantage of going to a school with national recognition is that you don’t NEED to look for jobs in your school’s city. People don’t pass up on Dartmouth or Cornell because they’re worried about having to leave Hanover / Ithica afterwards!

If you want to where Vandy students end up, go to Linkedin and search for Vanderbilt’s page. Click “Students and Alumni” tab. You can sort all of Vandy’s graduates by their location, company, industry, and class year.

Our biggest employers in the last few years include Deloitte, HCA, Google, Accenture, PwC, Huron, Ernst & Young, Goldman, Morgan Stanley, Google, Citi, IBM, Microsoft.

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Glad I could help @helpfulandtrying. If you have any other questions please ask.

Nashville’s job market is definitely improving, although I’m not sure I’d describe it as a hot job market.

Vandy, despite its national reputation, still isn’t a main target school for several firms. This, combined with Nashville’s location, means that a Vandy student will need to put in extra work to land a top job. It is by no means impossible though.

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3rd in the country in post-recession job growth (2009-2015):

http://www.pewtrusts.org/en/research-and-analysis/blogs/stateline/2015/6/04/which-metro-areas-have-gained-the-most-jobs-since-the-great-recession

It of course can’t compare to NY or Silicon Valley, but certainly isn’t a bad place to graduate.

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Mathematically, the only thing I don’t like about “growth” numbers (especially during a decent chunk of the recession) is that we don’t know how bad it got during the recession. It also matters what type of jobs were added, because that has been a key issue with the “recovery”. Are the jobs that most metro areas are picking up during the recovery the ones that students want to pursue? Like I know some job growth straight up comes from small things like certain cheaper restaurants making a comeback during the recession (so they would build new sites during the recession even though they were failing before). Furthermore, I know in many at least decent sized metro areas, the housing and multi-family market is coming back, which correlates with construction of course. This is excellent for those maybe pursuing certain types of engineering, but I often do not hear of selective private school students pursuing construction even if in engineering (I suppose a good chunk of it is considered too “blue collar” though management positions are of course ridiculously well-paid so rising through ranks of a company could be more than worth it). The Texas metro areas such as Houston and Austin are very interesting as we know they’ve been seeing certain companies move there and also have a big connection to oil. Would have been nice if the article dropped a tad bit on the sectors that grew.

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Hey, I was an ED student who was accepted this year. I’ve heard a lot about both the social scene and academics, but I’d still like to know more about what I’ll experience next year. Could you talk about which fraternities are considered “top-tier,” and how hard those are to get a bid in? I’m from California so I’m a little worried about not fitting in with the rest of the guys involved in Greek life—is it mostly dominated by people from the East Coast/South? I’m really interested in rushing (my brother is a Sigma Chi at UCLA and loves it) but I just don’t know enough about the culture at Vanderbilt yet. I’d also be interested in hearing more about the future of Greek life at Vandy, because it sounds like it’s getting railed right now by regulations and punishments.

Also, I’ll major in Economics and minor in Financial Economics, and I’m among the top two or three student at my public high school (out of 600); if you majored/minored in either of these subjects, or if you know people who did, how difficult were they? How difficult are the freshman GE courses?

Lastly, I’m very interested in Finance (hence my minor), and I want to end up on Wall Street (ideally), or in consulting. I know Vandy isn’t a target school, but I’ve heard that firms like Holihan-Lokey and BofA - Merrill Lynch tend to gravitate towards Vandy kids, more so than students from what are considered the usual target schools. How true is that? In general, how difficult is it to enter finance from Vanderbilt? Is the Office of Professional Development actually helpful for getting interviews/internships/jobs on Wall Street or in consulting?

I know I’m asking tons of questions, but I’m really curious. The people I know who go to Vanderbilt haven’t been all that helpful so far. Thank you so much for taking the time to answer all of this hahahah I appreciate it! I can give you my email too, if that’s easier for you. Thanks again

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@vanderlit sae is basically the only top tier because beta got kicked off. kappa sig, sig chi and aepi are upper mid. It’s much harder to get a bid if you don’t know anyone in the fraternity (if you’re good friends with one of the guys reach out and you’ll have a much better chance of getting in), but for the lower tier fraternities it’s much easier to get a bid regardless of who you know.

Financial economics is pretty easy and econ is not hard like pre-med life/engineering but it’s not as easy as hod.

I know some people w/ internships at top firms like merrill lynch, jp morgan, and goldman sachs. It’s not as heavily recruited as a top 20 NE school/an ivy but if you have a good gpa you’ll have a pretty good shot at an interview. Connections are also important. Most of this is what I hear from my friends/from places like here so I can’t say it’s 100% true

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So what does it take to get into a top sorority/fraternity? Connections? Ambition? An super outgoing personality? Thanks

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@citymama9 Mostly connections and luck, with a good personality being a prerequisite.

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@AnnieBot When you say connections, do you mean people you know from home/high school or people who you met your first semester in school? I would imagine the first semester of Fresh yr requires lots of networking

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@VanderLIT Tiers are always controversial. They are also probably going to change a lot since I wouldn’t be surprised if another fraternity gets kicked off before you start. I’d consider AEPi (the Jewish fraternity) to be in the top tier along with SAE. As a guy from Cali you shouldn’t have much of a problem, although there is some geographic divide. Phi Delt is southern, while Beta, which got kicked off recently, was more northern. Knowing guys in the fraternity does help you get a bid, but there are plenty of guys who get bids at top/upper-mid houses who didn’t know anyone going in. If you are a chill outgoing guy who played sports in HS and went out on the weekends you shouldn’t have a problem getting in a good house.

Honestly, the future of Greek Life isn’t pretty. Compared to other SEC schools our Greek Life is a joke, and it will continue to get worse. I’m sure most of the administration would love to get rid of it. The only thing stopping them is the massive backlash that would come from the alumni. I expect more houses to get kicked off and more ridiculous regulations (we already have security guards at parties/tailgates) to be imposed in the near future.

Econ and Financial Econ are both pretty easy in my opinion, although some people might disagree. Just be warned, that it is a very popular combo, which will make it harder to stand out to employers. I’d trade out your Econ major for a math or CS major if you really want to end up on Wall Street.

Vandy just has distribution requirements in A&S (known as AXLE), no required courses. You can find easy classes to satisfy it. Personally, I found the AXLE requirements very annoying, but at least there’s nothing you have to take. The first two intro Econ classes with Prof. Buckles many people find difficult, although I didn’t take any Econ classes in HS and didn’t think they were too bad. As a note, the quality of teaching in the Economics department, with a few exceptions, is low.

I’m not sure if BAML and HL favor Vandy kids over the normal target schools, although both recruit here. Getting into finance from Vandy isn’t as easy as it is at other schools, although many people do enter the financial sector. Connections, as always, are very important. I know that many people get their internships and jobs through connections. Also important is your GPA, major, and internship experience. I’ve heard some negative reviews of the Career Center, although they do bring decent companies to campus.

@citymama9 Personality is key, connections help. For sororities looks are important (some people will try to tell you otherwise). There are also GPA cutoffs.

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yeah I didn’t mean connections were the only way to get in a top fraternity/sorority, but connections (as in friends w/ someone in the house) is the best way

@citymama9 the easiest way is to be well connected. If someone from your high school that you were close friends with is in a top house you’ll have a pretty easy time getting in. Dirty rush apparently is pretty common for sororities but it’s not allowed so they keep it a secret and don’t talk about it much outside of the sorority.

That said for fraternities/sororities even if you don’t know anyone, if you have the right personality/looks (mostly for sororities but fraternities somewhat care about how many girls you pull) you have a good shot at getting a bid

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@Suffer : Wow, that sounds kind of ridiculous in a way (though I’m sure that wasn’t your intent). The criteria that is (also the idea that you are a) being watched or b) expected to kiss and tell to gain acceptance…nothing like essentially spreading rumors or essentially bartering girls). Perhaps that can explain part of the diversity issues (at like many schools with Greeklife)…some folks do not have those values and it could be related to ethnic group for example. to me, for example, it never appeared that black Greek orgs. had such criteria (it was pretty much just whether or not you really were willing to join…also lots of “good” history surrounding lots of them that may be an attractant. Many known for creating a “space” on campuses and for how some of their members were directly involved in the civil rights movement in the past).

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Most guys who rush will only know a guy or two, if that, in a fraternity from before Vandy. These contacts can be helpful in introducing yourself to other brothers and telling you about rush events (which are listed in an email if you’re on the list). But unless your brother is the president, it is by no means an automatic bid. There are guys each year who knew a brother before coming in who got cut. Knowing people before you come in is obviously nice, but if you have a good personality you should be fine. For fraternities looks are not a main factor. Sure, if you’re pale and overweight that won’t look good. Unlike sororities, your personality is much more important than what you look like. You can see a clear difference in looks between a top and bottom sorority. It’s not as obvious for fraternities.

@bernie12 You’re not alone in thinking the Greek system is ridiculous, which is why the administration wants to get rid of it. I personally disagree and I wouldn’t characterize it in the way you did. I definitely agree that black Greek orgs (which I know almost nothing about) are completely different.

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@Vandy93 I didn’t characterize it that way, I read it the way Suffer broke down people’s chances of getting in. It read as kind of disturbing/weird. Also, I don’t think you know what it is like for Greeklife to truly be under attack. I went to Emory where it is only 30% of the student population (I think a little high, but is alright overall) and they are certainly more aggressive against them. My only true issue (because I don’t know how entrance works as ours was pretty ethnically diverse, so maybe recruiting was different) is that when it is too high a proportion of the populous, it kind of takes a way from the “social diversity”. As in, the social outlets on campus appear either strongly connected to or dominated by Greeks which can be somewhat monotonous. Greek orgs. certainly have different feels when compared to each other but there are also many commonalities as well that could splinter the campus (a problem at Vanderbilt where apparently most Greeks “look the same” and we know what that means) or simply just get old after a while, especially for those who do not want to join the org. I’m sure many outside of it which that other organizations (non-Greek) would have more visibility and influence in campus life. It can in theory also take away from intellectual life though there are plenty of exceptions and it may have lesser so been the case in other periods of history. I know we have a couple of exceptions (it is known as one of the higher tiered fraternities) that holds Tedx Salons (student ideafests I guess) and well-attended art/spoken word events. I am not sure if I can distinguish between it being an attempt to gain favor with the administration (basically saying, “look we gladly contribute positively to intellectual life”) or if it is genuine, but I just know that I’m glad that they do it.

However, what must always be remembered is that often Greek is not ones only affiliation. There are so many others that it is difficult to pin down any sort of “negative” effects unless you somehow trace what other types of orgs. Greek students tend to gravitate toward (are they intellectually and professionally diverse, or do many gravitate toward the same types of positions and orgs?). The so called “investigations” occurring on many campuses (including Dartmouth where it has gotten really serious) strike me as superficial and misguided a lot of times. Unless there is evidence that they are intentionally and maliciously physically harming people or noticeably affecting the reputation of the school in a negative way (rare at a top tier school. If anything, it attracts folks…especially students whose parents are also members), leave them alone.

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@bernie12 didn’t say everyone in a top house gets in that way. I’m just saying it’s the easiest

The thing with being well connected (being related works too) is you either a.) visited the college (and your friend) before you got accepted, and by doing so you met/hung out with the brothers/sisters already or b.) when you get to the campus, you (and probably some freshmen you meet) are immediately invited to some of their pre games before rush even starts. Also greek houses tend to try and “recruit” members so if you’re in a house and you know a quality guy/girl is coming to the school you want them in your house you will try to get them to join. Also being connected means you have someone to advocate for you when the house makes decisions regarding whether to give you a bid or not.

So, usually being well connected ties in with having the right personality, but sometimes I’ve seen guys that aren’t perfect fits (based on my impression when I talked/hung out with them, maybe the fraternity guys saw something different though) get accepted because a bunch of guys they knew/were friends with (like same high school or hometown). That’s why it’s the best way to get into a top house… because if you have the right personality you’re almost guaranteed a bid, and even if you’re not the greatest fit it gives you an opportunity someone that wasn’t connected probably won’t have

Even so it’s not guaranteed like I mentioned in other posts. I knew a guy freshman year who had an older brother in one of the top houses but he was cut pretty late into rush. Only difference was his brother graduated before his freshman year but he knew some of the seniors. He told me he was invited to some events at the beginning of the year before rush even started though.

@vandy93 I’ve heard president usually doesn’t have an important impact on bid decisions. however it is very important to get close to the sophomore class because they have a larger impact

also by connection I meant someone you’re friends with, but knowing can be helpful. I know sae’s rush list is initially filled with people recommended by someone in the fraternity. Then those guys tell the rush chair names of guys they’re friends with also interested in rushing

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@Suffer I agree that connections are helpful. All I’m saying is that it is still very possible to get a bid at a top house without them. The example of being the brother of the president was just trying to illustrate that connections don’t guarantee a bid in most cases. You’re right that the president doesn’t have an important impact on bid decisions. But if you were the brother of the president (or rush chair or another well liked/involved brother) you can count on a bid, even if you aren’t the best fit.

In fact, it’s not one guy making the bid decisions. That’s why it’s important to take rush seriously, get to know a lot of the brothers, and go to rush events regularly. Also start at the top houses, even if you don’t think you’ll get a bid. You can (almost) always start rushing at a lower-tier house later in the semester.