<p>I'd like to ask you CCers a few quick questions on engineering schools.
Perusing the US News Rankings for undergrad engineering with doctorate degree, it shows the following order:</p>
<ol>
<li>MIT</li>
<li>Stanford</li>
<li>UC Berk</li>
<li>Caltech</li>
<li>Georgia Tech</li>
<li>UIUC</li>
<li>U of M - ann arbor</li>
<li>CMU</li>
<li>Cornell </li>
<li>Purdue</li>
</ol>
<p>The first 4 I considered the usual suspects, but what I didn't expect to see were UIUC, Ann Arbor and Purdue.
Personally I had always considered UIUC and Purdue as safeties, which is why it shocked me to see them on this list so highly. </p>
<p>What is your opinion of these schools? Do they have a name brand association i'm not aware of? What do these schools have less of than the big-name heavy weights? </p>
<p>Responses will be greatly appreciated, and I am truly ok with a little troll bait if constructive conversation comes out of it.</p>
<p>Illinois, Michigan and Purdue have always been considered great engineering schools. In fact Illinois and Purdue are mostly known for their engineering while Michigan has many highly ranked departments across the board…</p>
<p>my school tends to send a significant portion of its graduating class to UIUC annually, the in-state option, and the high number of acceptances I guess has prejudiced me against it. Granted, I learned later that the majority of these were not into the Engineering program, and even fewer were into the more sought-after computer engineering. I assure you, as I do more and more research my impressions have changed quite a bit.</p>
<p>I’m particularly interested in computer engineering/computer science. What would be the difference in undergraduate education between attending U of I for ECE or a school like Carnegie Mellon, if I was accepted to both and cost was somewhat a factor? Would a Carnegie Mellon undergraduate education be worth an extra 5, 7, 10k in loans a year? Would it change if I were planning on attending grad school or not?</p>
<p>A CMU degree would absolutely not be worth 5k to 7k more unless you just felt more comfortable there. Academically, they are peers. If I remember correctly, UIUC is ranked either 2 or 3 for ECE.</p>
<p>Seriously, have you been living under a rock?</p>
<p>When it comes to computer science, I don’t know why anyone (who plans to enter the workforce after school) would care about where the program ranked in the Top-10…hell, I will say it…TOP-20.</p>
<p>Computer science is the one area where one controls their destiny more from job experience…not their school. One can pretty much get up to speed on the latest technology at home. The graduate from the 2nd-ranked CS school will probably earn NO MORE than $10,000-$15,000 than the graduate from the 20th-ranked school during the FIRST job. Once each engineer has some experience, it becomes the playoffs of a major sport…everyone is in the running.</p>
<p>I know that splitting hairs between top-schools and the chest-bumping that goes with it is big on this board but I think what REALLY GOES ON in the industry needs to be addressed.</p>
<p>But you also need to recognize that it’s VERY different in the government sector than it is in the private sector. And it’s very different in a plant engineering position than it would be in a high-profile industry (consulting or banking). Even within an industry (say plant engineering) it’s very different on a management track than it is on a technical track.</p>
<p>The “splitting of hairs” can be a very big deal in a high-profile industry where there are 3 or 4 employers that go to 4 or 5 colleges to hire.</p>
<p>You mentioned plant engineering. I mentioned computer science. Before I went into government contracting, I spent 14 years in the private sector, basically working for consulting companies. Most consulting companies try to latch on to a certain business. When I worked in the Philly/Delaware area, it was all about the credit card companies huddled in Delaware or a few of the insurance carriers in Philly. In DC, it’s all about the feds. The rules of hiring are still the same. The ones who have the skills/experience in the latest technology will get hired.</p>
<p>I do understand that schools matter in banking but again, banking jobs are open to a VERY SMALL percentage of folks, small enough to not be mentioned like its big like software development. Folks on here mention I-Banking on this board like its Java development.</p>
<p>Another thing than many folks fail to realize is that many posts keep pushing “high profile”, “high profile”. In the computer science arena, one can be an expert and bill at an awfully high hourly wage without a bit of “high profile”.</p>
<p>Being at a “high profile” school helps in that more out of area companies will come and visit the career center for recruiting – an out of area company look for CS graduates will be more likely to stop at UIUC than ISU when visiting Illinois. But being at a school local to employers (e.g. San Jose State University) also helps (obviously, UC Berkeley and Stanford have a double advantage being both “high profile” and local to many employers).</p>
<p>But which university you graduated from becomes less important after some work experience.</p>
<p>We are still talking a very small number of openings.</p>
<p>Once again, I understand the motive for pursuing MBB consulting and I-Banking. At the same time, I am a realist. I personally do not think one should put themselves in $100K debt and constant competition for the same 100 jobs that 100,000 other folks are going for when their are less competitive, less stressful positions that can net you the same amount of income…if you play your cards correctly.</p>
<p>I do like the rankings/prestige and do like the concept of one being rewarded for being better academically, but if the “reward” is not going to be much better while giving others “back door” paths to the same goals…why do it?</p>
<p>You’re not going to find the types of salaries available at MBB or i-banking available in other industries. A BS earns you $80,000 + free tuition to HBS, Wharton, Darden, Stanford GSB. Then you come back and make $200,000 to start. $300,000 within 5 years. $500,000+ in 10 years. It’s a hard life, but it pays off very well if you’re good at it.</p>
<p>Some people look for easier options for less pay, and that’s fine for them. But that doesn’t mean that you need to make the decision for everyone.</p>
<p>And the number of openings isn’t that small - there are thousands in MBB and in i-banking. You need to be the best of the best if you go to a place like Purdue since there are few opportunities, but at a place like Stanford, you just need to be above average. That’s the value of splitting hairs at that level. Now, if you have no interest in high prestige positions, then it doesn’t matter so much.</p>
<p>Interesting points about consulting.
Personally, i’m not interested in consulting after getting an mba, but its interesting to hear the business perspective in relation to engineering. </p>
<p>Finding myself unable to use ranking to help with college decisions, are there any quantifiable factors should i look for in a school?</p>
<p>You obviously want to go to a good school. While choosing among schools ranked 1 through 10 in the field may be splitting hairs (and the choice may end up depending on other factors like cost, location, environment, courses in other subjects, etc.), it may be different between choosing between 1 through 10 versus 150 through 200.</p>
<p>[url=<a href=“http://www.abet.org%5DABET%5B/url”>http://www.abet.org]ABET[/url</a>] accreditation sets a minimum standard for engineering degree programs (and is very important if you go into a field like civil engineering where professional licensing is needed).</p>
<p>No doubt. I had to steer my cousin away from this small school for its CS program. How are your going to have a CS program where operating systems is an ELECTIVE course?</p>
<p>Actually, in UC Berkeley’s [EECS</a> major](<a href=“http://www.eecs.berkeley.edu/Programs/Notes/Content/Chapter2.pdf]EECS”>http://www.eecs.berkeley.edu/Programs/Notes/Content/Chapter2.pdf), all junior and senior level courses are electives within the context of “minimum of __ credit units of EE and CS courses”, etc… So no specific EE or CS course is required, so it is theoretically possible for an EECS major emphasizing CS to not take the operating systems course (though it would not be a good idea for someone emphasizing CS). Of course, those who emphasize EE may not take it because they are taking EE courses instead.</p>
<p>UC Berkeley also has a [CS</a> major in the College of Letters and Science](<a href=“http://www.eecs.berkeley.edu/csugrad/#upperdiv]CS”>http://www.eecs.berkeley.edu/csugrad/#upperdiv). Students choose from the same CS courses that EECS majors choose from, but the operating systems course is one of two specifically required junior and senior level courses (out of six to eight such CS courses needed).</p>
<p>Yes, I noticed that with UC Berkeley’s CS program. I would go on to say that a school like UC-Berkeley can probably get away with that and just about all grad schools would not care. Now if you don’t have that “name”, I think one has to be “safe” and take the usual CS core courses.</p>
<p>Isn’t “engineering” terribly broad to categorize? I don’t know much about it, but my assumption would be that one school might have an excellent chemical engineering program, while another might be top notch in civil engineering, etc. It seems ridiculous to expect huge institutions to be equally strong in all types of engineering.</p>