<p>Hey, you probably came here to get some advice from some expert but no, that's not what this is about. I just want to inform you that you ALWAYS have a chance. I know coming on collegeconfidential is a fun thing to do at times but sometimes it is just depressing. However, you need to realize that this is only a small representation of the people who apply to those top schools and there are exceptions. You always are capable of being admitted to a top college because what they want to see is you. At the end of the day it isn't about what your SAT or ACT score is or what your weighted GPA accumulates to, it is about who you are. So be proud of the 2100 that you received on your SAT's, things will be okay if you have a 3.7 GPA. Don't let anyone tell you that you are completely and utterly hopeless, there are people who apply to those schools each year and I think the question that you should be asking yourself is, "why can't it be you?" Why can't you be the one who gets accepted? Somebody has to, and those admission counselors decide who it is. Make it clear who you are and what you are there to offer, if it isn't a 2400 on the SAT, then what is it? Is it an outgoing personality, a person who really cares about the environment, an expert in the field of Harry Potter. Basically, just wanted to create this to say to never lose hope. I was taught to hope for the best and prepare for the worst. I hope that you will do all the same. </p>
<p>meh. Always? The kid with the 2.0 and no reason besides not trying has no chance. </p>
<p>Just remember that going to the Ivies, Stanford, MIT, Chicago, Duke, et al just means that your educational pedigree looks a bit better in the eyes of employers. </p>
<p>@mandyg233 that’s very true, when I initially wrote this it was in response to all those who felt that they had no chance because they had a 2270 instead of a 2300. Of course there are exceptions like the one you mentioned. </p>
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<p>You need to differentiate between a having a chance vs having a REALISTIC chance.</p>
<p>You always have a chance of winning the Powerball lottery jackpot, too.</p>
<p>Thank you! Even though you used the example of a 2100 on the SAT (an awesome score), this post is very nice to hear! Very optimistic and true!! Good luck everyone!! </p>
<p>@GMTplus7 I think in college admissions there is a lack of realistic chances. Every day we see kids who have obtained 2400’s that are rejected from top notch schools and yet they were deemed with a realistic chance while there might be someone with a 1900 who is accepted. I find that the realities of a certain situation cannot be predicted. Thus you always have a chance. A chance isn’t a guarantee but it is a way of simply stating that there is no such thing as the impossible. </p>
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<p>The applicants who get admitted at the low end of the test scores spectrum often have a BIG hook or extenuating circumstance:
- low income URM
- recruited athlete
- development case (I know someone who donated a new library wing to an ivy)
- celeb parents
- celeb themselves
- parents who are heads of state, major polital figures</p>
<p>For the rest of you unhooked candidates w middling academic stats (at or below the school’s 25th percentile) & middling ECs, u need to face the reality that your chances are bleak to non-existent. Your energy is better spent focusing on schools that are realistic. </p>
<p>@GMTplus7 I appreciate your comments on this post. I believe that it adds quite an interesting reflection on the opposite opinion, how one would tend to believe that there are realistic chances. I must say that I simply disagree with you, and not because of my expertise in the subject but simply in that I believe that anything is possible. I find we are too afraid to take chances, thus I simply urge that we take that magnificent leap. Do I promise acceptance? No, for that would be hypocritical of the idea that I suggest that we cannot predict the future. However I simply offer the belief that everyone has a chance like how everyone has a chance to win the lottery. Is it a far reach? Perhaps, but remember someone always does win. I admit I am no expert, my experience is limited to the research and posts I have done on my own journey to college, but if your own experience is limited just as mine is, this forum is simply an accumulation of opinion. And my opinion is anything is possible. </p>
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<p>Lotteries exploit poor, uninformed people. The low income people who can least afford to lose money further impoverish themselves by spending a disproportionate amt of their income on the lottery:
<a href=“Lottery Is a Tax on the Poor”>Lottery Is a Tax on the Poor;
<p>If u are “poor” (i.e. unhooked & have clearly uncompetitve stats) and want to play the school lottery game, then go ahead & play for fun. Don’t count on winning. Have a viable alternate school choice.</p>
<p>But it beats me why anyone would want to knowingly enroll in a school knowing they are at the BOTTOM competitively. The objective is not just to get admitted to a school, but to succeed once you are there.</p>
<p>@madglav NOT TRUE. If you want to be a communications major, you have no business being in the Ivy League.If you want to be pre med, why waste time in Dartmouth when you can go to UW Madison. Not every Ivy League is ranked at the top of each group of majors.</p>
<p>Why sacrifice a better education just for the brand name? Job recruiters out there know which schools have the strongest programs and believe it or not, it isn’t always the ultra selective private schools in the Northeast.</p>
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<p>The favorite schools for recruiters are mostly big state U’s:</p>
<p><a href=“http://m.us.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052748704554104575435563989873060”>http://m.us.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052748704554104575435563989873060</a></p>
<p>To those who say “anything is possible”: that is untrue, and - in some instances (like what I’ve seen in some threads on this site) - downright cruel. The elite colleges select a finite number of students.The Ivy League has established something called the “Academic Index” that defines an absolute minimum statistical standard for recruited athletes. They will not consider admitting the best high school quarterback in the country if he doesn’t meet those criteria. It is not supportive and nurturing to tell students on these threads whose Academic Indices fall below that to go ahead and apply; it is utterly irresponsible. It is a waste of time, money (in most cases), and emotional energy. When you see that only 25% of students accepted at a college had ACT scores under 32, why would you advise a student with a 19 to apply? It’s like telling someone who can’t carry a tune to “follow your dream” of a singing career. There are literally thousands of four-year colleges in this country. I think it betrays a sick fixation on “brand” prestige to encourage impossible dreams when possible ones are abundant. </p>
<p>@GMTplus7 I always tell that too all those students who want to go to the Ivies for “job opportunities”. Little did they know…</p>
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<p>The power of positive thinking is a stupid thing to rely on in the college admissions process. This is big business for the colleges, and woe unto the student or parent who thinks everyone has an equal chance. Far too many students spend most of their time focused on schools they have no chance of acceptance to, and shortchange the search and application process for matches and safeties. Then they are poleaxed in the spring when they are accepted to no colleges they can afford and/or want to attend. Stop promoting this dumb idea that “anyone has a chance”. The statistics on admissions are quite clear for anyone who goes to the trouble to research the Common Data Set for a given school and can do the basic math. It isn’t mysterious or luck or guesswork. It IS complicated and a bit of a grind to work out where your chances are best. But this fuzzy ‘magical unicorn thinking’ is not going to get anyone into a school that is a good fit for them that they can afford.</p>
<p>intparent wrote,
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<p>+1 to intparent.</p>
<p>OP wrote,
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<p>So how much is a chance? Is 1% a chance? How about 0.01%? If 2100 gives someone a chance, how about 2000? How about 1900? Note universities are academic institutions and your test scores/grades represent a large portion of who you are.</p>
<p>Thus I think OP is providing bad advices here. For those who buy the theory that HYPSM is a crapshot and lottery, you just haven’t seen the really good ones yet. I just heard a story of a girl who swept HYPSM+Caltech. She has 2400 + 17 AP (all 5) + gold medal on one of the international subject olympiads. BTW, she’s an asian too. In this case, I would say HYPSM is a match, even safety for her. Yes, there are not many of those, but there are more than what you think, and you don’t have equal chance compared to those.</p>
<p>People complain that the admit rate of HYPSM is really low. But it’s the thinking like OP’s precipitate the situation. All that does by following OP’s advice is (1) live in a fantasy (more like anxiety) for a few more months, (2) wasting time/money which could be put to better use, (3) pad the school’s wallet and prestige while getting nothing in return. There is a word for that which I’m sure everyone knows.</p>
<p>Now I’m the one who subscribes to the theory of “pick your battle and die another day”. These days, most professions require a graduate degree and if you are good, you still have another chance. However college is the start of adult life and the most important attribute needed is knowing your strengths and weaknesses. No need to live in the fantansy anymore. Get real, and get moving instead.</p>
<p>@GMTplus7 @pastwise @woogzmama Woah people. Appreciate the feedback. Please remember that I didn’t specify specific institutions for my advice but simply college in general. Someone could be reaching for Harvard or BU, it really is in the view of the beholder of what their reach may be. I do not condone living in a fantasy but simply believe that no one should be making decisions out of fear. I respect the fact that all of you may have different opinions. I do stand by the theory that anyone should hope for the best and prepare for the worst, to never reach any expectations out of any process. I didn’t believe my opinion to be that of “magical unicorn thinking” but that of everyone to realize they do have a chance. I understand that I did not word this post correctly and maybe my clarification can offer nothing else but let me be specific in which audience that I am addressing. Back in April I wrote this post in response to two experiences that I had. The first was that of seeing kids on collegeconfidential with 2190 or 2200 SAT’s who felt disappointed at themselves because they were not able to obtain thirty points more. At this point the writer would then swear off their chances at any top institutions when all of their other experience seemed terrific. I wanted people to understand that there was more than just a test score that comes into play within the admission process. Hence, I was addressing an audience that already had terrific scores but kept on looking at higher scores. Which I understand can immediately draw confusion from those who are approaching the situation with an 1800 SAT who may still have a slight chance but are thinking from my post that they have an equal chance because of the idea that “anything is possible”. The second encounter was that of one at my school. There were freshman coming in of different background who felt that they were hindered because of cultural reasons of every receiving an education or going to a top institution. Because of this feeling some wouldn’t even try to make the attempt. I was disheartened by this because though I could truly understand the frustration, I believed that they should make the attempt now in 9th grade then regret it later down the line. I should have been more specific in my post but since no one replied I didn’t think that it would cause much concern until just recently when people began to comment. I still do believe that anything is possible but I must now agree with all of you that there are things that will be more likely than others. I’m very sorry for the confusion and time you have put into your responses. </p>
<p>OP wrote,
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<p>@fcallicotte, no worries. As long as people with 2100/3.7 trying HYPSM without any hooks understand there are tons of better applicants with higher chances, and make informed decision regarding how best to spend their energy, time and money, then sure. Good luck.</p>
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<p>No. Everyone does not have a chance. You are still floating along on “magical unicorn thinking”.</p>
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<p>I doubt anyone out here recommends that people make “decisions out of fear”. What we do recommend is that students look at the statistics for admissions, and accept that if their statistics are in the bottom 25% for a school and they have no hook, they have no chance. And also that they accept that they should allocate their college search and application time according to their odds of admission. It is harder work to find matches and safeties than it is to find reaches (that is why they are reaches, lots of people want to go there because they are appealing). Students should spend a lot more time evaluating matches and safeties than they do reaches because they are a lot more likely to end up that them.</p>
<p>I disagree with intparent to the extent that there’s no harm in a student looking at reaches that aren’t completely fanciful (ie. a student who might be very close to the 25th percentile), as long as the student realizes that those schools are unlikely to accept him or her, and limits the reaches to one or two colleges. Since becoming hooked on CC, I find the toughest nuts are the kids who are determined to apply almost exclusively to reaches on the firm belief that they will improve their scores enough to make those reaches matches. The colleges will still be reaches, just statistically likelier ones. I went through this last summer when my son pointed out that his test scores didn’t fall too far below the median range for Berkeley. I explained that most of the students who were admitted with lower CR scores probably were not native English speakers . . . or they were Math geniuses . . . or football players. My son’s CR score rose by 120 points in the next round of testing, and so Berkeley seemed within reach; he was rejected. I would have considered the application a total waste of money had his score not improved, but a score increase well above the norm was not sufficient for admission to a highly-selective college. Most rising seniors will not be able to raise their GPAs enough in the fall to make a difference in their admission outlook, and so they focus all their energy on raising their test scores. I tell every student here to build a college list on who and what they are this summer. If something exciting happens in the fall, then they can tweak the list a bit, but very few test score increases will change things completely. I kid whose resume isn’t going to get a serious look from the most elite colleges today probably won’t get into them even with a 200-point improvement. That score just might get him a look, but the outcome won’t necessarily change. He or she can afford to drop a super-safety from the list, and add a reach. Some high-matches will become matches, and low-matches will be safe. The impossible will simply become unlikely.</p>