<p>i seriously doubt they would publish that, just like no colleges dare to publish those stuff for different ethnic groups.</p>
<p>yes VAmom. thats exactly what we need.
Why would MIT not dare to publish such stuff? MIT is the most competitive to get into, which means only the cream apply. The lower half of the cream need not waste time applying.</p>
<p>Then perhaps the approach should be, as with all students applying, that MIT would be a remarkable place to attend, but it is <em>never</em> a likely event. Any applicant should give their all to their application if they're serious, and be sure to put their best and complete self forward... but not invest their souls in the expectation of a positive result. Have a backup plan and hope for the best, but prepare for the likelihood (even moreso in the case of an international applicant) that an admissions offer will not be forthcoming.</p>
<p>It's true that zero percent of those who do not apply will be admitted, so by all means apply. But in the case of international applicants, 100 of them will enter a room and only 4 of them will be called forwards. Applicants are smart, they can understand that those odds are daunting enough that it should be considered an unlikely but happy result to be chosen, regardless of what unpublished statistics might say.</p>
<p>I don't think the SAT scores would necessarily be helpful.</p>
<p>I strongly suspect that the SAT averages of international admits are higher than domestic admits, but I also strongly suspect that the SAT averages of international applicants are higher than those of domestic applicants. In that case (which I think is highly likely), a higher admit SAT average tells you nothing about what you need to get in, and merely reflects the characteristics of the applicant pool as a whole.</p>
<p>The same is roughly true of international recognition -- many admits have international recognition (international x medals and so forth), but that's a reflection of the applicant pool rather than only a selection effect. (I visited Ben a few weeks ago, when they were reading international applicants. He said something to the effect that all of the students from the country he was reading at the time were international medalists.)</p>
<p>"Why would MIT not dare to publish such stuff?"
I agree w/ u they should, but I dont think they dare.
it's like no college dare to publish admissions statistics by race, say, how much it takes for an asian to get in vs a urm sort of thing. They dont' really dare, they should dare, but they dont.</p>
<p>I wonder why?
political correctness?
afraid that some sensitive people would perceive this as MIT implying some races are "better" than other races?
afraid that MIT would be sued by these sensitive racist people. </p>
<p>hmmm and I thought the US is the most tolerant country in the world</p>
<p>PS: no offense for "sensitive people"</p>
<p>well it's like a medical report stating eastern asians have different brains and therefore are the smartest.
many sensitive people are against that report. </p>
<p>But i dont understand why....if race can indicate physical strength (east asians are physically one of the weakest group of people), and people can accept that, why can't people accept mental strength?</p>
<p>(btw, that wasn't an example, there was an actual report saying Eastern Asian being the smartest group of people in the world overall average)
and plz dont any ignorant people try to give some extreme examples (i know an eastern asian who's dumb sorta illogical and weak comments)</p>
<p>but yeah, life is unfar, and things often aren't how they seem they are.
just like college claim theyr primary purpose is to educate youth :-P</p>
<p>Still, it doesn't matter what the stats of the admitted students are -- the stats of the admitted students reflect the pools they come from. </p>
<p>If you look at the overall SAT admission stats for MIT (these</a>), you'll see that MIT selects only weakly for SAT scores -- the high scores of admits are a reflection of the high scores of applicants. The admit pool and the applicant pool are quite similar in terms of SAT scores. MIT says that SAT scores are only looked at cursorily, and the admissions statistics support that idea.</p>
<p>So that information is not useful, because SAT scores are not the primary criterion that MIT uses to select its freshman class.</p>
<p>yes mollie i agree, SAT scores wouldnt be an indication at all.My freind a three time national olympiadist had only a 700 on the Math. SAT 1 math is ridculous to a certain extent because you have to make 4 mistakes and you are in the 600's. </p>
<p>but what about some of the awards that the admitted students have ? because i know for a fact that myself and two of my freinds all had international awards and all of us got rejected. So, we would like to know what the admitted students had. ?</p>
<p>All that MIT has to do is put up a table with some of the awards these guys came across or indicate the percentage of applicants/admitted who had outstnading achievemnts from each country, Or do it in the blogs.</p>
<p>
but what about some of the awards that the admitted students have ? because i know for a fact that myself and two of my freinds all had international awards and all of us got rejected. So, we would like to know what the admitted students had. ?
</p>
<p>But that's just it. Most international admits have won impressive awards, partly because so many of the international applicants have won impressive awards.</p>
<p>If MIT posted some data about awards won by the admits, you might easily find out that a lot of international admits won awards of the same caliber as you and your friends and others who were rejected. Would you have really learned anything then?</p>
<p>Well, I was rejected as well. While I was devastated since MIT was my dream school, I'd also like to thank the admissions officers that gave so much transparency to the often difficult topic of college admissions. They made me feel at ease about this process, and well, it helped take the sting off of the rejection. And I thank you for that.</p>
<p>I would not want to see MIT publish stats on international awards. To do so is quite possibly to say to all those who haven't won international awards "don't bother applying". And that is the antithesis of what MIT stands for.</p>
<p>Of the last several admits that I have interviewed over the past three years(both international applications and foreign-based Americans), precisely zero of the admitted students have had international awards. However, they matched the Institute very well indeed.</p>
<p>I think that Karthikissmart has fundamentally the wrong approach. He would like statistics to demonstrate how hard it is so as to discourage those who don't stand a chance by wasting their time in applying. If there is one thing that anyone studying MIT admissions can tell you, it is that fundamentally, academic excellence is a necessary but not sufficient qualification for admission.</p>
<p>Given that, publishing statistics on academic excellence are misleading. Everyone is academically excellent, but there is no magic number that will get you in. IF it were so that with four international awards you get in automatically, with three you are guaranteed a spot on the waitlist and with two, no chance, THEN and only then, would there be a value in publishing such numbers. But there is no direct correllation, and therefore, there is no real value in publishing the numbers.</p>
<p>Further, what does an international award mean. Is the Eastern Africa Mathematics prize (which to the best of my knowledge I have just made up) a prestigious award or not? Who knows? I interview several applicants from Africa every year. The structure and the opportunities are different there to that in the US or in Europe (which are of course also quite different). Each application is judged on its merits.</p>
<p>If you are an international applicant and you think you might want to go to MIT, then apply. But don't do so EXPECTING to get in. Given the 4% admit rate in a highly competitive pool, that is just setting yourself up for disappointment.</p>
<p>International applicants may want to read Caltech's discussion boards for an explanation of the typical characteristics found among the international students admitted to Caltech.</p>
<p>Thanks Mikalayle</p>
<p>no offense, but then why publish SAT midranges? no magic number in the SAT can get you in right?........ EXACTLY.
why not the same for the overall accomplishments of admitted students?
please correct me if i am wrong again</p>
<p>That's an easy question. As has been discussed on these forums extensively, there is a wide range of students admitted, with a wide range of academic achievements and opportunities. These can be tricky to compare. How do you measure success in the East African Mathematics competition against the South American Physics contest. It can be very tricky to even identify how prestigious some international awards are.</p>
<p>Gosh, I wish there was one standard taken by everyone. That would be worth publishing. </p>
<p>Hey, there is. Everyone takes the SAT and we can publish statistics
(<a href="http://www.mitadmissions.org/topics/apply/admissions_statistics/index.shtml%5B/url%5D">http://www.mitadmissions.org/topics/apply/admissions_statistics/index.shtml</a>) which show that for example, 24% of admitted students had SAT critical reading scores of 750 or above and 19% had scores of 640 or below. Does this help you in deciding to apply? I am not sure that it helps me.</p>
<p>Everything else is trickier, particularly for international students. For example, in the country in which I live, the secondary school physics curriculum is in many ways different to an American curriculum. What that means is that any student wanting to take the SAT2 in Physics needs to put in the additional work to independently learn the material that might appear on the SAT2, which they did not cover in school. As a result, there tends to be a larger range of SAT2 Physics grades from here. </p>
<p>There is very little that is common to all and is comparable for international students. SAT scores are and they are published. Nothing else really is common, and therefore nothing else is really worth publishing.</p>
<p>"That being said, MIT admits precisely 0% of those who do not apply. If a student feels that they would want to go to MIT and would enjoy the MIT environment, then I strongly encourage them to apply. But they shouldn't underestimate just how hard that 4% is."</p>
<p>Yes, "underestimating" was the mistake that I made. I know I'm quite a smart girl (in the top 2.5% of my country) and thought that I had a chance. I still don't know what I did wrong.</p>