To the parents: What would you tell your child?

Parents Forum
1

<p>I understand that this might not the be right place to make this kind of post, but I am currently at a loss of what to do, so I thought that I could get some advice here, since speaking to students studying with me have been largely unsuccessful. </p>

<p>I’m a college junior majoring in chemistry, with low GPA (3.1 overall, 2.6 with math and science courses). I’m currently working in a lab since summer of freshman year, and this experience has definitely been one of the best things that ever happened to me in college. Since I’ve been feeling discouraged from my low academic performance, learning from lab work is not only enlightening but also makes me feel less of an idiot (at least I can do something right).</p>

<p>Now that I am half way through junior year, I have been hearing a lot more from undergraduates and graduate students, “Look at grad schools! Look at grad schools.” I have been hearing this mantra as early as freshman year, but not surprisingly, it has become more intense now. Accompanying this mantra is, “High GPA! High GPA!” and “Chemistry is not an employable major if you don’t go to grad school.” </p>

<p>I have been well-aware that my low GPA means that fewer doors are opened to me, and I understand that grad school is a far reach. From what I have been told, 3.6 is on the low side of chemistry grad school. However, it is the fact that I have been told, ‘Chemistry major is not employable without grad school’ that has me panicking. </p>

<p>I don’t know what to do. Common sense tells me that I should look for an internship and get some kind of work experience. I have talked to friends about this, and they have a common response: They honestly have no idea what I can do with limited experience and low GPA. Then there is the fact that I have to break the news to my parents that I probably wouldn’t be going to grad school; even though they have told me to aim for an ‘easy’ school (I don’t know what this means, research in grad school is a lot of work and difficult to get funding for). </p>

<p>I am at a loss because grad school is a far reach, and I have been told that employment is also a far reach. Do I apply for internship I am not qualified for and hope for the best? Do I take summer classes and attempt to raise my GPA? Or should I think about changing major even though it is late to do so? What does ‘employable’ even mean?</p>

<p>I feel guilty because I should not be wasting money and drift throughout college feeling lost. I should not be burdening my parents just to go to college when I’m not smart enough to handle it. I don’t want to go home this winter break and tell my parents how badly I have been failing and how I can’t even get my life straight. </p>

<p>I guess my main question after this long post is, “What would you tell your kid, if he or she approaches you and tells you this?”</p>

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<p>Well, I would say you are not alone in feeling the way you do. Many students do not have a strong sense of direction in undergrad. You said, </p>

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<p>You are right. Instead of talking to your friends, make an appointment at the career services office of your college/university and talk to a counselor there. Life is open-ended. In many cases, there is not a clear progression from school to work. You have to build your own bridge. It’s intimidating but it can be done. I don’t recommend graduate school unless you have a clear professional goal that requires it. The good news is that you still have time as a junior to start looking at other options. Have some faith in yourself. Ask yourself why you enjoy working in a lab, and use the career services office to investigate places where you can get the same kinds of gratification. These places may not be in academe.</p>

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<p>All students should start using career services early in their college careers. They have so much to offer you in terms of learning about careers and grad schools; they can connect you to alumni in your field, they post job openings, arrange internships, hold job fairs etc. They provide individual counseling on **your **career path. Please go there and get started!</p>

<p>Also talk to your professors, and other people you know from your lab work.</p>

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<p>Can you continue working at the lab ?</p>

5

<p>I would tell my kid that for a science major who is not destined to get a Ph.D., lab technician jobs are a good short-term solution, but that on a longer-term basis, being a lab technician might eventually become frustrating because opportunities for promotion are limited. </p>

<p>So it would be a good idea to start thinking about long-term options. What can you do with a chemistry major besides becoming a Ph.D. chemist? I don’t have a clue, personally. But the people at your career center do.</p>

<p>I would definitely advise making an appointment with the college’s career center to see what help they can provide. You’re already paying for this service. Milk it for all it’s worth.</p>

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<p>Chemistry majors who don’t become chemist can alway teach. You might explore becoming a science teacher.</p>

7

<p>In addition to talking to career services why not talk to the PI of the lab you are working in?</p>

8

<p>As a former chemistry & biochemistry professor, I don’t think you should feel discouraged at all!! A GPA of 3.1 in a tough major like Chemistry is not so bad, and it is not bad enough to keep you out of graduate programs (you may not get into Harvard or MIT, but there are plenty of strong programs you would get into). Most students who apply to grad school (PhD) in chemistry, molecular biology, etc. do NOT have 4.0 GPAs. The reason is, they are often passionate about some things but not necessarily driving themselves crazy doing everything it takes to get the A like students bound to other types of programs, like med school. It is also NOT like getting into college. It is not a “far reach” – it is doable.</p>

<p>The fact that you love the lab work is HUGE! If you are good at it, it will be more important than you GPA. Seriously, I would rather have a B student who knows their way around the lab than a book-smart A student who can’t figure practical things out for the life of them working in my lab, and I don’t think I’m unique this way by any stretch (ask your professors!). If your supervisor likes your work and writes you a positive letter of recommendation, this can overcome grades! And the letters of recommendation will be the first thing the professors on the graduate admissions committees will look at. It is not at all like applying to college. Every application gets a thorough reading by a committee of professors from the graduate department you are applying to.</p>

<p>If you decide not to go to grad school, or at least not right away, that lab experience can help you get a job for the same reason. If you have a good recommendation, it can go a long way. Also, not having a PhD is NOT the end of the road as far as career goes. I know plenty of people with good jobs in biotech and pharma who do not have PhDs. Some operate at the level of PhDs even though they don’t have them because of their experience. Others have moved into the business end of the business. And yet others are satisfied as as research associates – there is definitely the opportunity for upward mobility.</p>

<p>I would try and network as much as possible – seek out alumni, specifically. So DO NOT be discouraged! Your future is bright.</p>

<p>(And stop feeling guilty about the money. If you go to grad school, your tuition will be paid, and you will get a stipend (living expenses) through grants, teaching assistantships and research assistantships. This is pretty much standard in chemistry PhD programs across the country.)</p>

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<p>I worked with a lot of lab tech chemists when I was working at a research/tech support center. I don’t know what the job market is like now for them. There is also sales for chem suppliers/pharmaceuticals.</p>

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<p>There are jobs out there for lab technicians, and some people are happy with them for the longer term. Other people start in the lab, and move into technical sales, lab administration, etc. And please don’t forget the crying need for competent tech support! Happydad works in biotech, and they are in love with the people who keep their gazillion dollar equipment running.</p>

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<p>If you were my child, the first thing I would ask you is, “What do you like MOST about your lab job?” </p>

<p>Are there chemistry-specific tasks that you enjoy … duties that truly call on your knowledge of your major? Or are there OTHER aspects of the work that please you most … e.g., Do you have to organize co-workers’ equipment or schedules? Do you order supplies? Are you often asked to follow specific instructions and then are praised when you do so? </p>

<p>If it’s the chem-specific component of your work that seems to please you the most, you might consider looking for work as a crime lab analyst. These positions do not require grad school and often go to chem majors and not necessarily forensic science majors. As far as I know, the pay is decent and the work can be interesting. </p>

<p>As you have already been advised, a visit to your college’s career center is a good first step. Ask about crime lab jobs where you’re there, if that appeals to you. If you don’t get any help in that area, do some research on your own.</p>

<p>But if you analyze why your lab work is satisfying to you and you realize that the chemistry-specific part is the least alluring aspect of your current job, then think hard about the aspects of the job that you DO like and perhaps head in another direction. </p>

<p>The book What Color Is Your Parachute?: A Practical Manual for Job-Hunters and Career-Changers has some fun exercises that can help you hone in on the parts of your job that you find most satisfying, if you begin to realize that it may not be the chem itself. </p>

<p>Finally, don’t think of yourself as failing. College is a time of self-discovery, and you are taking a more mature and introspective route than many college students do. It seems like you’ve already gained a lot from your college experience, even if it’s not the high GPA and clear career path that you’d expected.</p>

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<p>Kaimae,</p>

<p>I really feel for you because there’s a lot of pressure now on soon-to-be new graduates with the rough job market. But I think there are SO many place you can look for a job or other types of graduate work that will really value your chemistry background. </p>

<p>If you were my son, I’d first ask you what you really enjoy doing the most or think you would enjoy doing. Do you LOVE working in the lab? Or do you want to work more with people? Are you more analytical or more social? Are you passionate for chemistry still, or are you just finishing the major you started?</p>

<p>I think some areas for consideration might be:</p>

<p>Chemistry teacher - - science teachers are at such a premium. If you go to a private school you could get a job without a degree in education just to see if you like teaching - - and then go back for your MA</p>

<p>Pharmaceuticals - - Pharma sales might be for you if you like people and want to make a high salary. They will value the science background and train you on the rest.</p>

<p>Maybe you’d like a medical career but not a doctor? Research nursing? A Physicians assistant? There are areas of graduate studies that are not PhDs in Chemistry . . .</p>

<p>Food science - Large food companies use chemists - - not sure what the requirements are to be hired there, but I think there are graduate programs that specialize in it . . .</p>

<p>Other types of corporations - - Any corporation with a science bent is going to have jobs that they will want to fill but prefer candidates with a science background. You could get an MBA with your undergrad chem degree, and I think a lot of companies would be interested.</p>

<p>I’m definitely NOT an expert in chemistry at all . . .but I do think that your career services people should be able to guide you in the right direction. I would also suggest signing up with LinkedIn and start making some connections in companies that might be potential places to work or do an internship.</p>

<p>I do feel like my own child could end up in this same situation (he wants to study Chem E, but his science grades in high school are on par with yours) . . .so I’d love to hear what you decide and how things go for you!</p>

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<p>I think you’ve gotten some excellent advice about chemistry. I’d like to add that if you were one of my children I would not recommend changing majors unless you found something else you studied that you are really excited about. Don’t change majors away from something - only do it if you are moving to something that has a reasonable long-term expectation.</p>

<p>There are always project management, client rep and coordinator-type jobs where a field-specific major can be a great asset. If, of course, you have any interest/skills in those areas. I’ve never worked in a lab, but common sense says that for every lab there’s someone who deals with the nuts-and-bolts of keeping it running.</p>

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<p>I completely agree with LBowie!! I would recommend continuing to work in your current lab, possibly working in a different lab or in industry over the summer for more breadth, and decide if laboratory science is what you really want to do. If it is, go ahead and apply to graduate programs while also looking for a 1-2 year technician job. See which pans out for you. Take a job as a technician if you don’t get into a grad program you like. Try to find a tech job in a lab you wouldn’t mind being in for grad school. If you impress the PI, they can help you get into grad school there.
Other options include pharma R&D, corporate safety officer, teacher. Don’t plan to be a lab tech forever; set up a plan for growth.
Good luck! Passion for lab research will ignite your classroom interest, so look for your grades to improve!</p>

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<p>Do you have any interesting in Computer Science?</p>

<p>Have you looked into Cheminformatics?</p>

16

<p>I friend of mine from HS majored in chem then got PhD. Worked for a large chemical company but didn’t like the environment and is now a special agent in the FBI. Seems to love that. There may be forensics etc. typed of paths if that interestes you.</p>

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<p>I have a MS in chemistry, married a chemistry Phd, and worked in pharma for 20+ years. Here’s my advice:</p>

<ol>
<li><p>Don’t go to grad school “just because”. Go to grad school if you love love love chemistry, love being in the lab, and love spending most your time with chemicals and other chemists. Depending on what type of chemistry you like, sometimes the career options are NOT dramatically different based on your degree. (I say this because there aren’t a lot of jobs for organic medicinal chemists right now, be they MS/BS chemists or PhD chemists.) The most successful grad students I knew were those who passionately, fiercely loved everything about chemistry (including chemistry coursework.)</p></li>
<li><p>If you love the lab, stay in the lab - at least until you’re ready to make a career change. Most of the research chemists I know with a BS/MS seriously love doing reactions and being in the lab. </p></li>
<li><p>If you do go to grad school, choose your specialty wisely. Green chemistry, energy-related chemistry, analytical chemistry - these seem pretty safe. Medicinal chemistry - be careful. Many, many thousands of pharma chemistry jobs have disappeared over the past 7-8 years, and they will come back slowly (if at all). </p></li>
<li><p>Pharma sales has also been hit really hard, but other kinds of chemistry-related sales are doing well. I know chemists selling DNA sequencers and chemical instrumentation, and if you have that kind of personality, it can be a great career. </p></li>
<li><p>Your chemistry skills are transferable (I know, I’ve transferred mine several times). Talk to your career office and your placement office for suggestions, and talk with your professors, too. </p></li>
</ol>

<p>You know, I really loved my pharma research career, although I can’t recommend it any more. Good luck in whatever you decide!!</p>

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<p>Most internships won’t look at your transcript. AND, be open to jobs outside your major. Nothing is the end of the world, it might just mean taking a different path. Start looking at internships now and be aggressive to get one. That experience will take you a lot further than the very little you can improve your GPA by over the summer. Plus, people with high GPAs are graduating and not getting jobs because of no work experience.</p>

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<p>Thank you everyone, for the many amazing advice. Reading the different opinions definitely help me put things into perspective. </p>

<p>What I like most about lab work is doing synthesis. It’s the most frustrating but most rewarding part of lab, especially since many of the inorganic synthesis are dependent on impurity so the mechanism are not exactly known, so it’s always a treat when something is done successfully, even if it takes a month, maybe more. But there is also the fact that I am young, so weariness has not settled in? </p>

<p>I have set up an appointment at the career center for next week, and I have started on making a list of summer internships with lab work, especially chemistry and material science related ones. Hopefully I will find more things to put on the list and bring them to the career center next week to discuss. I will also look at jobs over the summer that are not necessarily related to my field of study but I am qualified for, just in case that I can’t get any internships.</p>

<p>I will not be rash and rule out possibilities. I will not rule out grad school yet–I should take classes that are more closely related to my research lab, and then decide from there. </p>

<p>It would be a good idea to look at the chem GRE this winterbreak as well. </p>

<p>Thank you so much, everyone. Reading through everyone’s ideas really motivated me to sit down and think about what I want, and what I need to plan to do.</p>

20

<p>Chemistry major here, albeit from many, many years ago. Here’s what I did:</p>

<p>(1) Went to grad school for my PhD. <em>Hated</em> it. Left after one month.
(2) Did my own part-time freelance work, non-stop: Tutored chemistry to local college students & local highschool students. Ran the general chemistry lab at a local 4-year college.</p>

<p>Had so much part-time work, was scurrying every which way, so I finally…
(3) Applied for and was offered a job as an analytical chemist. It was great work. Stayed there for four years, and wanted to try something else, but everybody said “there are no jobs.”
(4) Networked, applied for and was offered a job as an environmental research chemist. Stayed there for two years, till I got tired of sticking my hands in hazardous waste. Moved to NYC with my boyfriend.
(5) Only chemistry jobs in NYC were actually in NJ, and I didn’t want to move to NYC and commute to NJ. Used my good references and heavy math skills (required for chemistry, no?) and was offered a job in commercial banking.
(6) One of my commercial banking clients liked me so much that she offered me a job as tariff director for an overseas airline. I worked out of a NYC townhouse that Mick Jagger used to own. :-)</p>

<p>Started having babies…moved back to CT.</p>

<p>(7) Stayed home with kids, after a couple of years wanted to return to work. Used my vast analytical experience to tailor my resume, quickly received offer at large insurance company, as a financial analyst for pension clients.
(8) Still moving along, transferred to special underwriting projects. I was making <em>tons</em> of money by the time I left. Retired at age 43, as husband’s business was really starting to take off, and one of us really needed to be home with the kids.</p>

<p>I don’t regret any of it. I had a huge array of experiences, made a lot of money, made a lot of contacts. The trick is to tailor your resume and your “story” so that you emphasize your <em>very</em> transferrable skill set.</p>

<p>Good luck.</p>