Top 10 State Schools.

College Search & Selection
101

<p>"Berkeley is number one, all by itself. The next four; Michigan, UCLA, UVA and UNC.</p>

<p>Exactly.</p>

102

<p>Never understood the UNC, UVA thing. Are either within the top 15 in research? What about NAS members? They seem like very good schools, capitalizing on very selective undergraduate admissions, but over-rated.</p>

103

<p>Penn State is so totally overrated!</p>

<p>CR: 580 average
Math: 630 average
TOTAL: 1210 average</p>

<p>[C</a>. Freshman Admission](<a href=“http://www.budget.psu.edu/CDS/FreshmanAdm.asp?Location=UP&AY=20082009]C”>http://www.budget.psu.edu/CDS/FreshmanAdm.asp?Location=UP&AY=20082009)</p>

<p>While compared to SUNY Geneseo (a real top 10 school with UIUC and others)</p>

<p>CR: 650
Math: 655
TOTAL: 1305</p>

104

<p>In terms of academic prestige, I believe there’s a slight distinction between Berkeley (number 1) and UMich (number 2). There’s another distinction between Michigan (number 2) and UVa (number 3). There’s then a gap between the top three and UCLA (number 4) and so on.</p>

105

<p>mcvcm, SUNY Geneseo, is excellent, but it is tiny and not very well rounded. PSU may not have as high a mean SAT score, although 90 points is negligible, but it is much more well rounded. It has top 20 programs in Engineering and Business and is very strong in several academic disciplines.</p>

106

<p>Rutgers89, Rutgers is definitely not a top 10 school, Rutgers is a top 20 public school but it is no different than schools like Texas A&M, Clemson, Pitt, Maryland etc…</p>

107

<p>

According to the NRC rankings, UNC makes the top 10 public universities list for the strength of its graduate programs. UVA came in slightly behind at #12.</p>

<p>So yes, they’re exceedingly strong research universities.</p>

<p>By another one of my favorite measures, both have produced far more Rhodes scholars than most privates except HYPS and the military academies. They each have around 45, the same as Chicago and Duke (Berkeley has 22).</p>

108

<p>In no particular order:</p>

<p>University of California - Berkeley
University of California - Los Angeles
University of Michigan - Ann Arbor
University of Wisconsin - Madison
University of North Carolina - Chapel Hill
University of Virginia - Charlottesville
University of Illinois - Urbana-Champaign
University of Texas - Austin
University of Washington - Seattle
University of Maryland - College Park</p>

109

<p>The idea of ranking programs for UG (based on what) seems vastly over-rated to me; not to mention how often students change majors.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>According to collegeboard, the difference between PSU (1195) and SUNY Geneseo (1325) was 130 points, not 90 points, but either way I would hardly call 90 points over 7,000 students negligible. Do you think that anyone actually considers the 75 points of median SAT difference between Colgate (1365) and Dartmouth (1440) negligible?</p>

110

<p>

All the more reason to be top-ranked in more academic offerings.</p>

111

<p>

I’m sure William & Mary is great for humanities and social sciences…for science and engineering, not so much. This is the same problem with UVA and UNC. </p>

<p>Berkeley, Michigan, UCLA and Wisconsin offer more breadth and depth.</p>

112

<p>

</p>

<p>They are also much larger, making for a more impersonal experience.</p>

113

<p>I actually found a ranking that’s far more reliable than USNWR’s. It measures the more relevant areas of what academic institutions should be all about, which for me is very fair to huge research-led schools and large state universities. </p>

<p>Criteria:
Academic Peer Assessment;
Employer Assessment (Upper Level Management);
Graduate and Professional School Admissions Officer Assessment;
Quality of Student Body by SAT / SAT II;
Quality of Student Body by GPA / Class Rank;
Resources / Expenditure Per Student;
Graduate /Professional School Attendance;
Wage and Employment;
Number of Applications / Desirability of School </p>

<p>Ranking:

  1. / 17. UC Berkeley
  2. / 20. Michigan
  3. / 21. University of Virginia</p>

<ol>
<li>/ 28. UCLA</li>
<li>/ 46. University of North Carolina</li>
<li>/ 49. William and Mary</li>
<li>/ 50. U.S. Naval Academy</li>
<li>/ 51. U.S. Army Academy (West Point)</li>
<li>/ 54. Wisconsin (Madison)</li>
<li><p>/ 57. University of Texas</p></li>
<li><p>/ 60. UC Irvine</p></li>
<li><p>/ 66. Georgia Tech</p></li>
<li><p>/ 71. Illinois (Urbana)</p></li>
<li><p>/ 72. UC San Diego</p></li>
<li><p>/ 73. UC Davis</p></li>
<li><p>/ 75. University of Florida</p></li>
<li><p>/ 76. UC Santa Barbara</p></li>
<li><p>/ 79. U.S. Air Force Academy</p></li>
<li><p>/ 81. University of Miami (of Ohio)</p></li>
<li><p>/ 82. Penn State</p></li>
<li><p>/ 85. University of Miami</p></li>
<li><p>/ 86. UC Riverside</p></li>
<li><p>/ 90. Queens College, City University of New York </p></li>
<li><p>/ 91. University of Washington</p></li>
<li><p>/ 92. Virginia Military Institute</p></li>
<li><p>/ 97. University of Georgia</p></li>
<li><p>/ 99. Citadel (military college)</p></li>
<li><p>/100. Rutgers (New Brunswick)</p></li>
</ol>

<p><a href=“http://toptiered.com/college-rankings.html[/url]”>http://toptiered.com/college-rankings.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

114

<p>

</p>

<p>Just because they are larger (or large schools) they automatically provide “impersonal experience”. </p>

<p>There are hundreds of ways to make large schools small. There are hundreds of orgs/frats/societies/etc that these students can join in to make their stay in the university small, close-knit and personal. Some students at Harvard are complaining that their school is sometimes impersonal yet Harvard’s undergrad isn’t large by all means.</p>

115

<p>are we just ranking undergrad, grad, or as a whole? i am guessing we are ranking as a whole then…and in that case</p>

<ol>
<li>Berkeley, no doubt about it.</li>
</ol>

116

<p>Actually, I’ve heard UNC’s undergrad Biology/pre-med program is excellent. Although, I haven’t heard much about their engineering school.</p>

117

<p>

Biology is decent (#26 at the grad level), and Carolina is very strong in chemistry (#16 overall, #1 in analytical chem, #10 in inorganic chem). It’s also pretty good at computer science (#20). </p>

<p>Carolina is right up there with Hopkins and Harvard for public health. :)</p>

118

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</p>

<p>That’s because their engineering school is called NC State University. ;)</p>

119

<p>“According to collegeboard, the difference between PSU (1195) and SUNY Geneseo (1325) was 130 points, not 90 points”</p>

<p>Collegeboard is innaccurate…and you know it Gellino. Just yesterday I provided a link to Geneseo’s Data Common Set. The mean SAT at Geneseo is 1305, not 1325. And PSU’s mean is 1200. </p>

<p>“Do you think that anyone actually considers the 75 points of median SAT difference between Colgate (1365) and Dartmouth (1440) negligible?”</p>

<p>Yes, I do. I don’t believe the SAT measures ability as much as it measures familiarity with the test. Schools with higher SAT scores have students that probably prepared harder for the SAT, not necessarily smarter students. The average SAT score at Caltech is 1525. The average SAT score at Princeton is 1480 and at Stanford is 1440. Do you honestly believe that Caltech students are smarter than Princeton or Stanford students? I guess I don’t rank universities according to SAT averages. I would rather rank universities according to faculty excellence (both in the classroom and in the labs) and all-around academic brilliance.</p>

120

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<p>W&M is actually a State University, the “College” part is kept for historical reasons.</p>