<p>“Seiken, you seem to have a lot of time on your hands to post to this message board. Perhaps Mudd isn’t so academically challenging as you claim it is…”</p>
<p>i know this is a joke but let me dispell it anyways…
my workload tonight:
athenaeum lecture at CMC
advanced systems and signals (convolution, etc)
fluid dynamics
engineering seminar
jazz improv
(and i just finished electrical and continuum hw)</p>
<p>so, yeah, let me get to it!</p>
<p>"Besides the differential equation class and my science labs which I have to attend, I have basically stayed home and watched the lecture recordings online. Homework problems are due every two weeks or so on average, which I find surprising because other people have told me about McGill’s workload and competitiveness. My bf at Harvey Mudd had 3-4 times my workload in his first year taking first year classes while I’m in my first year taking 2nd-3rd year classes. " -I3tranger </p>
<p>Well, now I know how little you know about Berkeley – no one, especially those who recruit for engineering, would say that Stanford/Mudd/MIT/Caltech somehow give a more “indepth” education than Berkeley. I mean, come on, everyone knows Berkeley has very hardcore academics on the level of top privates, which is why your assertions absolutely floor me (though considering you attend a LAC, perhaps not so much).</p>
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<p>You seem to have difficulty understanding. I think this: Cal, Stanford, MIT, and Caltech are all first-tier engineering schools; Mudd, though, is the LAC equivalent.</p>
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<p>No txt spk plz.</p>
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<p>And Berkeley matters quite a bit “where it actually counts” (in the same place where Stanford, MIT, and Caltech have weight, and equal weight at that).</p>
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<p>No.</p>
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<p>I believe the average is something like 4.68 (for all of Berkeley).</p>
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<p>You are assuming and obviously haven’t read the entire thread. My point was: if there are any schools to automatically make the top engineering category, they’re going to be MIT, Stanford, Berkeley, and Caltech. Mudd would be in another category: LAC engineering.</p>
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<p>I know what the caliber of Mudd students is. Did I ever say or imply they are subpar? No, I don’t believe so.</p>
<p>Hmmm, LAC engineering. You say that as if it means we learn things differently? Im curious what you know about our curriculum, which includes mandated research, that places us in a differently category of engineering education. Now the US NEWS obviously did it because it, like people who have researched the rankings, know that peer assessment scores themselves are biases toward research-oriented universities with famous grad programs and regional domination. However this does not mean the education is different. We still learn our calculus, we still do research, and we still like to do stuff outside of class. Why do we need to be placed differently?</p>
<p>Though out of curiosity:
What makes Cal-Berkeley engineering better than Cornell and the others? Why does it belong above everything but MSC?</p>
<p>Please describe the breadth and depth of available course offerings at Harvey Mudd College. As compared to Cal- Berkely and Cornell. Also please list the number of professors at Harvey Mudd college, so we can assess the depth of sub-areas in which expertise is liekly to be at hand. Next to a list of that number at Cal-Berkeley and Cornell.</p>
<p>If I decide I am interested in a particular sub-area outside of the mainstream- say, electric power engineering, from the electrical engineering standpoint- how many courses in this sub-area can I take at Harvey Mudd College? At Berkeley? At Cornell?</p>
<p>Mudd doesn’t have as much depth as Cal and Cornell in specific disciplines. That’s not what our education is about. We are classified as a LAC because we have great breadth in the material that we cover in our major, science/math in general, and humanities. Students can specialized in one field of engineering if they wish, but the degree is still going to be “Engineering.” Cornell and Cal have the advantage of being huge and having great depth in engineering disciplines. </p>
<p>required courses (from the mudd engineering site):</p>
<p>design representation
tools
baby stems
experimental engineering
chemical engineering
mechanical engineering
analog
digital
small digital
big stems 1
big stems 2
jr. clinic
clinic II
clinic III
junior seminar
senior seminar</p>
<p>ignore the Xs, they refer to something I dont plan on copy and pasting into format. </p>
<ol>
<li>Introduction to Engineering Design. X X</li>
<li>Design Representation and Realization. 1 credit hour. X X</li>
<li>Introduction to Engineering Systems. X X</li>
<li>Experimental Engineering. X</li>
<li>Chemical and Thermal Processes. X X</li>
<li>Continuum Mechanics. X X</li>
<li>Electronic and Magnetic Circuits and Devices. 2 credit hours. X X</li>
<li>Digital Electronics and Computer Engineering. X X
85A. Digital Electronics. 1.5 credit hours. X X</li>
<li>Materials Engineering. X X
101-102. Advanced Systems Engineering. 3 credit hours per semester. 101 102</li>
<li>Engineering Clinic I. X X
112-113. Engineering Clinic II-III. X X</li>
<li>Engineering Clinic. 1-3 credit hours. X</li>
<li>Project Management. X
121-122. Engineering Seminar. No credit. X X
123-124. Engineering Seminar. No credit. X X</li>
<li>Fluid Mechanics. X</li>
<li>Heat Transfer. X</li>
<li>Engineering Electronics. X</li>
<li>Electronics Laboratory. 1 credit hour. X</li>
<li>Microprocessor-based Systems: Design and Applications. 4 credit
hours.
X</li>
<li>Introduction to Communication and Information Theory. X</li>
<li>Introduction to CMOS VLSI Design. X</li>
<li>Special Topics in Electrical Engineering. X</li>
<li>Dynamics of Elastic Systems. X</li>
<li>Structural Mechanics. X</li>
<li>Practices in Civil Engineering. X
191, 291. Advanced Problems in Engineering. Credit hours to be arranged. X X</li>
<li>Economics of Technical Enterprise. X</li>
<li>Engineering Management. X
203-204. Engineering Clinic IV-V. 6 credit hours per semester. X X</li>
<li>Systems Simulation. X</li>
<li>Optimization Techniques in Engineering Design. X
209, 210. Advanced Problems in Engineering. 1-4 credit hours per semester. X X
8 Engineering Advising Handbook
Courses offered in academic years ending in “odd” numbers (e.g., 2000–01)
FALL SPRING</li>
<li>Chemical Reaction Engineering. X</li>
<li>Advanced Engineering Thermodynamics. X</li>
<li>Introduction to Environmental Engineering. X</li>
<li>Computer Image Processing and Analysis. X</li>
<li>High-Speed PC Board Design. X</li>
<li>Deformation and Fracture of Solids. X
190, 290. Special Topics in Engineering. X</li>
<li>Advanced Structural Dynamics. X
Courses offered in academic years ending in “even” numbers (e.g., 2001–02)
FALL SPRING</li>
<li>Cost Estimation and Modeling. X</li>
<li>Preliminary Design. X</li>
<li>Mass Transfer and Separation Processes. X</li>
<li>Introduction to Biochemical Engineering. X</li>
<li>Introduction to Compressible Flow. X</li>
<li>Engineering Electromagnetics. X</li>
<li>Introduction to Biomedical Engineering. X</li>
<li>Applied Elasticity. X</li>
<li>Numerical Methods in Engineering. X</li>
<li>Manufacturing Principles. X</li>
<li>Advanced Transport Phenomena. X</li>
<li>Experimental Techniques in Dynamics and Vibrations.</li>
</ol>
<p>god i hate PDFs, anyways how many electives do you get to take in addition to the core engineering requirements?
edit - it looks like about 5(max 6 if u do a hum IE) from the sample plan, plus the CLINIC(mudd hires you out to an engineering project and makes you make money from them by making/researching stuff) of which can be specialized to one particular area. </p>
<p>anyways I guess AF answered the question asked in the first part of my previous response (as it stands now), but im still wondering about the other part?</p>
<p>"Mudd doesn’t have as much depth as Cal and Cornell in specific disciplines. That’s not what our education is about. "</p>
<p>Right. That’s its relative shortcoming as an engineering school.</p>
<p>Those other schools (well at least one of them for sure) you can take all the design projects you want, up the wazoo, but you can additionally study virtually anything you want, in as much depth as you can handle.</p>
<p>Exceptional students, with vistas unneccessarily narrowed due to lack of breadth and depth of the program.</p>
<p>You speak of “indepth education” as though Berkeley students learn things differently, no?</p>
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<p>The two types of schools – LAC and large research universities – are drastically different, and this is widely known. Thus, we try to keep them separate. It is not to say that one is better than the other; they are simply different (which is why I’m inclined to put Caltech in the LAC category).</p>
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<p>So do Berkeley engineering students. Is their education not going to be as “indepth” as those of Stanford/MIT/Mudd students, so Berkeley doesn’t deserve a place among the top tier (despite the opinions of various college presidents, rankings, and such)?</p>
<p>You could equally say that the giant research universities have shortcomings in engineering because of higher student:teacher ratios and less attention.</p>
<p>Perhaps that might be true during the first two years of engineering curriculum. However, the class size shrinks as one continues through the curriculum. Also, one will get all the attention he/she needs as long as one makes an effort. You can’t expect to be spoon fed in public schools, but that doesn’t mean that you will get a mediocre attention from your instructors.</p>
Exactly. This is probably what kyledavid meant by LAC Engineering. It is different from the kind of engineering education offered at UCB or Cornell. This is not to say that one is better than the other. Both are excellent but intended for different types of students.</p>
<p>Re: post #95
For comparison, the University of Wisconsin offers the following courses for its undergraduate Chemical and Biological Engineering students:</p>
<p>1 Cooperative Education Program. 1 cr.
211 Chemical Process Thermodynamics. 3 cr.
250 Process Synthesis. 3 cr.
311 Thermodynamics of Mixtures. 3 cr.
320 Introductory Transport Phenomena. (Crosslisted with BME) 4 cr.
324 Transport Phenomena Lab. 2 cr.
326 Momentum and Heat Transfer Operations. 3 cr.
424 Operations and Process Laboratory. 5 cr.
425 Undergraduate Rheology Seminar. (Crosslisted with Chem, EMA, ME) 0-1 cr.
426 Mass Transfer Operations. 3 cr.
430 Chemical Kinetics and Reactor Design. 3 cr.
440 Chemical Engineering Materials. 3 cr.
450 Process Design. 3 cr.
470 Process Dynamics and Control. 3 cr.
510 Introduction to Tissue Engineering. (Crosslisted with BME) 3 cr.
517 Biology in Engineering Seminar. (Crosslisted with BME, BSE) 1 cr.
520 Stem Cell Bioengineering. (Crosslisted with BME) 3 cr.
525 Macromolecular Hydrodynamics. (Crosslisted with ME) 3 cr.
535 Heterogeneous Catalysis: Principles and Applications. 3 cr.
540 Polymer Science and Technology. 3 cr.
541 Plastics and High Polymer Laboratory. 1-3 cr.
544 Processing of Electronic Materials. (Crosslisted with ECE, MS&E) 3 cr.
547 Introduction to Colloid and Interface Science. 3 cr.
555 Seminar—Chemical Engineering Connections. 1 cr.
560 Biochemical Engineering. (Crosslisted with BME) 3 cr.
561 Biomolecular Engineering Laboratory. (Crosslisted with BME) 3 cr.
562 Special Topics in Chemical Engineering. 1-3 cr.
565 Food Process Engineering. (Crosslisted with Food Sci) 3 cr.
567 Solar Energy Technology. (Crosslisted with ME) 3 cr.
599 Special Problems. 1-4 cr.
620 Intermediate Transport Phenomena. 3 cr.
660 Intermediate Problems in Chemical Engineering. 3 cr.
699 Advanced Independent Studies. 1-5 cr.</p>
<p>I am sure similiar courses are available at Cornell and UCB.</p>
<p>Read this over and over. Yes, you’ll probably have better research opportunities at a CalTech or MIT, but as for getting an excellent education and then a job any of these will work, and what you gain from going to a school you like is greater than what you gain from going to a school you dislike but is “a few spots higher.”</p>
<p>To anyone attending or aware of the courses, how would u rate JHU, Darthmouth, Duke? How strong is the electrical and/or computer engineering curriculum at those places?</p>