Of course. No one is saying the OP doesn’t have to write well. The science professors will teach how to write well written lab reports and grade them partially based on how well they’re written. My physical chemistry professor was a stickler for a well written report. He graded them tough and we learned how to write them well. My point is that the OP doesn’t necessarily need lots of humanities class to be able to learn to write well.
I would rather write up 10 college lab reports than have to answer essay questions about Moby Dick like I did in 11th grade. Looking back, as much as I hated it, my 11th grade English class/teacher was invaluable, but I was still happy not to have to repeat the experience in college.
You are entitled to your opinion. College should be about learning and growth and exploration. I understand we all have our strengths and writing is not it for many people.
However, the premise is that the student wants to be a partier, not so much a student, but get the pedigree. In order to survive in life, you need to know how to communicate verbally and on paper.
As a father, businessman, and contributor to society, I found the premise offensive. You clearly disagree and that’s your right.
College should not be a box check. That’s what I read the OP to want.
Yes she’s accomplished a lot but I question if it was all done for the right reasons.
Again, the writing requirement for WUSTL Arts and Science college, assuming applies to A&S there, is still intensive (their words) and very similar to the one posted on Pomona. Their requirements:
" College Writing 1
In Arts & Sciences, we believe that clear thinking happens through clear writing. Regardless of what you ultimately major in or which career path you embark upon, the ability to analyze evidence and to craft clear, compelling arguments will be critical. Your College Writing course, taken your first year, will hone your skills so that you can write effectively for a university audience.
Writing Intensive (WI)
After your first year, you will extend the skills mastered in College Writing 1 through a course designated Writing Intensive. WI courses combine advanced coursework preferably in your major with concentrated attention to writing about your discipline."
Now many students see that description and look forward to it, but that’s not the OP, who I can empathize with, since as a engr major I also wanted to avoid intense writing or a foreign language if I could.
The suggestion by MWolf on public colleges or polytechnic colleges is the best one though the OP would have to take the English requirements for pre-med, but it would not be “intense”.
USC has 2 semesters of writing requirements for everyone (engineering students as well). One semester is taken freshman year and the other semester is taken junior year. It is definitely not an easy class.
I made the same point before ever launching into school-by-school comparisons. All schools that confer the type of “prestige” OP is seeking make heavy demands in terms of writing - both in terms of volume and in terms of the critical thinking demonstrated therein. I merely suggested that if OP were resigned to taking on those demands, then WashU would seem like the best fit within that subset - not because the demands are less, but because other attributes fit the best.
However, I also questioned the whole premise, and suggested that if OP would consider Atlanta for the sake of Emory, why not apply to Georgia Tech, which is comparably prestigious but offers an experience that OP might better appreciate.
But, OP hasn’t responded for almost two weeks, so I think we’re beating a dead horse by ourselves.
Not quite. If OP was to study math (or some science courses) in the UK then he would have no writing requirements whatsoever. But it wouldn’t be a good choice for a pre-med student.
Hello, sorry, I didnt know what to respond with, i was merely watching this very long conversation and didnt want to interrupt because everyone has something valuable and interesting to say! thanks for all your input. I have accepted that all top colleges have a high writing requirement but, again, greatly appreciate everyone’s help.
That’s really a misleading statement, that all prestigious schools make heavy demands of writing. Some prestigious schools do, and guess what some not-so prestigious schools also make heavy demands on writing. There are prestigious schools that make lighter demands than the descriptions given so far.
It would depend on your definition of prestigious but a place like Berkeley and other UCs don’t make that heavy demands on writing. You can get out of a lot of the requirements via tests in high school and/or classes at a community college. You do have to take the seven course requirement for Arts and Science at UCB but there’s a lot of flexibility which you don’t find in other places. OP can get out of freshman writing based on her SAT score, and if she happens to take either of the AP English exams and do well, can get out of the next set of requirements.
The messages are pretty different one on intensity, the other on flexibility.
Again, I am referring to OP’s concept of prestige: elite, private, liberal universities. My point all along has been that OP wants the perceived prestige of this type of school, without really wanting the particular type of rigor that comes with it.
I don’t know why we’re splitting these hairs when we are all basically saying the same thing. OP more highly values the style of education that she would find at the UC’s or at a STEM-prestige school like GT. I am not saying these schools are lesser; quite the opposite. I’m saying OP should value these other definitions of prestige and go for fit.
My words said “the type of prestige OP is seeking” - NOT all schools that should be considered prestigious. I don’t understand why this is turning into a debate.
The OPs list, starting with UCs and ending with CP-SLO, shows that it’s not all small, elite, liberal. That was your definition or concept of prestige and why you kept pushing WashU-Stl.
Are you really implying Berkeley STEM majors are less prestigious than the private colleges you mention and so the OP should expand the definition of prestige to include UCB or GT, what are these other definitions of prestige found at UCB but not at say at a pure prestige place like Emory?
The SAT can only satisfy the entry-level writing requirement, which is a remedial English requirement (i.e. not satisfying it means having to take remedial English courses, or a combined remedial + first semester English course).
Two English composition courses beyond that are required; AP English (either) 4 satisfies one, and AP English literature 5 satisfies both (except for College of Engineering students, who cannot use AP scores to satisfy the second course). English composition courses are offered in various departments with different topics.
Since you asked for recommendations for safety schools:
Auburn University (Honors College)
University of Alabama Honors College–UAlabama offers a major in Educational Neuroscience
Both universities are a bit on the conservative side which matches your preference.
Both universities are likely to offer you very significant merit scholarship awards.
Lots of students in honors will have scored in the 1500s on the SATs.
While these universities may not offer the prestige that your parents are seeking, they will offer to pay for most of your education in the courses/majors that interest you in the type of environment that you prefer.
P.S. The majority of the undergraduate students at the University of Alabama are from out-of-state (non-residents).
Use college to build new strengths in writing. Effective written communication is so important. Most of the jobs of the future haven’t been invented yet, but the ability to write, reason and persuade will always be a highly valued and portable skill that will fuel your advancement.
(And by the way, it’s fewer writing requirements, not “less.” See what I mean?)
I don’t think anyone is saying avoid writing altogether. Just that there more than a few ways to become effective in writing than just Literature type classes. For sure any science major for pre-med will have to take Gen Ed requirements in Humanities, Social Sciences but there will be more flexibility in some colleges in fulfilling them, including when they can be taken. Also there will be writing in stem courses, e.g. lab reports, research papers.