Tough choice--Thomas Jefferson High School

Prep School Admissions
21

<p>Looking into a hazy crystal ball, as it always is, there are four eventualities:</p>

<ol>
<li>You stay put and get into HYPSM.</li>
<li>You apply to TJ and get into HYPSM.</li>
<li>You apply to TJ and do not get into HYPSM.</li>
<li>You stay put and do not get into HYPSM.</li>
</ol>

<p>First two situations have happy endings and I will not discuss them anymore.</p>

<p>Third situation will mean that you took the best opportunity that was given to you and gave it your all, but luck did not side with you. I mean that you should think about putting in two or three times as much effort at TJ as you are doing now despite 3 hours commute and others. No excuses. </p>

<p>But will you ever be able to live down the fourth situation? Will you have regrets rest of your life that you gave up on the best opportunity in your life? It is a very hard thing to live with.</p>

<p>So, my opinion: Do not sell yourself short. Apply, and apply with the conviction that if you are accepted, you will enroll. Line up all the ducks beforehand. Get your parents onboard. Once there, give it your best effort. No doubts or second thoughts. Going to TJ is no guarantee that you will get into HYPSM or be successful in life, but you will always know that you gave it your best effort.</p>

22

<p>Like other magnet schools, TJ is highly highly academic and their admission decisions are mostly based on applicants’ academic records and capabilities (not just grades of course). About 55% of class 2013 are Asians. It is a best place to be trained, sharpened and prepared, but may not be the most <em>efficient</em> way to get into HYP. However, I believe if you can stand out academically, your chances of getting into a school like MIT or Princeton are good. In any case, for sure you’d work a lot harder and deal with more uncertainties. In the end, if a top college is all or mostly all you care about, you’d question whether it’s worth all the trouble and hard work. </p>

<p>On the other hand, what about your current school? Has there been a consistent pattern of top students getting into HYP colleges, or is it like a <em>sporadic</em> occurence? If it’s the former, yes for your purpose, stay put. If the latter, don’t count on it. You may or may not be that <em>lucky</em> one. It’s a common disillusion that if one stays in a less competitive school they’d be the super nova that makes anything happen.</p>

23

<p>Once again, thanks everyone for your insightful comments. </p>

<p>@Periwinkle, I didn’t make just make a blatant assumption; I’ve seen his course work. We are both currently in ‘Chapter 8’. At the very least, it’s very similar, but it’s probably identical. Since my school is relatively close to TJ, we actually borrow some of the curricula from them (like our Comp Sci courses).</p>

<p>@Dakshina: See, I can’t possibly look at it that way. If I get into TJ and attend, it’s not necessarily my ‘best shot’ at getting into a top notch college. Furthermore, if I was rejected from HYPSM while attending TJ, I’d definitely wish that I’d stayed at my current high school. The dilemma is that I’m not sure TJ would actually be my best shot.</p>

<p>@D’yer Maker: I’d definitely relish the opportunity to collaborate with brilliant students, but I’ve got to think towards the future. I don’t treat others as pawns to further my academic career; don’t think that. I’m just worried that, if I attend, I’d squander my dream. You have to understand that I would’ve attended had I been admitted last year. I love a challenge–especially an intellectual one. However, as previously stated, I feel that I’d be at a disadvantage if I attend as a sophomore.</p>

<p>@DAndrew: I don’t think it’s sporadic. Every year, we get a few students with 800s on one or more SAT sections that are admitted to top notch schools. Currently, I know at least five seniors who achieved a 34+ on their ACTs or 2250+ on their SATs. This year, two seniors applied Yale SCEA and both were deferred. However, one got a likely letter to UChicago and the other got a likely to UVA. They’ve both applied to multiple Ivies, though, so don’t write them off just yet. I have a few other senior friends who also received UVA likely letters.</p>

<p>So basically, it’s not the best school, but it’s definitely possible to get into an Ivy as a student here.</p>

24

<p>Oh by the way, many of my doubts stem from personal experiences. For example, my friend, and eight other TJers, applied Dartmouth ED. He had a 2250+ SAT, a 3.8ish unweighted GPA, and great ECs. All nine were outright rejected.</p>

25

<p>Are you happy at your current school? Do you have friends, relationships with teachers, involvement in and outside the school? If yes, stay put. You will be able to create an enriching experience where you are, find mentors, develop individual projects, etc. </p>

<p>I can’t emphasize this enough: Do not underestimate the effects of a 1.5 hour commute EACH WAY. This is draining at the best of times and flat out miserable during the times you’ve had to stay up late studying, taking part in ECs, etc.</p>

26

<p>We’re in noVA too and am very familiar with your dilemma. I have several friends with kids at TJ. They struggle to stay on top at that school and the pressure is extreme. It’s not unusual for students to have 4 hours of sleep some nights during the week! Factoring that into your commute time, and the very real issue with applying to colleges among a pool of other potentially stronger candidates (for UVA, W & M), I would tell you to stay put. If you are already being challenged at your present school, and feel that you are reaching your full potential, then you are already in the right place. Given the fact that you are also able to participate in such significant ECs, this sounds like it really is the right school for you.</p>

27

<p>I thought your goal was to get in the most most selective colleges. If you have an expanded list of acceptable colleges (e.g. ivies + SM), you should know about 1/5-1/4 of the TJ graduating class make their ways to one of those colleges. If you are confident that you’d excel academically, what are you worried about? Check this out: <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/prep-school-admissions/963752-tjhsst-2010-senior-destinations.html?highlight=destination[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/prep-school-admissions/963752-tjhsst-2010-senior-destinations.html?highlight=destination&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>I agree 1.5 hours of travel every day is a bit too much.</p>

28

<p>@StudiousMaximus</p>

<p>I’ve been following this thread with interest. Let me give you a general impression based only on what I’ve read here:</p>

<ol>
<li><p>Stay at your current school and let another kid have the TJH spot. </p></li>
<li><p>Your entry into a top school isn’t guaranteed no matter where you attend high school. It is NOT stats that makes for the student. MIT, for instance, isn’t admitting all top stat students. They’re admitting a range with a host of other qualitative factors beyond grades and scores.</p></li>
</ol>

<p>It’s “attitude” that often makes the difference between two qualified students and I think you’re focused on all the wrong things.</p>

<p>MIT is looking for students who push themselves and who love learning. They’re drawn to imperfect kids who tried versus perfect kids who breezed.</p>

<p>My initial impression is - stats or not - you’re not projecting yourself as an MIT candidate. Instead, it’s coming off as the stereotype of all the students we see who are so focused on “prepping” and “the right channels” that we get no sense they have anything else going.</p>

<p>Stay at your current school and find ways to differentiate yourself in ways beyond your courses. It’s that aspect that will help you, not how much better you can do in a lower performing school.</p>

29

<p>I agree wholeheartedly with Exie’s analysis. Well said!!</p>

<p>6 things that matter:
High standards
Hard work
Initiative
Tenacity
Speed to act
Conviction of belief</p>

30

<p>An education at a school like TJ has its own value regardless its impact to your future college placement, but your concern over your prospective college destination is legitimate too. You need to analyze and set your priorties, bottom lines and compromises to be a winner overall. My suggestion is to look realistically at your current school and TJ and what you’d get from both in relation to your goals. There is no easy way leading to a top college wherever you are (so you need to be the above 6 things anywhere), but make no mistake schools - a public and a private, a private day and a top BS, a public and a magnet - are different in more than one way. If after all this discussion you are convinced that you just need to do “A, B, C, D, E” and it doesn’t matter what school you go to, then this discussion - or shall I say this whole forum - is meaningless. The help you need, I think, is perspectives on which school helps more in achiving your goals, instead of the generic “how to succeed” guide, if I understand it correctly.</p>

31

<p>Go to TJ. Your experience there will be amazing. The school is completely unique as far as high school goes. It is academically better than most colleges (even top tier school), and I’m not exaggerating. If you are at all interested in science, math, or technology you will LOVE your 3 years at Jefferson. I honestly cannot express in words how great this school is. You seem like a smart person; you owe it to yourself to not miss out on this opportunity. </p>

<p>Even if you don’t get into your top choice of college because of the competitive nature of TJ, you can bet that you will still get into a very good school. You will learn more at TJ than you learn in college anyway.</p>

<p>Best of luck, whatever you decide to do.</p>

<p>source- former TJ student</p>

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<p>

To me, this is the absolute dealbreaker. 3 hours on the bus each day? Even if you can study (or sleep) on the bus (which is doubtful), this represents a huge amount of wasted time that you can better use on your academic work, and on ECs. I don’t care how great TJ is, its not worth the many hundreds of hours you will sit on that bus.</p>

33

<p>Thanks, all. It’s been really helpful. So far, it seems to me that the general consensus is to stay put. The dissenting opinions do catch my eye, though. I’ll be sure to update when I decide.</p>

<p>Exie, I thank you for your input. However, it’s not fair for you to assume that I’m ‘not right’, personality/motivation wise, for MIT, or any other school for that matter. I have great passion for science and math. I’m constantly seeking new ways to challenge myself, and I enjoy helping others understand complex concepts. While this statement may seem to push TJ, the curriculum at my high school is just too close to TJ’s to justify transfer (and the commute). Keep in mind, though, that this is only my current opinion. Back to the personality point: I’m not trying to game the system. I’m just asking what high school to choose because I’m at a crossroads. HYPSM acceptance is definitely not the sole criterion in my decision (commute, friends, current curriculum, etc). I taught myself to solve a Rubik’s cube at age 10. I was obsessed with powerful magnets and their properties for about two years. And I’m currently infatuated with medicine. Does this sound like a person interested in academics solely to better their career? I want to get into a select college to further my knowledge, understanding, and opportunity in my fields of choice. Not to have some bumper sticker that makes me look good. Please don’t jump to rash conclusions and envision me as a sly student who seeks advice so he can gain prestige. That isn’t me. I’m just driven, hard working, and ambitious. Just thought I’d clear that up.</p>

34

<p>It sounds like you’re well adjusted at your current school. I debated applying to TJ because science is my favorite, but I decided against it. I knew that I’d spend all day at school and then the transportation would take an hour at least each way. I’m just not up for that… I figure I can stand out at my school, whereas at TJ I’d just be average at best. My old science teacher teaches at TJ, (he was awesome… Graduated from Harvard :3) and I just don’t think I’d fit. Maybe you will though… Personally I’d stay at your school, I mean you’re doing great, so why risk it?</p>

35

<p>//I’m a current TJ student
I think that you should go for it. The people at TJ are great, and just because you stay at your base school, doesn’t mean that being at the top of your class will get you into your dream college. As for your score on the TJ test, the TJ test doesn’t have that much to do with your chances of getting in. It mainly helps decide whether or not you pass the first cut, which you did. The Second cut is heavily based on your essays from the test, your SIS, and your teacher recommendations. You can’t really control what your teachers write about you. They could be a teacher who just puts comments like: good student, good grades, organized, does well on tests, etc., but the admissions offices want to see passion in STEM. It’s a whole lot better to have a teacher rec that has comments like: always thinks outside the box, has his/her own way of reaching an interesting solution, commits to a problem until it’s solved, etc. </p>

<p>And again with the test scores, the TJ test in no way determines your success at TJ. There are kids who come in with 99th percentile scores, but end up having an A-/B+ average, and there are kids who come in with 87th percentile scores and are straight A students.
The bus ride to and from TJ is actually not that bad. It’s a good way to study with friends instead of meeting up outside of school for study groups, and it can also be a good time to relax with friends, or catch up on some sleep. I myself spend approximately 3-3.5 hours getting to and from school each day, but it’s worth it. The environment at TJ is just so different, that it makes school enjoyable, even with all the stress and competition. </p>

<p>At TJ you’ll find passion, and a lot of it. Whether it be for programming languages, or microbial fuel cells, or starcraft, or genetic engineering, or physics, or even music and art. The teachers at TJ are willing to spend time helping you and they will make sure that you are on the path to success. From what I have heard from alumni, TJ is a great foundation for college–similar to prep school, except it’s a public school with a wonderful community. </p>

<p>Just because we’re nerds, doesn’t mean we don’t have fun. We have lots of school spirit because we need somewhere to channel our energy–not only to schoolwork. Homecoming is unique, and I doubt any base school comes close to the spirit displayed by the students and the faculty. J-Day is a great way to end the year, and there is nothing like it. When there are group projects, it’s a blast because you hang out with friends and create something wonderful, and the teachers love it, that’s why they love teaching TJ kids, because we work and produce extraordinary results.</p>

<p>All in all, I would suggest going to TJ. You’ll find that just because you’re a froshmore, you will fit in. This year, there was a froshmore, and I knew lots of people who wanted to meet him because we thought it was so different, but he fit right in. If you have doubts about going to TJ because of a bus ride, then I’m not sure that you have the passion and drive to be able to try and succeed at some place challenging(like an Ivy). If you go to TJ, the rest of your high school life will be hard, but it will be worth it with all the experiences that TJ has to offer.</p>

36

<p>I’m very appreciative of your comments. However, the deadline for the application has passed (June 1st), and I’ve made up my mind.</p>

<p>As for my current situation, I’m doing very well! I’ve maintained my academic performance, and I’m the current class valedictorian. Additionally, I’m starting a Math Competition Club and a Science Olympiad Club for next year. Thanks all for the helpful comments. I’ll be sure to update this come senior spring, and we’ll all see if I made the right choice!</p>

37

<p>Good luck, StudiousMaximus! Please do update next year!</p>

38

<p>Can I ressurect and piggyback on this topic ? I would appreciate anyone chiming in.</p>

<p>My son is starting his 8th grade and he will apply to TJ this fall. Assuming he’s accepted.
We think he has a good chance. He’s great in math and science, speak portugese and spanish fluently, straight A’s, etc. He loves math but I don’t see a passion for science even though he get A’s in Science. BTW, he takes all honors class ofcourse.</p>

<p>However in addition to academics, my son has a passion in wrestling.
He was a State Champ in wrestling in Middle School last year. And ofcourse he wants to wrestle in HS. In fact, he told me he would like to go to Cornell for college and wrestle there. </p>

<p>I know TJ has a wrestling team and had a couple of kids that has done well last year and even placed at State.</p>

<p>But I’m concerned that Wrestling will take a lot of time in addition to school work, etc.</p>

<p>So if he’s accepted for TJ, should he go to TJ or not ?</p>

<p>Same sort of dilemma, if he goes to normal public HS, he will be at top 5% of his class and be in a pretty good wrestling team. But if he goes to TJ, he’ll probably be average and be in not so good wrestling team.</p>

<p>Thanks.</p>

<p>Thx.</p>

39

<p>Go ahead and apply. The application process is very helpful. You can decide when/if he gets in.</p>

40

<p>I really think your son should definitely apply to tj and should he get in, should consider attending. as a recent graduate, I can vouch for the fact the tj not only provides an unbeatable high school education, but also a stimulating and accepting environment for learning. your son will be studying with the top students in northern Virginia and with some really outstanding math and science teachers.
in terms of wrestling, tj has a strong program. participating in a sport will teach your son time management - as a 3 sport athlete, I found I was much more productive in season when compared to out of season.
In response to your concern over your sons lack of interest in science, middle school science is often very general. At tj your son will have the opportunity to explore science in depth from DNA science to artificial computer intelligence, from quantum physics to robotics. He’ll have the chance to take classes that are offered no where else in the area. And of math continues to be his passion, tj has advanced math courses usually only offered at the college level that are simply unavailable at other high schools. Even in the lower level classes he’ll be taking freshmen and sophomore years, he will be taking them at much higher levels than most high schools. I know the original poster did not see much difference in his courses versus tj courses (which may be true), but in general tj math and science classes go faster and more in depth than most other schools. All in all, apply! You lose nothing by doing it and if your son gets in, congrats to him and e should definitely consider it. If not, it sounds like he’ll do great at his base school.</p>